Go Back  British Expats > General > Take it Outside!
Reload this Page >

Brexit changes

Brexit changes

Old Jan 2nd 2021, 1:07 pm
  #31  
BE Enthusiast
 
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 427
GeneralPowerpoint has a reputation beyond reputeGeneralPowerpoint has a reputation beyond reputeGeneralPowerpoint has a reputation beyond reputeGeneralPowerpoint has a reputation beyond reputeGeneralPowerpoint has a reputation beyond reputeGeneralPowerpoint has a reputation beyond reputeGeneralPowerpoint has a reputation beyond reputeGeneralPowerpoint has a reputation beyond reputeGeneralPowerpoint has a reputation beyond reputeGeneralPowerpoint has a reputation beyond reputeGeneralPowerpoint has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by dave_j View Post
As I've mentioned before, there's been a lot of 'It'll be a disaster' whinging on here.
But for those with ambition, they won't have time to moan, they've already be beavering away for some time to understand what's happened and where opportunities have appeared, because there'll always be those who're too lazy, too feckless, too busy and too time constrained to get it right themselves.
Change always provides openings for the opportunist, the bright, the would be consultant and the energetic.
You won't find these saying 'it'll be a disaster'.

Why couldn’t Leave voters get it right when we were part of the EU? We’re they too feckless and lazy to see the opportunities we enjoyed while part of the EU?

GeneralPowerpoint is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 1:30 pm
  #32  
Concierge
Thread Starter
 
mikelincs's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2006
Location: ex ex-pat, in Taunton
Posts: 24,478
mikelincs has a reputation beyond reputemikelincs has a reputation beyond reputemikelincs has a reputation beyond reputemikelincs has a reputation beyond reputemikelincs has a reputation beyond reputemikelincs has a reputation beyond reputemikelincs has a reputation beyond reputemikelincs has a reputation beyond reputemikelincs has a reputation beyond reputemikelincs has a reputation beyond reputemikelincs has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by GeneralPowerpoint View Post
Why couldn’t Leave voters get it right when we were part of the EU? We’re they too feckless and lazy to see the opportunities we enjoyed while part of the EU?
Basically they were brainwashed by a media onslaught about the dangers that immigrants created with crime and taking British jobs, jobs tha tthe british wouldn't do in any case, there was also the huge impact the lie of £350 million a week for the NHS created. MSM, including the BBC were in a big part responsible, as the owners, and the major donors to the Tory party could see a lot of money to be made, and later the desire to be gone before the new tax rules came in, which would have affected them to a large degree.
mikelincs is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 1:41 pm
  #33  
 
Lion in Winter's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: City of Broad Shoulders
Posts: 60,624
Lion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by dave_j View Post
As I've mentioned before, there's been a lot of 'It'll be a disaster' whinging on here.
But for those with ambition, they won't have time to moan, they've already be beavering away for some time to understand what's happened and where opportunities have appeared, because there'll always be those who're too lazy, too feckless, too busy and too time constrained to get it right themselves.
Change always provides openings for the opportunist, the bright, the would be consultant and the energetic.
You won't find these saying 'it'll be a disaster'.
This might be true if the starting line of the race were in the same place for everyone, but it is not. The kinds of changes that Brexit brings are mostly likely to present opportunities for those operating at the highest levels of trade, business, and finance who have the flexibility and oppportunity to make money out of any situation at all, irrespective of its effects on anyone else.

To claim that the people now struggling in the depths of deprivation and all the negative fallout from that which makes others write them off as "the undeserving poor", sometimes now for generations, have the same opportunities, is, frankly, nonsense. You may not care about them, but they affect both our society and our economy.

Nobody has been able to explain in any specific way what the benefits or opportunities of leaving the EU will be, not only to people in desperate situations, but just to normal working people. Some have claimed that wages for the low income will go up because there will be fewer immigrants. This is wishful thinking, as though business won't adapt and find sources of cheap labour elsewhere if it has to, or have their friends in Westminster open the doors even wider to non EU immigrants. Other than this, specific claims for benefits to the gen pop = 0.

Simply to state that change always brings opportunities adds nothing. Opportunities for whom, and to do what? When in business or anywhere else do you take a course of action because somebody says "Go on, do it, it'll be good I promise you." Do you not ask for proof and do a careful analysis? Most likely outcome is that it will be ok for the haves and the same shit for the have-nots.

This is, of course, addressing mostly the money side of things. We have lost our place and our role in the European project - that will not be replaced.

Last edited by Lion in Winter; Jan 2nd 2021 at 1:45 pm.
Lion in Winter is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 2:26 pm
  #34  
Concierge
 
spouse of scouse's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2013
Location: Western Australia
Posts: 17,666
spouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
This might be true if the starting line of the race were in the same place for everyone, but it is not. The kinds of changes that Brexit brings are mostly likely to present opportunities for those operating at the highest levels of trade, business, and finance who have the flexibility and oppportunity to make money out of any situation at all, irrespective of its effects on anyone else.

To claim that the people now struggling in the depths of deprivation and all the negative fallout from that which makes others write them off as "the undeserving poor", sometimes now for generations, have the same opportunities, is, frankly, nonsense. You may not care about them, but they affect both our society and our economy.
Thanks for this post LiW, a much needed counter-argument to the idea that anyone and everyone, no matter what their circumstances, has the same opportunity to secure a decent education, livelihood and life - all they have to do is stop being so lazy, or useless, or busy.

spouse of scouse is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 2:34 pm
  #35  
Lost in BE Cyberspace
 
Joined: Jul 2016
Posts: 6,339
morpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond reputemorpeth has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
This might be true if the starting line of the race were in the same place for everyone, but it is not. The kinds of changes that Brexit brings are mostly likely to present opportunities for those operating at the highest levels of trade, business, and finance who have the flexibility and oppportunity to make money out of any situation at all, irrespective of its effects on anyone else.

To claim that the people now struggling in the depths of deprivation and all the negative fallout from that which makes others write them off as "the undeserving poor", sometimes now for generations, have the same opportunities, is, frankly, nonsense. You may not care about them, but they affect both our society and our economy.

Nobody has been able to explain in any specific way what the benefits or opportunities of leaving the EU will be, not only to people in desperate situations, but just to normal working people. Some have claimed that wages for the low income will go up because there will be fewer immigrants. This is wishful thinking, as though business won't adapt and find sources of cheap labour elsewhere if it has to, or have their friends in Westminster open the doors even wider to non EU immigrants. Other than this, specific claims for benefits to the gen pop = 0.

Simply to state that change always brings opportunities adds nothing. Opportunities for whom, and to do what? When in business or anywhere else do you take a course of action because somebody says "Go on, do it, it'll be good I promise you." Do you not ask for proof and do a careful analysis? Most likely outcome is that it will be ok for the haves and the same shit for the have-nots.

This is, of course, addressing mostly the money side of things. We have lost our place and our role in the European project - that will not be replaced.
I think you present a definite possibility that big business may put pressure on the government to open the doors to more immigrants/migrants from outside the EU- I can just imagine that those Brexit voters who believed Brexit would reduce the number of immigrants, and some specifically non EU migrants, will react to that. I do think that ending FOM does have the potential to help in a few low income sectors- but I think it is scarcely believable ( at least in the Northeast) that people who are on benefits or low wage occupations will have enough money to move, the desire to do some jobs immigrants do- and even they do, those employers wil have to pay significantly more not just wages, but dealing with the work habits and demands of British employees.
morpeth is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 2:37 pm
  #36  
 
Lion in Winter's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: City of Broad Shoulders
Posts: 60,624
Lion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by spouse of scouse View Post
Thanks for this post LiW, a much needed counter-argument to the idea that anyone and everyone, no matter what their circumstances, has the same opportunity to secure a decent education, livelihood and life - all they have to do is stop being so lazy, or useless, or busy.
It's very Victorian.

I was talking with a branch of my charity near your old stomping grounds - St Helens, Wirral. The levels of long-term deprivation in the area are astounding for a wealthy, developed country.

This give a hint at it for the whole area.

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news...iving-16281046

I wonder what "opportunities" brexit will bring them.
Lion in Winter is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 2:47 pm
  #37  
 
Lion in Winter's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: City of Broad Shoulders
Posts: 60,624
Lion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by morpeth View Post
I think you present a definite possibility that big business may put pressure on the government to open the doors to more immigrants/migrants from outside the EU- I can just imagine that those Brexit voters who believed Brexit would reduce the number of immigrants, and some specifically non EU migrants, will react to that. I do think that ending FOM does have the potential to help in a few low income sectors- but I think it is scarcely believable ( at least in the Northeast) that people who are on benefits or low wage occupations will have enough money to move, the desire to do some jobs immigrants do- and even they do, those employers wil have to pay significantly more not just wages, but dealing with the work habits and demands of British employees.
The number of non-EU immigrants has already soared, so even if one assumes (fairly big assumption) that the law of supply and demand would be allowed to operate unfettered even without them, there is more than enough labour to go around and it's not shrinking.

"From May 2020."Net migration to the UK from countries outside the European Union has risen to its highest level for 45 years, the Office for National Statistics says.

Figures show an estimated 282,000 more non-EU citizens came to the UK than left in 2019, the highest since the information was first gathered in 1975."

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics...ed%20in%201975.

And immigrants or not, none of that would address the multi-faceted and deep-seated problems now embedded in so many communities in the UK. What will brexit accomplish here? Nothing.

Last edited by Lion in Winter; Jan 2nd 2021 at 2:50 pm.
Lion in Winter is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 3:38 pm
  #38  
Concierge
 
spouse of scouse's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2013
Location: Western Australia
Posts: 17,666
spouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond reputespouse of scouse has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
It's very Victorian.

I was talking with a branch of my charity near your old stomping grounds - St Helens, Wirral. The levels of long-term deprivation in the area are astounding for a wealthy, developed country.

This give a hint at it for the whole area.

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news...iving-16281046

I wonder what "opportunities" brexit will bring them.
I wouldn't be surprised if the whole Brexit thing has passed by unnoticed for most people living in poverty - a few more pressing things to think about.

A reversal of austerity measures would go some way to help (although isn't the whole answer). Local council budgets cut by 40%, libraries, sports clubs, youth clubs closed, Sure Start gutted, school budgets losing 8% of their funding, services that teachers relied on to help their most vulnerable pupils gone, a minimum of 5 weeks (often more) delay before Universal Credit is paid, a two child cap on child benefit, zero hours contracts - I could go on but you know what I mean better than anyone.



spouse of scouse is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 4:14 pm
  #39  
Listen to the Music
 
dave_j's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Location: Fraser Valley BC
Posts: 2,911
dave_j has a reputation beyond reputedave_j has a reputation beyond reputedave_j has a reputation beyond reputedave_j has a reputation beyond reputedave_j has a reputation beyond reputedave_j has a reputation beyond reputedave_j has a reputation beyond reputedave_j has a reputation beyond reputedave_j has a reputation beyond reputedave_j has a reputation beyond reputedave_j has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
This might be true if the starting line of the race were in the same place for everyone, but it is not. The kinds of changes that Brexit brings are mostly likely to present opportunities for those operating at the highest levels of trade, business, and finance who have the flexibility and oppportunity to make money out of any situation at all, irrespective of its effects on anyone else.
To claim that the people now struggling in the depths of deprivation and all the negative fallout from that which makes others write them off as "the undeserving poor", sometimes now for generations, have the same opportunities, is, frankly, nonsense. You may not care about them, but they affect both our society and our economy.
Nobody has been able to explain in any specific way what the benefits or opportunities of leaving the EU will be, not only to people in desperate situations, but just to normal working people. Some have claimed that wages for the low income will go up because there will be fewer immigrants. This is wishful thinking, as though business won't adapt and find sources of cheap labour elsewhere if it has to, or have their friends in Westminster open the doors even wider to non EU immigrants. Other than this, specific claims for benefits to the gen pop = 0.
Simply to state that change always brings opportunities adds nothing. Opportunities for whom, and to do what? When in business or anywhere else do you take a course of action because somebody says "Go on, do it, it'll be good I promise you." Do you not ask for proof and do a careful analysis? Most likely outcome is that it will be ok for the haves and the same shit for the have-nots.
This is, of course, addressing mostly the money side of things. We have lost our place and our role in the European project - that will not be replaced.
The general tenor of this, and many other posts, suggesting that I'm heartless etc. requires a comment.
For most, the advent of brexit will mean very little. Their lives won't be affected much at all and their lives in the UK will carry on much as if little had happened, other than the immediate covid challenge of course.
My comments were intended for posters here, on this site, those who see nothing but gloom ahead.
You posters aren't typical, most have decided to up roots and go to live elsewhere. Most will be familiar with everyday overseas travel, overseas work and the challenges that these present. It's to these posters who complain at every opportunity about the inconveniences that brexit brings, it was to these posters that I was directing my post.
If anyone should see opportunities that brexit generates it should be you, but apparently rather than seek them out and exploit them you're content to sit back and hark back to the days when times were different.
Well times have changed, things are different so make the most of it, you have the experience that gives you a good start, exploit it because without doubt others will.

dave_j is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 4:18 pm
  #40  
 
Lion in Winter's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: City of Broad Shoulders
Posts: 60,624
Lion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by spouse of scouse View Post
I wouldn't be surprised if the whole Brexit thing has passed by unnoticed for most people living in poverty - a few more pressing things to think about.

A reversal of austerity measures would go some way to help (although isn't the whole answer). Local council budgets cut by 40%, libraries, sports clubs, youth clubs closed, Sure Start gutted, school budgets losing 8% of their funding, services that teachers relied on to help their most vulnerable pupils gone, a minimum of 5 weeks (often more) delay before Universal Credit is paid, a two child cap on child benefit, zero hours contracts - I could go on but you know what I mean better than anyone.

70% average national cut in youth services within the last decade. Much higher in some places.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/...-than-a-decade

That's youth clubs, mental health support, employment readiness, support for children in care, mentoring for kids, alternative education, a safe place to go when your street isn't, and more.

What outcome did anyone expect? Will these people be ready to enter investment banking or international trade?
Lion in Winter is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 4:18 pm
  #41  
Banned
 
Joined: Nov 2019
Location: St Pée sur Nivelle
Posts: 992
KJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by dave_j View Post
The general tenor of this, and many other posts, suggesting that I'm heartless etc. requires a comment.
For most, the advent of brexit will mean very little. Their lives won't be affected much at all and their lives in the UK will carry on much as if little had happened, other than the immediate covid challenge of course.
My comments were intended for posters here, on this site, those who see nothing but gloom ahead.
You posters aren't typical, most have decided to up roots and go to live elsewhere. Most will be familiar with everyday overseas travel, overseas work and the challenges that these present. It's to these posters who complain at every opportunity about the inconveniences that brexit brings, it was to these posters that I was directing my post.
If anyone should see opportunities that brexit generates it should be you, but apparently rather than seek them out and exploit them you're content to sit back and hark back to the days when times were different.
Well times have changed, things are different so make the most of it, you have the experience that gives you a good start, exploit it because without doubt others will.
An excellent post; Unfortunately you won't change their views. They lost the referendum and will forever remain bitter.
KJMW is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 4:27 pm
  #42  
 
Lion in Winter's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2003
Location: City of Broad Shoulders
Posts: 60,624
Lion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond reputeLion in Winter has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by dave_j View Post
The general tenor of this, and many other posts, suggesting that I'm heartless etc. requires a comment.
For most, the advent of brexit will mean very little. Their lives won't be affected much at all and their lives in the UK will carry on much as if little had happened, other than the immediate covid challenge of course.
My comments were intended for posters here, on this site, those who see nothing but gloom ahead.
You posters aren't typical, most have decided to up roots and go to live elsewhere. Most will be familiar with everyday overseas travel, overseas work and the challenges that these present. It's to these posters who complain at every opportunity about the inconveniences that brexit brings, it was to these posters that I was directing my post.
If anyone should see opportunities that brexit generates it should be you, but apparently rather than seek them out and exploit them you're content to sit back and hark back to the days when times were different.
Well times have changed, things are different so make the most of it, you have the experience that gives you a good start, exploit it because without doubt others will.
I don't suppose you are heartless, but I suspect that your comments regarding people being lazy and feckless were not only meant for BE posters, most of whom are now reasonably comfortable by and large.

Most posters who dislike brexit have discussed not personal inconvenience but the effects on the country as a whole. Many pro brexit points of view have insisted that both the country and its people will benefit. Additionally, it was said that low wage people will benefit. When asked how, specifics are noticeably lacking. I would suggest that it's incumbent on the fans of brexit to explain exactly who will benefit and how. So far, there's nothing - we are just told to stop complaining.



Lion in Winter is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 4:31 pm
  #43  
Oscar nominated
 
BristolUK's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2008
Location: Moncton, NB, CANADA
Posts: 37,034
BristolUK has a reputation beyond reputeBristolUK has a reputation beyond reputeBristolUK has a reputation beyond reputeBristolUK has a reputation beyond reputeBristolUK has a reputation beyond reputeBristolUK has a reputation beyond reputeBristolUK has a reputation beyond reputeBristolUK has a reputation beyond reputeBristolUK has a reputation beyond reputeBristolUK has a reputation beyond reputeBristolUK has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by dave_j View Post
The general tenor of this, and many other posts, suggesting that I'm heartless etc. requires a comment.
For most, the advent of brexit will mean very little. Their lives won't be affected much at all and their lives in the UK will carry on much as if little had happened, other than the immediate covid challenge of course.
My comments were intended for posters here, on this site, those who see nothing but gloom ahead.
You posters aren't typical, most have decided to up roots and go to live elsewhere. Most will be familiar with everyday overseas travel, overseas work and the challenges that these present. It's to these posters who complain at every opportunity about the inconveniences that brexit brings, it was to these posters that I was directing my post.
If anyone should see opportunities that brexit generates it should be you, but apparently rather than seek them out and exploit them you're content to sit back and hark back to the days when times were different.
Well times have changed, things are different so make the most of it, you have the experience that gives you a good start, exploit it because without doubt others will.
So essentially, the poor and most other people won't see any difference. And those that will see change will be those taking advantage of the opportunities.

I think that's what most of the posters you disagree with have been saying yet you apparently agree.
BristolUK is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 4:33 pm
  #44  
Banned
 
Joined: Nov 2019
Location: St Pée sur Nivelle
Posts: 992
KJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond reputeKJMW has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by BristolUK View Post
So essentially, the poor and most other people won't see any difference. And those that will see change will be those taking advantage of the opportunities.

I think that's what most of the posters you disagree with have been saying yet you apparently agree.
What a load of drivel in reply to an intelligent post.
KJMW is offline  
Old Jan 2nd 2021, 6:45 pm
  #45  
Overkill is underrated
 
DaveLovesDee's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 23,405
DaveLovesDee has a reputation beyond reputeDaveLovesDee has a reputation beyond reputeDaveLovesDee has a reputation beyond reputeDaveLovesDee has a reputation beyond reputeDaveLovesDee has a reputation beyond reputeDaveLovesDee has a reputation beyond reputeDaveLovesDee has a reputation beyond reputeDaveLovesDee has a reputation beyond reputeDaveLovesDee has a reputation beyond reputeDaveLovesDee has a reputation beyond reputeDaveLovesDee has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Brexit changes

Originally Posted by GeneralPowerpoint View Post
Why couldn’t Leave voters get it right when we were part of the EU? We’re they too feckless and lazy to see the opportunities we enjoyed while part of the EU?
I spent more time at school in the early 80's learning about the wonderful places I could go if I joined the British Army than I did learning about the EEC. I suspect little change in those respects after we joined the EU in 1992.

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
This might be true if the starting line of the race were in the same place for everyone, but it is not. The kinds of changes that Brexit brings are mostly likely to present opportunities for those operating at the highest levels of trade, business, and finance who have the flexibility and oppportunity to make money out of any situation at all, irrespective of its effects on anyone else.

To claim that the people now struggling in the depths of deprivation and all the negative fallout from that which makes others write them off as "the undeserving poor", sometimes now for generations, have the same opportunities, is, frankly, nonsense. You may not care about them, but they affect both our society and our economy.

Nobody has been able to explain in any specific way what the benefits or opportunities of leaving the EU will be, not only to people in desperate situations, but just to normal working people. Some have claimed that wages for the low income will go up because there will be fewer immigrants. This is wishful thinking, as though business won't adapt and find sources of cheap labour elsewhere if it has to, or have their friends in Westminster open the doors even wider to non EU immigrants. Other than this, specific claims for benefits to the gen pop = 0.

Simply to state that change always brings opportunities adds nothing. Opportunities for whom, and to do what? When in business or anywhere else do you take a course of action because somebody says "Go on, do it, it'll be good I promise you." Do you not ask for proof and do a careful analysis? Most likely outcome is that it will be ok for the haves and the same shit for the have-nots.

This is, of course, addressing mostly the money side of things. We have lost our place and our role in the European project - that will not be replaced.

Originally Posted by dave_j View Post
The general tenor of this, and many other posts, suggesting that I'm heartless etc. requires a comment.
For most, the advent of brexit will mean very little. Their lives won't be affected much at all and their lives in the UK will carry on much as if little had happened, other than the immediate covid challenge of course.
Now you get it.... It's been pointed out a number of times over the last four and a half years that many of those who who voted Leave had very little direct interaction with EU rules, and where they did, weren't aware that the EU was involved.... And these people will see no benefit from Brexit either, by they were the ones most easily manipulated.

Originally Posted by KJMW View Post
What a load of drivel in reply to an intelligent post.
Yeah, but you didn't have to post that....

Last edited by DaveLovesDee; Jan 2nd 2021 at 6:48 pm.
DaveLovesDee is offline  

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.