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Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Old May 26th 2019, 1:22 am
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Default Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

These articles say yes. How do our European residents see it? And what should be done to stop it, if true? How much of a threat is it.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-cap-in-public

https://www.theguardian.com/news/201...t-figures-show

The OH's ancestors, bar one (or he wouldn't be here at all) on one side of his family all died in the camps. Feeling runs strong in this family.
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Old May 26th 2019, 6:49 am
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
These articles say yes. How do our European residents see it? And what should be done to stop it, if true? How much of a threat is it.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-cap-in-public

https://www.theguardian.com/news/201...t-figures-show
The OH's ancestors, bar one (or he wouldn't be here at all) on one side of his family all died in the camps. Feeling runs strong in this family.
istm it's more widely rooted that these articles cover LiW and, imo, the threat is real.
The EU handed a Christmas present to this filth in the way it didn't handle the Mediterranean refugee boat crisis. That has been used by our Fourth-Reichers as proof that they were, and still are, correct. Whether it's religion, race, belief systems, or politics, their hate-speak has a simplistic foundation. Based on the twin fictions of 'ethnic injury' and 'the nation' it's dogma is that injury has somehow been done to the nation, by those who do not belong and who are to blame. There's no room for those who don't agree or fit-in. Minorities are, by default, a threat.
On a global setting, an example of the mindset is the US creature John Bolton. Clothed in his flag and self righteousness his evangelical façade of extremism would (and maybe will) happily start a war with Iran. Not because war is justified, necessary, or even for a better end. It's because Iran simply doesn't fit-in with his view of what the world should be like. In his white-world there is no room for those who don't belong.
Just the start.
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Old May 26th 2019, 11:43 am
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Originally Posted by 007Steve View Post
istm it's more widely rooted that these articles cover LiW and, imo, the threat is real.
The EU handed a Christmas present to this filth in the way it didn't handle the Mediterranean refugee boat crisis. That has been used by our Fourth-Reichers as proof that they were, and still are, correct. Whether it's religion, race, belief systems, or politics, their hate-speak has a simplistic foundation. Based on the twin fictions of 'ethnic injury' and 'the nation' it's dogma is that injury has somehow been done to the nation, by those who do not belong and who are to blame. There's no room for those who don't agree or fit-in. Minorities are, by default, a threat.
On a global setting, an example of the mindset is the US creature John Bolton. Clothed in his flag and self righteousness his evangelical façade of extremism would (and maybe will) happily start a war with Iran. Not because war is justified, necessary, or even for a better end. It's because Iran simply doesn't fit-in with his view of what the world should be like. In his white-world there is no room for those who don't belong.
Just the start.
And so - what do we do? This is a real question. As a Londoner of the NF era, I have a good background in street protest but this lot, with their digital communications abilities, are less primitive and seem to have more access to the corridors of power than before.
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Old May 26th 2019, 1:14 pm
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
And so - what do we do? This is a real question. As a Londoner of the NF era, I have a good background in street protest but this lot, with their digital communications abilities, are less primitive and seem to have more access to the corridors of power than before.
... Difficult; - as they use of the weaknesses & pressure points of a democratic system against itself.
For example, employing anyone in UK public sectors involves criminal record checks and membership of proscribed groups - EDL, National Action, etc. Yet, from my own experience (I was seconded into over a dozen public organisations) those checks, which should have been carried out with the same rigour as say Right to Work, were frequently reduced to self-declaration tick-boxes with as much importance attached to them as studying the office dress-code.. No checks.
The Police and armed forces are particularly problematic. Check all you like, but if someone declares they aren't a member of a banned group and then praises them on Facebook aren't you abusing their democratic Rights? Isn't it you who is the Nazi? Effectively, once inside, the gathering of data and the furtive searches for like-minded sympathisers starts.
Now take that route and apply it to the UK political party's and structures. Unpaid volunteer, intern, researcher, Parliamentary assistant - it's all the same. Little wonder the Labour Party has been thoroughly infiltrated and has problems. Yes LiW, they do have friends in the corridors of power, mostly of the useful idiots grade, but some by tacit approval. This filth has learned from the days of the NF that street violence is only one part of their route into power. The main tactic is to trick a democracy and its own structures into believing that they are one of them.
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Old May 26th 2019, 1:23 pm
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Originally Posted by 007Steve View Post
... Difficult; - as they use of the weaknesses & pressure points of a democratic system against itself.
For example, employing anyone in UK public sectors involves criminal record checks and membership of proscribed groups - EDL, National Action, etc. Yet, from my own experience (I was seconded into over a dozen public organisations) those checks, which should have been carried out with the same rigour as say Right to Work, were frequently reduced to self-declaration tick-boxes with as much importance attached to them as studying the office dress-code.. No checks.
The Police and armed forces are particularly problematic. Check all you like, but if someone declares they aren't a member of a banned group and then praises them on Facebook aren't you abusing their democratic Rights? Isn't it you who is the Nazi? Effectively, once inside, the gathering of data and the furtive searches for like-minded sympathisers starts.
Now take that route and apply it to the UK political party's and structures. Unpaid volunteer, intern, researcher, Parliamentary assistant - it's all the same. Little wonder the Labour Party has been thoroughly infiltrated and has problems. Yes LiW, they do have friends in the corridors of power, mostly of the useful idiots grade, but some by tacit approval. This filth has learned from the days of the NF that street violence is only one part of their route into power. The main tactic is to trick a democracy and its own structures into believing that they are one of them.
But popular culture and generally accepted norms? How do you reset those to make certain kinds of behaviour simply unacceptable by the majority. I'm not a great fan of authoritarian measures to do this, both from a philosophical standpoint but also because they tend to not work and simply foment the kind behaviuor we see now.
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Old May 26th 2019, 3:30 pm
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
These articles say yes. How do our European residents see it? And what should be done to stop it, if true? How much of a threat is it.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-cap-in-public

https://www.theguardian.com/news/201...t-figures-show

The OH's ancestors, bar one (or he wouldn't be here at all) on one side of his family all died in the camps. Feeling runs strong in this family.
More interestingly was the Guardian being Islamophobic? Certainly seems they have some questions to answer.

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Old May 26th 2019, 4:09 pm
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Originally Posted by Boiler View Post
More interestingly was the Guardian being Islamophobic? Certainly seems they have some questions to answer.
Why is it more interesting? Or just trolling again?

Islamophobia is as real as anti-Semitism. I just happened to ask a question about anti-Semitism. Feel free to respond if you have thoughts about that.

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Old May 26th 2019, 5:05 pm
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Is Donald Trump Jewish ? He seems very pro-Israel in his foreign policy. Close to Benjamin Netanyau, approved the re-location of the Israeli capital to Jerusalem, seems to hate Muslims and lately making war noises against Iran and Netanyahu has always wanted a military action against that country
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Old May 26th 2019, 5:10 pm
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Originally Posted by dc koop View Post
Is Donald Trump Jewish ? He seems very pro-Israel in his foreign policy. Close to Benjamin Netanyau, approved the re-location of the Israeli capital to Jerusalem, seems to hate Muslims and lately making war noises against Iran and Netanyahu has always wanted a military action against that country
Anti-Semitism is not the opposite of Islamophobia, nor vice versa.

I have no idea why I thought, even for a moment, that a sensible and serious discussion could be had in here.
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Old May 26th 2019, 5:16 pm
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
Anti-Semitism is not the opposite of Islamophobia, nor vice versa.

I have no idea why I thought, even for a moment, that a sensible and serious discussion could be had in here.
I was pointing out some of his policies which made me curious. Anyway he seems to have bolaxed up (what little chances there were to begin with) of any lasting peace settlement between Israel and the Palestinians
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Old May 26th 2019, 5:56 pm
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Pretty disgusting https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-48411735

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Old May 26th 2019, 5:59 pm
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter View Post
Why is it more interesting? Or just trolling again?

Islamophobia is as real as anti-Semitism. I just happened to ask a question about anti-Semitism. Feel free to respond if you have thoughts about that.
You posted the link including Islamophobia.
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Old May 26th 2019, 6:12 pm
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Originally Posted by Boiler View Post
More interestingly was the Guardian being Islamophobic? Certainly seems they have some questions to answer.
You seem incapable incapable of understanding that you can find two prejudices both unacceptable.
Being anti Islamaphobia does not make you pro anti semitism.and vice versa..
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Old May 26th 2019, 6:22 pm
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Originally Posted by Boiler View Post
You posted the link including Islamophobia.
Oh FFS. What is the title of the thread and the content of my first post?

I know you have this itch to always post what you consider to be a counter-example, but could you just once have a real discussion?

For Jewish people this is a very real issue, due to some relatively recent events in historical terms. If you would like to discuss some other types of bigotry, there are plenty of opportunities liberally scattered throughout TIO.
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Old May 26th 2019, 6:40 pm
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Default Re: Anti-semitism - is it on the rise in Europe?

Anti-semitism is on the rise only if one accepts Israel's official definition, which includes criticism of Israel's atrocities towards the dispossessed Palestinians. Several European states and many US states, and of course every supporter of Israel and its policies, have in recent times adopted Israel's definition. If the conflation of anti-Israel and anti-Jew are to be conflated, then it may be time to drop the use of "anti-semitism" altogether and to substitute the term "anti-Jew" when relevant. It ought to be made clear that someone can be anti-Israel without being anti-Jew.
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