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Las Vegas shooting

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Old Oct 2nd 2017, 11:12 pm
  #121  
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
In no particular order.


1. Remove most types of weapons from sale. Hunting rifles and shotguns, may be allowed. Period.

2. Stop funding dirt cheap weapons by providing public subsidies to weapons manufacturers. You can buy a deadly weapon for peanuts.

3. Tax the shit out of the ones that are sold and use the funds for economic development and education in poor areas.

4. Uniform licensing laws, tough ones, across all states, for hunting rifles/shotguns.

5. Remove the self defence myth and the idea that differences are settled by weapons. No walking around armed, concealed or not.

6. No leaving weapons lying around. Your hunting weapon is in a locked cabinet, unloaded, except when you are actually hunting.

7. No guns in Walmart, etc. Specialist stores capable of managing the licensing only and heavily supervised.

8. If you own a hunting weapon, register it and reregister it regularly to prove you still have it. Inconvenient? Don't care.

9. Buy back program.

10. Manage customs and imports.Nothing but the allowed types get in.

11. Not complying? You are breaking the law - you will not be glorified, you will be arrested.

That should get us started.Problems? Of course. But it beats praying and saying we can't do anything.
This is a good list.

What is a hunting rifle, though? Do you mean bolt action?
The kind of thing you'd see in on safari? The reason I ask is that a lot of things with guns are cosmetic. A Ruger Mini-14 has a wooden stock. Looks like a "hunting rifle". If you swap out the wooden stock, and put in a plastic stock with a pistol grip, it's suddenly a scary looking black "assault weapon".
It's the same gun.

Anyway, you mention hunting a few times. I'm not being facetious when I point out the Second Amendment doesn't mention anything about hunting. The reason I bring it up is because the people who tend to think like me (obviously I'm compensating for a small penis, apparently...) genuinely believe the state shouldn't have a monopoly on force. No doubt I'll get the argument the 2nd is archaic, and a people's militia would be crushed by a modern military etc. But that's by the by. I'm just telling you what people like me tend to think, and how this resonates with us.

It seems like Lion in Winter is essentially advocating a British style model of regulation and licensing.

The buy back thing kind of worked in Australia, but people weren't compensated fully.
With gun bans - which don't pass the ex post facto test - the toothpaste is already out of the cat. It can't be put back in. Criminals will always get their hands on these things.
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Old Oct 2nd 2017, 11:14 pm
  #122  
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

Originally Posted by DaveLovesDee View Post
Fair enough. I doubt you'll be going postal though.... If the company was giving away illegal magazines, shouldn't they have been prosecuted?

Mind you, the Las Vegas guy wasn't flagged either.
They weren't illegal at the time - it was about a month before the law went into effect. It was kind of a F U to the Democrats who subsequently lost their seats.
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Old Oct 2nd 2017, 11:21 pm
  #123  
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

I was thinking of getting one of these decals for my car.



Obviously, it's a parody of the Gadsden/Don't tread on me flag.
I just like the goofiness of it (with the simple, idiotic font, and childlike drawing). Love memes like this.

But then I thought, people might misunderstand. They might think I'm mocking or ridiculing fellow libertarians.
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Old Oct 3rd 2017, 12:29 am
  #124  
 
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

Originally Posted by Octang Frye View Post
This is a good list.

What is a hunting rifle, though? Do you mean bolt action?
The kind of thing you'd see in on safari? The reason I ask is that a lot of things with guns are cosmetic. A Ruger Mini-14 has a wooden stock. Looks like a "hunting rifle". If you swap out the wooden stock, and put in a plastic stock with a pistol grip, it's suddenly a scary looking black "assault weapon".
It's the same gun.

Anyway, you mention hunting a few times. I'm not being facetious when I point out the Second Amendment doesn't mention anything about hunting. The reason I bring it up is because the people who tend to think like me (obviously I'm compensating for a small penis, apparently...) genuinely believe the state shouldn't have a monopoly on force. No doubt I'll get the argument the 2nd is archaic, and a people's militia would be crushed by a modern military etc. But that's by the by. I'm just telling you what people like me tend to think, and how this resonates with us.

It seems like Lion in Winter is essentially advocating a British style model of regulation and licensing.

The buy back thing kind of worked in Australia, but people weren't compensated fully.
With gun bans - which don't pass the ex post facto test - the toothpaste is already out of the cat. It can't be put back in. Criminals will always get their hands on these things.
I don't know about gun types, sorry. But I do know that nobody needs a gun that can hit 600 people in a few minutes, and likewise most developed countries seem to get by just fine without handguns. Are they fun to have for sport? Possibly, but as I said in an earlier post, this country has demonstrated repeatedly that it cannot handle the availability of such weapons - the price, the death toll, the ruined lives, all too high.

With all due respect I don't care that much about that famous amendment (too many dead people in its wake) and the argument that we need these guns to defend ourselves against the state is well outdated. A)the British government isn't coming for you any more and b) if in some wild circumstance the US state wanted to come for you there is no way that random people with their guns could make any dent at all against the uniformed forces of the state. And if you point your gun at an individual officer of the state s/he will kill you, game over. It's a specious argument that does not stack up very high against the piles of dead children and family members and others who were loved. If you want to resist the state, use the courts of law, strikes, civil disobedience, like any civilized country.

Last edited by Lion in Winter; Oct 3rd 2017 at 12:33 am.
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Old Oct 3rd 2017, 2:19 am
  #125  
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting


Diane Diane, we will never forget you.

Clueless.
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Old Oct 3rd 2017, 2:42 am
  #126  
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

Bitchy remarks and gun pedantry isn't sexy. At all.
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Old Oct 3rd 2017, 2:44 am
  #127  
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

Originally Posted by Leslie View Post
Bitchy remarks and gun pedantry isn't sexy. At all.

Absolutely.
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Old Oct 3rd 2017, 4:20 am
  #128  
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

Originally Posted by Hiro11 View Post
I'll say again that mass shooting are relatively rare (when compared to other US gun violence) and are not the real problem here. Mass shootings are tragic but largely a red herring.

On the other hand, I 100% agree that gun violence is an American cultural problem as much (or more) than it is a gun control issue. I would also stress that the culture of gun violence isn't equally spread across the US, it's highly localized. Unless we address these local culture issues, nothing is going to change.
Perhaps not as rare as you think, given the definition is 4 or more killed or injured - Mass Shootings | Gun Violence Archive

Think the count is around 270 mass shootings so far in 2017

(although as you say, relative to all gun crime it's still small - some of the maps on the site linked and other stats are even worse )
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Old Oct 3rd 2017, 4:38 am
  #129  
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

It will be interesting to see where this creep acquired a fully automatic. My bet is at a gun show. Gun shows were abolished in L.A County after it was discovered that guns had been sold illegally.... but I might add it didn't stop the shootings. I think Obama tried to get a law passed that would have required gun sales at these shows to be under the same laws as those of gun retail stores but it never got anywhere in Congress...why am I not surprised !

Years ago I attended one or two of these gun shows. A lot of vintage military equipment on display and silly old pot bellied twats dressed up as soldiers carrying rifles. Others were dressed in a motley collection of old uniforms from other countries including one character wearing a black SS uniform complete with swastika arm band and jack boots. It was an insult to every old vet who fought for this country against scumbags who wore that same uniform.

As I already said my bets are on Paddock having acquired the weapon used in the shooting at a gun show. It may have been semi-automatic when he bought it but there are many gun experts at these shows who could have converted it to full automatic for a price

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Old Oct 3rd 2017, 5:42 am
  #130  
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

Originally Posted by Hiro11 View Post
I'll say again that mass shooting are relatively rare (when compared to other US gun violence) and are not the real problem here. Mass shootings are tragic but largely a red herring.

On the other hand, I 100% agree that gun violence is an American cultural problem as much (or more) than it is a gun control issue. I would also stress that the culture of gun violence isn't equally spread across the US, it's highly localized. Unless we address these local culture issues, nothing is going to change.
It's almost as if you are saying that mass shootings aren't that much of a problem because they're not significant compared to other gun violence. Is that what you meant?

Do you agree that America has a serious problem with gun violence - worse than any other country in the world by a country mile?

If so, simple question, what is the reason for that?
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Old Oct 3rd 2017, 5:44 am
  #131  
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

I know in my State same rules apply to Shows as Shops.

YMMV.
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Old Oct 3rd 2017, 5:47 am
  #132  
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

Originally Posted by Boiler View Post
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mxtu228bYFw

Diane Diane, we will never forget you.

Clueless.
Clueless is the person who can't even get her name right.
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Old Oct 3rd 2017, 8:11 am
  #133  
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

Originally Posted by Octang Frye View Post
This is a good list.

What is a hunting rifle, though? Do you mean bolt action?
The kind of thing you'd see in on safari? The reason I ask is that a lot of things with guns are cosmetic. A Ruger Mini-14 has a wooden stock. Looks like a "hunting rifle". If you swap out the wooden stock, and put in a plastic stock with a pistol grip, it's suddenly a scary looking black "assault weapon".
It's the same gun.

Anyway, you mention hunting a few times. I'm not being facetious when I point out the Second Amendment doesn't mention anything about hunting. The reason I bring it up is because the people who tend to think like me (obviously I'm compensating for a small penis, apparently...) genuinely believe the state shouldn't have a monopoly on force. No doubt I'll get the argument the 2nd is archaic, and a people's militia would be crushed by a modern military etc. But that's by the by. I'm just telling you what people like me tend to think, and how this resonates with us.

It seems like Lion in Winter is essentially advocating a British style model of regulation and licensing.

The buy back thing kind of worked in Australia, but people weren't compensated fully.
With gun bans - which don't pass the ex post facto test - the toothpaste is already out of the cat. It can't be put back in. Criminals will always get their hands on these things.
How many of these mass killings were carried out by criminals.
The UK acted after two such incidents and bought in what some call dracononian gun control laws and it worked.
I know it's a different culture but we still have our nutters who would use guns if they could get hold of them.
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Old Oct 3rd 2017, 11:01 am
  #134  
 
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

Gun homicides per day, taking population size into account - the others don't even come close. The US population and culture simply can't handle these weapons - that is an apparent fact. What sort of "freedom" continually attempts to justify this bloodbath?

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/14/u...ent-world.html
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Old Oct 3rd 2017, 11:16 am
  #135  
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Default Re: Las Vegas shooting

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
Gun homicides per day, taking population size into account - the others don't even come close. The US population and culture simply can't handle these weapons - that is an apparent fact. What sort of "freedom" continually attempts to justify this bloodbath?

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/14/u...ent-world.html
America is obviously OK with that level of deaths whereas the rest of us are not.
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