British Expats

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-   -   Post EU Referendum (https://britishexpats.com/forum/take-outside-67/post-eu-referendum-879308/)

Novocastrian Mar 22nd 2017 9:43 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
Yet another oops!

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...e-major-routes

Fredbargate Mar 22nd 2017 9:45 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by InVinoVeritas (Post 12210128)
And now for something completely different...

There seems to be a very wide gap between the EU and the UK on the Brexit "settlement" which the EU has suggested is in the order of €60 billion and the UK suggests should be more like €3 billion.

Without wanting another Brexit vs Remainer feud, I would be interested to know your views on this.

The EU have said the UK should pay its share of commitments/budgets which were agreed whilst the UK was an EU member but which are for a period after the UK has ceased to be an EU member.

This is likely to go to the Hague to be resolved so I assume it is not clearly laid down in any treaty.

The questions which come to my mind are:-

Are these future costs irrevocable or can they be cancelled/revised?

Will the UK benefit from this spend after it has left the EU?

How does this compare with a married couple divorcing when there are, more or less pressing, up-coming expenses related to home and family?

I would query whether there were any terms advocating leaving penalties in the original agreement when the UK joined the Common Market.?

Or have these terms suddenly appeared since June 24th last?

Novocastrian Mar 22nd 2017 9:46 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by InVinoVeritas (Post 12210158)
Love it :goodpost:

Each of whom want alimony.

EMR Mar 22nd 2017 9:56 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Fredbargate (Post 12210163)
I would query whether there were any terms advocating leaving penalties in the original agreement when the UK joined the Common Market.?

Or have these terms suddenly appeared since June 24th last?

Fred, there have been a number of treaties since 1974, time moves on.

Dick Dasterdly Mar 22nd 2017 10:02 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
Leave.EU

"Fritz and the Frogs won't feel the same way, but on this side of the Channel, ministers are 'relaxed' about leaving the EU without a trade deal.

And why shouldn't they be?

Deal or no deal, a high level of access to the single market is guaranteed thanks to existing WTO membership, EU import duties are among the world's lowest and without the heavy strings of a free trade agreement the UK government will have more freedom to support its own industry."

:cool:

InVinoVeritas Mar 22nd 2017 10:03 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Fredbargate (Post 12210163)
I would query whether there were any terms advocating leaving penalties in the original agreement when the UK joined the Common Market.?

Or have these terms suddenly appeared since June 24th last?

I don't recall it ever being mentioned in the run up to the referendum but I do remember Hollande saying the UK needed to be punished for leaving the EU. This "exit tax" then started being discussed but I am maybe interpreting this incorrecly.

Assanah Mar 22nd 2017 10:10 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Dick Dasterdly (Post 12210184)
Leave.EU

"Fritz and the Frogs won't feel the same way, but on this side of the Channel, ministers are 'relaxed' about leaving the EU without a trade deal.

And why shouldn't they be?

Deal or no deal, a high level of access to the single market is guaranteed thanks to existing WTO membership, EU import duties are among the world's lowest and without the heavy strings of a free trade agreement the UK government will have more freedom to support its own industry."

:cool:

You still don't seem to understand that customs are not the major issue in international trade. Do wake up please.

Scamp Mar 22nd 2017 10:15 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by InVinoVeritas (Post 12210185)
I don't recall it ever being mentioned in the run up to the referendum but I do remember Hollande saying the UK needed to be punished for leaving the EU. This "exit tax" then started being discussed but I am maybe interpreting this incorrecly.

I guess if you gave someone 100 quid to build a new shed and the next week he said he was disappearing and taking the shed with him, you might be a bit annoyed at having dished out the cash for no long term relationship reward.

GeniB Mar 22nd 2017 10:26 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
Well we have had the second visit from the Ambassador to Portugal Talking to a room of selected Brit Ex-pats.. she could tell us...nothing!! How embarrassing for her and all other British ambassadors cruising the world at the moment trying to explain the inexplicable.

British citizens needed to know highly important consequences for them of Brexit.. YET here we were almost one year later and the powers that be still cannot articulate a coherent plan. Lots of empty words like' we still value our citizens abroad,we respect that they made life changing decisions on our commitment to the EU.We accept that we have gone back on that deal.... YET...?
She could not say whether we would be deported as none EU citizens should the Brits insist on not receiving any more EU citizens themselves (It would naturally be reciprical for ALL EU members)
She could not say if our pension rights would be protected or would the uk impose the rule they imposed on Ex-Pats who emigrated to Australia NZ etc which would mean a none index linked pension (different to those who came to work in the EU and NOT emigrate )
She could not say what the Customs Union would mean to those of us traveling as none EU members

In other words we are left as much in the dark as we were almost a year ago.
There were moments when I wanted to express my annoyance at the exclusion of our voices in the referendum ,which had been whitewashed away with the excuse of lack of time (not true) and followed by the rather insincere sounding (not from the Ambassador I hasten to add ,she has done a sterling job in these difficult circumstances) promise by the prime minister to reinstate the right to vote for life for all British citizens. some time vaguely in the future. She assured us that we were very important to the UK.. sure we are.

Red Eric Mar 22nd 2017 10:29 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by InVinoVeritas (Post 12210185)
...I do remember Hollande saying the UK needed to be punished for leaving the EU.

I don't. The words published in the English press were "a threat, a risk, a price". Not the same thing as needing a punishment.

Red Eric Mar 22nd 2017 10:35 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 
UK must retain link with European Court of Justice, say MPs

Oooh err!

That's not going to go down well.

Garbatellamike Mar 22nd 2017 10:38 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Red Eric (Post 12210196)
I don't. The words published in the English press were "a threat, a risk, a price". Not the same thing as needing a punishment.

I think you are right Comrade Eric - he said something like "the UK must pay a heavy price" as well as the "there must be a threat, a risk, a price" bit.

How a heavy price differs from a punishment is perhaps a semantic point but punishment is not what he actually said as I recall it.

Red Eric Mar 22nd 2017 10:48 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Garbatellamike (Post 12210203)
I think you are right Comrade Eric - he said something like "the UK must pay a heavy price" as well as the "there must be a threat, a risk, a price" bit.

How a heavy price differs from a punishment is perhaps a semantic point but punishment is not what he actually said as I recall it.

Doesn't semantics concern the meaning of words? There can be a price (or even a heavy price) associated with joining or leaving something without it necessarily being anything of a punishment.

One might need to make an allowance for a slightly casual useage or translation. I don't know whether what Hollande said was particularly carefully prepared or translated - just mentioning it as a possibility.

People these days tend to latch on to comparatively minor details and then use them ad infinitum as proof positive of one thing or another.

Fredbargate Mar 22nd 2017 10:48 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by EMR (Post 12210174)
Fred, there have been a number of treaties since 1974, time moves on.

Would you care to expand on that?

In particular which are relevant to my question including the relevant clauses.

Fredbargate Mar 22nd 2017 10:51 am

Re: Post EU Referendum
 

Originally Posted by Scamp (Post 12210189)
I guess if you gave someone 100 quid to build a new shed and the next week he said he was disappearing and taking the shed with him, you might be a bit annoyed at having dished out the cash for no long term relationship reward.

But the UK is not taking the shed.

They have paid a lot in that the other members have spent and will retain.


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