steviedeluxe

I think it would, and actually think it would work in Spanish cities. Certain deals that they have (such as a curry and a drink for £4.99 on curry night) would work well I feel, especially with expat communities. Plus, you already have certain chains (such as Museo del Jamon in Madrid) that offer food and drinks at budget prices. Of course they'd have to speed up service times, but to be fair the time it takes to get served in the UK appears to have improved recently.

rugbymatt

Cant see how it can, and I will tell you why.

Its not there already. JDW is a huge Pubco, its got a buying power that is hardly matched by anyone and the result is that they can afford to have loss leaders, they can afford to do £1 pint deals etc, and in the British market that makes them a strong market leader and hard to beat at all, but in Spain? Nope. For a company with the brains and ability to adapt to market changes with the speed that they do not to already venture into Spain means they don't see it as a viable market. If they are not there its because they don't see it as worth it, and to do it on anything less than the scale that they do things would mean you wouldn't have the purchasing power and ability to churn food and drink out at such low prices.

Don't forget, JDW own 99.9% of their premisses. That makes it much easier to run loss leaders, could you say the same thing for a £1000 a month rent, £1000 a month rates?

steviedeluxe

There may be good reasons why it wouldn't work (hoping to get some, which is why I started the thread ) However your reasons hardly stack up. A few years ago Wetherspoons didn't even exist - it didn't stop them appearing and getting to the size they are now. As for " If they are not there its because they don't see it as worth it" - this has to be the most illogical statement I've ever seen. Did McDonalds prior to expanding out of the US, not have outlets in the UK, Spain etc because "they don't see it as worth it"????? You often have good points to make RugbyMatt, but I fear today's an off day

Mitzyboy

My daughter worked at Weatherspoons on and off for many years in her Uni days and for a while after.

Consequently none of us will ever eat at Weatherspoons again, knowing what she knew.

In Spain. Weatherspoons? Why, is I guess the overall question. Why would I want to go in a plastic Weatherspoon type franchise establishment when I can go to a nice little restaurant / bar and get a three course meal with drinks for anything from €6 upwards

rugbymatt

Yeah, nice reply, and people wonder why I always end up in rows with posters, one wonders if you would have replied to another poster in the same manner.



Ok, since you have all the answers lets hear them.

Its not like I am sat as an outsider looking in, I am involved in the Trade, my OH is a hotel manager and has run her own pubs, I have run a bar in Spain, and have been involved in many aspects of the catering trade, and we have good friends who own a large Pubco, and believe me, Pubco's are after any angle they can get, and given the price of drink in Spain I cant see how it could possibly work.
An example, a nine pin of Carling costs £133, that makes it roughly £1.77 a pint to buy in for the company, now, to make it worth a companies worthwhile they need at least 50% on top of that, which makes it £2.65. Now thats not much of a mark up is it? .85p I think, so to make the rent alone you would need to be selling a nine pin a day, and even then you would struggle.

Now, to get the savings that JDW get you would have to be selling around 3.2 million pints a year, now, do you think you could do that?

Mitzyboy

Oh, and in some ways RM is right ......... if they felt it would work then they would have been there by now. It works in the UK cos its no frills cheap beer & food. In other words, what we already have here in abundance

rugbymatt

Thats my point, it works because they undercut almost everyone, yet in a struggling market in Spain where its cheap anyway, why even bother to try and lose money in an already saturated market.

rugbymatt

Oh and just to add, JDW have been in business since 1979, thats 30 years, if they hadnt cottoned on to Spain by now then they probably wouldn't have been quite as successful as they are.

Jur

Is this franchise similar to Starbucks ? They seem to do well in Seville. Another chain of coffeehouses is Cafe de Indias, but the establishments I´ve seen lately are very very quiet.

rugbymatt

Its a Pubco, alcohol and food. They have been in business since 1979, in all honesty Jur, being a business man, would you not have looked into setting up a while back?

They have a turnover of over £1 billion.

Fortaleza

As Mitz said, Wethersppons worked in the UK because there was a gap in the market for independent (of breweries I mean) budget pubs. That gap doesn't exist in Spain as most establishments are independant anyway, and are already at budget prices.

There are two chains already in Spain that spring to mind that offer something like what you say but don't have anywhere near the success of Wetherspoons. I'm thinking of Cañas y Tapas and 100 Montaditos. They all have a similar look, have the same menu in each of its establishments, off the same beers etc, and are in general priced the same throughout the country. They have varying degrees of success but price can be an issue. Whilst 100 Montaditos in Madrid might be competitive there, in a less affluent area of Spain it might be seen as slightly overpriced. Islantilla (a resort in Huelva) has a 100 Montaditos and works well in summer, but only because of brand recognition for the holidaymakers from Madrid, Seville etc. Locals wouldn't necessarily see it as a budget pub given that a small beer is around €1,80 and I think (but could be wrong) the montaditos are around €2,50-3,00 ish. A standard small beer in the area is anything from €1,00-1,20 (although €1,50 in a bar de copas or restaurant) with montaditos at €1,50-2,00.

Jur

If a huge company like that sees a market for them they´ll go for it I guess, But I don´t think this sort of chain will add any value to life in Spain. Looking at their website it does not seem to have anything special which makes them different from any other chain of Pubco´s, like All Bar One.

rugbymatt

In essence there is little to distinguish them, aside from size obviously, I think M&B have 40 odd pubs while JDW have well over 700 I think, and as Mitz said, if you have such a wide variety of places to drink and eat in Spain, why go to a Pubco?

steviedeluxe

Exactly Jur. Prior to Starbucks opening in Spain I'm sure you could have had the argument "If they are not there its because they don't see it as worth it" - ie it's a nonsensical argument. Of course successful companies expand first in their home market and take advantage of economies of scale etc. It may well be that Wetherspoons never venture abroad, but seeing how they're already based in several airports, I wouldn't bet against it. Having said that, I'd have been one of those who would have thought Starbucks would never try the Spanish market, as you could already buy good cheap coffee in lots of places.

Mitzy - 6Euros for a Menu? Sounds very good value. You're looking at 8 or more in somewhere like Madrid. Although it'd be interesting to find out current prices at Museo del Jamon

steviedeluxe

There are surprisingly quite a lot of chains that seem (we'll see if the recession wipes them out!! ) to do ok in Spain eg Gambrinus, Canas y Tapas, Museo del Jamon, 101 Montaditos etc.