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Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Old Mar 7th 2019, 6:35 pm
  #7576  
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Annetje View Post
Maybe this article will explain the difficulties a bit, even though I think it has been posted before here.

https://www.theguardian.com/business...ini-britain-eu

But on average, just 41% of the parts used in a car assembled in the UK are actually produced in the country.Bosses in the automotive industry are not just concerned about the impact of tariffs on vehicles made in the UK that are sold abroad, but on the parts used to make them, and whether they will still be able to move parts across the Channel quickly and affordably.
Looks like an environmental disaster really doesn't it - all those miles.

I imagine the boats, trains & trucks will travel at the same speed as before, the UK can ensure the inbound loads are not held up, so it will just be the truculent French putting some flies in the soup.

Unless of course we agree an FTA, in which case there will be no change at all.
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Old Mar 7th 2019, 6:41 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by EMR View Post
" Let them eat grass" , you should have that tattooed on your forehead.
These are the same people , the same income groups, the Jams as they are referred to today who you want to turn into their US contemporaries.
Overweight in poor health thanks to eating the same poor quality . food you want to import from the US..
625million precooked chickens bought in the US every year just part of that market for cheap foods.
Even Cape is not so dim as to think that a market of this size can be supplied using the same health and welfare standards we have in the UK....
Come on now, this is a stretch. The reasons for poor dietary behavior in the US (aka, obesity) are numerous and complex, and to infer that a trade agreement with the US will drive the UK down the same dietary path as the US is just crazy. Just how does the availability of 625 million pre-cooked chickens bear any relevance to dietary behavior? A pre-cooked chicken (roasted) is a fantastic source of nutrition. If you want to worry about something, worry about fried chicken parts...
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Old Mar 7th 2019, 6:45 pm
  #7578  
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Steerpike View Post
I can't speak for Paulry, but my opinion - as an expat never likely to return to UK - is that I want the best for my family in the UK - mum, brother, nieces, grand-nieces/nephews, etc. That's why I'm interested in the topic - for their sakes. They ALL voted Brexit and they all reassured me on their last visit that they have not changed their minds. My mum and brother are on the 'less educated' side of things, but my two nieces are both well educated (with one being an economist), and they have no concerns going forward.
You can make this kind of 'it will blow over' argument for anything. Perhaps if your family were likely to be directly affected, and valued their EU identity and rights you would think differently.
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Old Mar 7th 2019, 6:48 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Cape Blue View Post
I'm pleased you picked up on that, and people wonder why I criticise the Guardian - since the vote we've seen an additional 238,000 net EU migrants - or to use the BSI unit of measurement - 1.5 Oxfords.
Not me - I know very well why you criticise The Guardian.

Interesting aspect, though, isn't it? Immigration continues apace yet approval ratings for EU workers shoots up. On the give-the-people-what-they-want-o-meter, knocking on for 70% is quite compelling. I wonder if a let-up in the relentless bombardment of anti-immigration propaganda has anything to do with it? Maybe there'll be a study about it sometime - I'll keep an eye out.

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Old Mar 7th 2019, 6:49 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
...
It's interesting that as surveillance technology (Facebook, Google, etc) spreads, invisibly, into our lives, it's the EU and not the US that is intent on protecting citizen's rights.

...
The EU is certainly rushing to 'do something' about privacy; but the current 'copyright' law the EU is pushing is likely going to backfire - https://qz.com/1564495/the-eu-copyri...ech-companies/ (QZ is a well-respected source of analysis). And what has the current 'cookie' privacy law done for me? Now, every (European) site I visit makes me click a button to accept the use of cookies ... what a complete waste of time (like in California, every single store has a display telling me that I may be breathing in toxic chemicals (Prop 65) - about as useful as a 'contents hot' warning on a cup of coffee). Ther's a LOT that needs to be done about FB and others in regards to privacy, but the EU's current efforts don't fill me with hope.
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Old Mar 7th 2019, 7:05 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Cape Blue View Post
Looks like an environmental disaster really doesn't it - all those miles.

I imagine the boats, trains & trucks will travel at the same speed as before, the UK can ensure the inbound loads are not held up, so it will just be the truculent French putting some flies in the soup.

Unless of course we agree an FTA, in which case there will be no change at all.
Ah yes, your ''uncontrolled taking back control'' of your borders dream.
If the negotiations for a FTA go as smooth as the Brexit ones, the UK is not there yet.
No doubt you see the whole car business at 0 % tariffs ?
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Old Mar 7th 2019, 7:14 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
You can make this kind of 'it will blow over' argument for anything. Perhaps if your family were likely to be directly affected, and valued their EU identity and rights you would think differently.
Well I can say, with complete certainty, that they see no value in having an 'EU identity', and they don't see value in any 'EU rights' either. My brother (and mum) are at the 'lower end' of the economic spectrum and are presumably therefore quite vulnerable. They are not concerned.
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Old Mar 7th 2019, 7:30 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Shard View Post
You can make this kind of 'it will blow over' argument for anything. Perhaps if your family were likely to be directly affected, and valued their EU identity and rights you would think differently.
Shard.
I wonder how US Citizens would feel if their Govt arbitrarily stripped them of their Citizenship (via a process the majority of expats were disenfranchised from but which affects them directly), reducing them not only to subjects but rejected out of hand any alternatives whatever. I think we all know the answer from what we've seen in the US.
It makes me so very, very angry.
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Old Mar 7th 2019, 7:46 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by old.sparkles View Post
I've deleted most of your post, and I suspect that the theme is a topic for a different discussion, but are just wanted to highlight your calculations. Are there really 16 imperial pints in a US Gallon, and subsequently 9.08 litres?

Using an online calculator, I get approx 3.79 litres to a US gallon, or 6.66 pints which is a considerable difference.
Originally Posted by Steerpike View Post
OMG I got my numbers crossed! Thanks for catching that! It's been a while since I bothered to convert units.

I was thinking fluid ounces to the pint ... there are 16 US fluid ounces to the US pint, and 20 imperial fluid ounces to the imperial pint. (there's also a small difference between US fl oz and imperial fl oz but not a big difference).

There are 8 pints to the gallon (us and uk). Thus, a US pint and a US gallon are smaller than their UK/imperial counterparts (by a ratio of 16:20)

Let me re-run the calculations

My sincere apologies; it was not my intention to mislead. Don't even know yet whether my mistake helps or hinders my argument !!
OK - I decided I'd better double-, triple-check my numbers before following up. The upshot of it all is, I was wrong about the UK prices for milk - by a long shot. UK milk, both regular and organic, is almost half the price of US milk. The 'organic' markup factor seems about the same in both countries; a factor of 1.4 to 1.6 higher for organic vs regular. My analysis of Chicken didn't change, and it seems organic chicken in the US is cheaper than organic chicken in the UK. So I remain convinced that the importation of cheap US chicken into the UK should have little impact on the local chicken market, and should have no impact on the availability of higher quality chicken should people want to avoid the evil American stuff.
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Old Mar 7th 2019, 8:16 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Steerpike View Post
The EU is certainly rushing to 'do something' about privacy; but the current 'copyright' law the EU is pushing is likely going to backfire - https://qz.com/1564495/the-eu-copyri...ech-companies/ (QZ is a well-respected source of analysis). And what has the current 'cookie' privacy law done for me? Now, every (European) site I visit makes me click a button to accept the use of cookies ... what a complete waste of time (like in California, every single store has a display telling me that I may be breathing in toxic chemicals (Prop 65) - about as useful as a 'contents hot' warning on a cup of coffee). Ther's a LOT that needs to be done about FB and others in regards to privacy, but the EU's current efforts don't fill me with hope.
I certainly agree about the cookie thing being a supreme annoyance and waste of time. However, I think there are more aspects of regulation and rights to data, and rights to be forgotten which make the EU stance progressive.
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Old Mar 7th 2019, 8:16 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Cape Blue View Post
And this Mini car will be even cheaper to buy on the continent - perhaps BMW will need to move more car production to the UK.
Pity all that cheap food you have set your heart on will now be unaffordable with rampant inflation due to the further fall in sterling.
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Old Mar 7th 2019, 8:20 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Steerpike View Post
Well I can say, with complete certainty, that they see no value in having an 'EU identity', and they don't see value in any 'EU rights' either. My brother (and mum) are at the 'lower end' of the economic spectrum and are presumably therefore quite vulnerable. They are not concerned.
My rights/identity comment was more aimed at the economist in the family. I accept that ''lower end of the spectrum" folk do not identify with the EU nor, unfortunately, recognize the value they derive from being within it.
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Old Mar 7th 2019, 8:24 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Annetje View Post
Ah yes, your ''uncontrolled taking back control'' of your borders dream.
If the negotiations for a FTA go as smooth as the Brexit ones, the UK is not there yet.
No doubt you see the whole car business at 0 % tariffs ?
Yup.

Whatever FTA the UK and EU agree is cannot, de facto, be as free as EU membership. The EU has spelt this out time and again from the start. Despite what cake-eaters-keepers like Boris insists. Fantasy for the masses. Just a shame they will blame the EU for playing unfairly when reality strikes.
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Old Mar 7th 2019, 8:31 pm
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Steerpike View Post
I can't speak for Paulry, but my opinion - as an expat never likely to return to UK - is that I want the best for my family in the UK - mum, brother, nieces, grand-nieces/nephews, etc. That's why I'm interested in the topic - for their sakes. They ALL voted Brexit and they all reassured me on my last visit that they have not changed their minds. My mum and brother are on the 'less educated' side of things, but my two nieces are both well educated (with one being an economist), and they have no concerns going forward.
This pretty much sums my position up too, almost everyone I know in the UK voted leave. I certainly don't regard them all as uneducated, perhaps it's just more about circumstances.
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Old Mar 7th 2019, 8:33 pm
  #7590  
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Default Re: Politics of Chequers, No Deal, etc

Originally Posted by Steerpike View Post
Come on now, this is a stretch. The reasons for poor dietary behavior in the US (aka, obesity) are numerous and complex, and to infer that a trade agreement with the US will drive the UK down the same dietary path as the US is just crazy. Just how does the availability of 625 million pre-cooked chickens bear any relevance to dietary behavior? A pre-cooked chicken (roasted) is a fantastic source of nutrition. If you want to worry about something, worry about fried chicken parts...
Really, have you been to Wal-Mart and seen the various coatings etc you can have on your pre cooked chicken and there is enough fat on them to grease a cross channel swimmer..
I will stick with my free range Sainsbury's west country chicken..

Last edited by EMR; Mar 7th 2019 at 9:13 pm.
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