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It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Old Apr 20th 2013, 3:24 am
  #136  
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

There is a suggestion that the real reason Obama is pissed is that he wanted it to fail in the House, not the Senate.
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Old Apr 20th 2013, 4:04 am
  #137  
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Originally Posted by Boiler View Post
There is a suggestion that the real reason Obama is pissed is that he wanted it to fail in the House, not the Senate.
Exactly, he was desiring to blame R's for it's failure when he could not even get all D's on his side.
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Old Apr 20th 2013, 5:41 am
  #138  
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Originally Posted by SATX John View Post
To keep his A+ rating with the NRA? while also covering his buttocks.

He also was to the one who required a 60 vote threshold. He runs the senate rules.... Research Cloture, it is not required on all legislation and was a product of .... wait for it .... a democrat.

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Governm...re-on-gun-bill
Do you understand why Reid asked for the cloture vote
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Old Apr 20th 2013, 6:13 am
  #139  
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Originally Posted by SATX John View Post
Exactly, he was desiring to blame R's for it's failure when he could not even get all D's on his side.
Even if all Dems had supported it it would have failed in the Senate. As it is, over 90% of Dems supported it and over 90% of Repubs opposed so it's pretty clear why the vote didn't garner the 60 needed.
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Old Apr 20th 2013, 6:47 pm
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Originally Posted by Giantaxe View Post
Do you understand why Reid asked for the cloture vote
Yes read the article, Harry Reid set the 60 vote threshold.

Originally Posted by Giantaxe View Post
Even if all Dems had supported it it would have failed in the Senate. As it is, over 90% of Dems supported it and over 90% of Repubs opposed so it's pretty clear why the vote didn't garner the 60 needed.
Again, who makes the rules in the Senate. Sen Cornyn's expanded CHL Bill got more votes than the gun control legislation.

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Old Apr 20th 2013, 10:10 pm
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Originally Posted by SATX John View Post
Yes read the article, Harry Reid set the 60 vote threshold.
You claimed you understood cloture. Clearly you don't. Reid called a cloture vote because three Republicans indicated that they would filibuster to prevent the legislation even coming to the floor. the cloture vote- which imposed the 60 vote threshold - was the only way the legislation could even come to the floor.

Originally Posted by SATX John View Post
Again, who makes the rules in the Senate. Sen Cornyn's expanded CHL Bill got more votes than the gun control legislation.
The rules have been made by both parties over time. There was an attempt - which failed - by the Democrats before this session to reform the filibuster rules.
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Old Apr 20th 2013, 11:11 pm
  #142  
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Filibuster was particularly heavily used by Democratic Senators from Southern states to block civil rights legislation.

This was when it used to be 2/3rds.

Finley, Keith M. (2008). Delaying the Dream: Southern Senators and the Fight Against Civil Rights, 1938–1965. Making the modern South. Baton Rouge: Louisiana State University Press. ISBN 978-0-8071-3345-3.
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Old Apr 20th 2013, 11:18 pm
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Originally Posted by Boiler View Post
Filibuster was particularly heavily used by Democratic Senators from Southern states to block civil rights legislation.

This was when it used to be 2/3rds.

Finley, Keith M. (2008). Delaying the Dream: Southern Senators and the Fight Against Civil Rights, 1938–1965. Making the modern South. Baton Rouge: Louisiana State University Press. ISBN 978-0-8071-3345-3.
A good point... thank goodness Lyndon Johnson faced them down and got his legislation passed. Strom Thurmond and Robery Byrd were a couple of racists who had long careers in the Senate, more's the pity.
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Old Apr 21st 2013, 3:27 am
  #144  
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Originally Posted by Giantaxe View Post
You claimed you understood cloture. Clearly you don't.
John isn't very smart. But you already knew that.

It's guys like him who have led me to support handgun controls. People that dim shouldn't own guns. If he can't be expected to understand even the simplest of concepts, then he can't be trusted with something as lethal as a gun.
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Old Apr 21st 2013, 3:33 am
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Originally Posted by RoadWarriorFromLP View Post
It's guys like him who have led me to support handgun controls.
What controls are these?
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Old Apr 21st 2013, 7:31 pm
  #146  
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Originally Posted by Giantaxe View Post
You claimed you understood cloture. Clearly you don't. Reid called a cloture vote because three Republicans indicated that they would filibuster to prevent the legislation even coming to the floor. the cloture vote- which imposed the 60 vote threshold - was the only way the legislation could even come to the floor.

The rules have been made by both parties over time. There was an attempt - which failed - by the Democrats before this session to reform the filibuster rules.
He would have been better letting them Filibuster is my point, to fix blame on one party. Who was on board with the filibuster it was speculated but not attempted? Any legislation coming to floor than was known to fail serves what purpose? and any legislation that the House is not on board with for that matter. Many more reason factor in also, for a simple majority vote.

BTW the filibuster reform attempt was defeated by a bi-partisan coalition also, including Chuck Shumer and Carl Levin.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/0...n_3104519.html

Originally Posted by Giantaxe View Post
A good point... thank goodness Lyndon Johnson faced them down and got his legislation passed. Strom Thurmond and Robery Byrd were a couple of racists who had long careers in the Senate, more's the pity.
LBJ dem with a ton of dirt on everyone. Many speculate that JFK could not have gotten the Civil Rights Act passed, only his legacy and LBJs dirt on everyone allowed that to happen. Although many domestic good deeds were done by LBJ, he had more than a few skeletons in his closet, not to mention deepening our involvement in Vietnam.

Byrd Dem, Thurmond Dem until 1964. Funny how many Dems have racist histories.

LBJ got stuff done through engaging Congress, not Campaigning to the media, just saying.
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Old Apr 21st 2013, 11:46 pm
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Originally Posted by SATX John View Post
He would have been better letting them Filibuster is my point, to fix blame on one party.
Which would have been rightly dismissed as a cynical attempt to place blame. As it was the vote on background checks fell short by six votes (five, if you discount Reid). Given that a number of votes ran scared of NRA bullying at the last minute, there was a small chance of getting it past.
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Old Apr 22nd 2013, 12:59 am
  #148  
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Originally Posted by Giantaxe View Post
Which would have been rightly dismissed as a cynical attempt to place blame. As it was the vote on background checks fell short by six votes (five, if you discount Reid). Given that a number of votes ran scared of NRA bullying at the last minute, there was a small chance of getting it past.
And that solved or attempted to solve what? Political stunt? Probably.

BTW Cornyn's expanded CHL amendment got more votes than the background check.

Makes you wonder..... who is really pulling the strings.

Also, Reid keeps his A+ rating from the NRA by voting no... Just Saying
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Old Apr 22nd 2013, 1:03 am
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

Originally Posted by SATX John View Post
Also, Reid keeps his A+ rating from the NRA by voting no... Just Saying
According to this - posted last December - Reid has a "B" rating from the NRA:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...-in-one-chart/
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Old Apr 22nd 2013, 12:41 pm
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Default Re: It's not just about guns, it's about the person holding the weapon

And again. Five more.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-22105916
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