BREXIT...what possibly could go wrong?
#496
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Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 191












Don't forget, the UK had experiences a huge increase in public sector jobs with the then Labour government using it to buy votes as they did with the instance access to the UK for the newly arrived countries.
No small part of the latter was T Blair wanting to look the "good European" to bolster his hopes of becoming the EU President.

#497

UK Police Officer
Police constables: £19,971 - £23,124 (minimum) depending on skills and experience - £38,382 (maximum)
So a EU national or non EU national if qualified CANNOT be paid less as the rate is set and its a public sector job.
On September 15, 2017, the Department of Labor published a notice in the Federal Register to announce that, beginning January 1, 2018, the Executive Order 13658 minimum wage rate is increased to $10.35 per hour (82 FR 43408).Jan 8, 2018.
So if I was a car wash operator even though the minimum wage is 10.35 I bet I could find workers willing to do it for less.
Police constables: £19,971 - £23,124 (minimum) depending on skills and experience - £38,382 (maximum)
So a EU national or non EU national if qualified CANNOT be paid less as the rate is set and its a public sector job.
On September 15, 2017, the Department of Labor published a notice in the Federal Register to announce that, beginning January 1, 2018, the Executive Order 13658 minimum wage rate is increased to $10.35 per hour (82 FR 43408).Jan 8, 2018.
So if I was a car wash operator even though the minimum wage is 10.35 I bet I could find workers willing to do it for less.
If, because of a surplus of labour, they can find plenty of workers at £19,971 they do not have to pay more.
The surplus of labour ensures the pay rate for new recruits stay at the bottom of the band. It also ensures that the band ceiling does not need to rise as much as it would otherwise need to - i.e. the £23,124 does not need to go up much as they already have no problem getting new recruits.

#498

I wonder how much responsibility immigrants have to shoulder for this sort of thing :
DPD to offer couriers sick pay and abolish fines after driver's death
DPD to offer couriers sick pay and abolish fines after driver's death

#499
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Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 191












How do employment statistics compare over your ten year period?
They seem to have risen by over 2,500,000!
So, "those who still have a job" must be the norm rather than the exception.

#500
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 26,724












The UK has record numbers in work and unemployment at least a million lower than your figure.
All this during our years of EU membership and high net immigration.

#502
So long...










Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 22,572












Public sector services and jobs have been cut in the name of austerity, and the users of these services are struggling.

#503

And you're contradicting Cape Blue, who claims that all the new jobs created are a direct result of mass-uncontrolled immigration of unskilled non-contributors generating more jobs for other immigrants to fill.


#504
So long...










Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 22,572












Bear in mind that this report is from 2010.
A decade ago, there were 5,221,000 public sector employees. In 2009, there were 6,070,000 – an increase of 849,000.
At the same time, the total number of private sector jobs went up from 21,895,000 to 22,806,000 – a jump of 911,000.
The figures are pretty similar, but suggest just under half (849,000) of the additional 1.8m jobs were in the public sector, rather than – as the PM said – over half. However, he did give himself a bit of wriggle room, by saying the jobs were “associated in some way with public spending” rather than exclusively those on the public payroll.
So how do these public sector jobs break down? Unsuprisingly, those working in government departments, agencies and quangos are counted as part of the public sector workforce, as are teachers, police, NHS workers and the armed forces. But universities and further education colleges aren’t classified as public sector jobs; an ONS spokesman did not know why.
The big state total, does, however, include companies controlled by the government, such as Royal Mail and London Underground. These get more than half of their income from consumers rather than the public purse. The BBC and Channel 4 are also classed as adding to the public sector workforce – and in the past couple of years, employees from nationalised banks such as Lloyds TSB and Bradford & Bingley have swelled the headcount.
At the same time, the total number of private sector jobs went up from 21,895,000 to 22,806,000 – a jump of 911,000.
The figures are pretty similar, but suggest just under half (849,000) of the additional 1.8m jobs were in the public sector, rather than – as the PM said – over half. However, he did give himself a bit of wriggle room, by saying the jobs were “associated in some way with public spending” rather than exclusively those on the public payroll.
So how do these public sector jobs break down? Unsuprisingly, those working in government departments, agencies and quangos are counted as part of the public sector workforce, as are teachers, police, NHS workers and the armed forces. But universities and further education colleges aren’t classified as public sector jobs; an ONS spokesman did not know why.
The big state total, does, however, include companies controlled by the government, such as Royal Mail and London Underground. These get more than half of their income from consumers rather than the public purse. The BBC and Channel 4 are also classed as adding to the public sector workforce – and in the past couple of years, employees from nationalised banks such as Lloyds TSB and Bradford & Bingley have swelled the headcount.

#505

Channel 4 Fact Check: How many public sector jobs did Labour create?
Bear in mind that this report is from 2010.
Bear in mind that this report is from 2010.
It was the allegations of the motive of attempting to buy Labour votes from those people that I'm contesting.

#506
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Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 191












But the quote you highlighted specifically referred to public sector workers and their wages in that sector over a 10 year period.
And you're contradicting Cape Blue, who claims that all the new jobs created are a direct result of mass-uncontrolled immigration of unskilled non-contributors generating more jobs for other immigrants to fill.
Have you any evidence for either of those assertions? I would have thought them the oddest things for anybody, of any political persuasion, to actually give any credence to, let alone politicians themselves.
And you're contradicting Cape Blue, who claims that all the new jobs created are a direct result of mass-uncontrolled immigration of unskilled non-contributors generating more jobs for other immigrants to fill.

The assertions about Labour hoping to buy votes through increased public sector jobs and uncontrolled immigration (there was a third one that I can't immediately recall) were common knowledge at the time. Look at the numbers quoted by DaveLovesDee where it shows public sector jobs rose by 16% whilst private sector ones only rose by 4%.

#507

I merely look at that in reverse and see that the reason we need more migration is to service the migrants that came before.

#508

Actually, I suppose I'm being a bit presumptuous here in assuming you know the purpose of parentheses in a sentence.
Oh, well, that clears it up completely then. Thanks very much.

Can I just clarify one point for you, though. Citizens of member states of the EU don't get votes in UK general elections, so even if they were daft enough to want to vote on the basis of who "let them in", they couldn't have voted for a Labour government anyway.

#509

Proponents of mass immigration use the lump of labour fallacy argument to show that each immigrant doesn't "take" a British job, because their very presence in the UK also creates another one.
I merely look at that in reverse and see that the reason we need more migration is to service the migrants that came before.
I merely look at that in reverse and see that the reason we need more migration is to service the migrants that came before.
I'll remind him again if he doesn't.

#510
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Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 191












And?
Actually, I suppose I'm being a bit presumptuous here in assuming you know the purpose of parentheses in a sentence.
Ahhh, the assertions were common knowledge. OK, then, I see now. And your memory's a bit hazy about another assertion.
Oh, well, that clears it up completely then. Thanks very much.
Can I just clarify one point for you, though. Citizens of member states of the EU don't get votes in UK general elections, so even if they were daft enough to want to vote on the basis of who "let them in", they couldn't have voted for a Labour government anyway.
Actually, I suppose I'm being a bit presumptuous here in assuming you know the purpose of parentheses in a sentence.
Ahhh, the assertions were common knowledge. OK, then, I see now. And your memory's a bit hazy about another assertion.
Oh, well, that clears it up completely then. Thanks very much.

Can I just clarify one point for you, though. Citizens of member states of the EU don't get votes in UK general elections, so even if they were daft enough to want to vote on the basis of who "let them in", they couldn't have voted for a Labour government anyway.
As for the EU citizens, they do get to vote in local elections which are still very important to Labour at a constituency level and, of course, Irish, Cyprus, Malta and many qualifying Commonwealth country citizens get to vote in general elections.
I'll dig out some more background when I get chance but we are heading for the airport first thing tomorrow so you might start with https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...r-adviser.html to get a flavour for the vindictiveness of that Labour administration.
No comment about the 16%/4% split in public/private job creation under Labour?
