stephen1962

hi i bought a property in Benevista , Estepona on the 03rd july this year.
just noticed two payments totalling about 500 euros taken out my bank

RECIBO DE PATRONATO DE RECAUDACION PROVI, ESTEPONA

HELP DOES ANYONE NO WHATS THIS IS FOR ! i can only guess my solicitors arranged payments , cant get hold of them today,
ANXIOUS anyone HELP

lynnxa

property tax?

stephen1962

IF ITS PROPERTY TAX WHY TWO AMOUNTS TAKEN ON THE SAME DAY
SAY 111 AND 315 EUROS AND IS THIS A ONE OFF PAYMENT ?
WHY WASNT THIS TAKEN AT COMPLETION !
SPANISH ARE WEIRD, ANY MORE SUPRISES FOR MR

THANKS FOR 1ST REPLY

Fredbargate

Lots

Welcome to the most corrupt country in the world

cricketman

It could be unpaid IBI (council tax) from previous years. As the new owner you would still be liable for this. Your lawyer should have done a search for debts attached to the property before you bought it

Lynn R

I know some areas have separate charges for IBI and for basura (rubbish disposal), which might account for the fact that two separate amounts have been deducted from the OP's bank account. The timing seems to coincide with the 2013 IBI bills becoming due, although I have always understood that if you own a property at the beginning of the Spanish tax year (1st January) you are responsible for paying the taxes on it for the whole of that year, therefore really the previous owner should have paid it.

If I'm right and it is for the 2013 IBI and basura charges, the amounts wouldn't have been paid at completion because the bills wouldn't have been issued by then.

amideislas

First, realise that this is not the UK. Posession is 9/10ths of the law. He who has the money laughs best.

So, beware of anytime you grant direct debit to anyone, because once they take it, it's your problem to get it back. The utility companies are particularly good at draining bank accounts "mistakenly" (technically), but in practice, it's never a mistake until YOU prove it isn't. And even then, it's challenging to get any refunds.

Second, the government works in mysterious ways. If you don't know what this is for, then you haven't done your homework (it is always your responsibility to figure it out, not theirs).

Welcome to Spain, and your first lesson in living here.

Lynn R

If someone has bought a holiday home, how exactly do you suggest they should pay their IBI and utility bills except by direct debit? If you do not happen to be at your property between the time the IBI bill arrives and the last date for payment (normally early September), you will have to pay a surcharge for late payment - absolutely no sense in doing that if it can be avoided.

In just over 10 years of paying ALL my bills by direct debit, I have had one problem only. That was when an insurance company took the renewal premium out of my account despite my having given the required amount of written notice that I wanted to cancel the policy. I advised the bank immediately (one 2-minute visit) and they got the money credited straight back to my account - so it was NOT my problem to get it back at all.

notacontrathinker

The €111 is probably for rubbish collection which I pay yearly. The €315 will be for property tax. I usually get a confirmation receipt from my bank within the month showing a bit more detail as to what it's for.

The property tax here is paid in quarterly installments, in your case it looks like half-yearly (I hope).

You may want to take a translator down to the town hall and ask for a 'calendar of fiscal payments'. I don't know the name of it in Spanish because mine is in Catalan. This shows when payments are due for various services.
Besides the rubbish collection charge and the property tax, mine shows -

Car Tax which here is collected by the town hall for Spanish registered cars.

Taxes to be paid for commercial property.

Tax for the 'No Parking' sign in front of your house if you have one.

Tax for the up-keep of the cemetery (I've never been charged it)

Tax for what they call anti-incendiary measures (As I live in a national park I have to pay the council to clear a 50 meter space around my house of everything except trees and exotic plants !)

There may be special taxes for where you live.

Whilst you are at the town hall, you and your translator might want to do your 'Empardron' at the same time.

Also, where I live the 'Urbanizacion' (Suburb ?) has an Owners Association to which I have to pay €15 a month as a sort of maintenance charge. It pays for the kid's play area, the welfare of the area, a bulldozer to clear the landslides now and again, and the yearly fiesta for which I get a free dinner).

All-in-all the bibs and bobs don't add up to anything like the rates in UK, but then again you don't get millions of silly signs on the roads. Or kerbstones.

Hope this helps.

Lynn R

The IBI bills for Malaga province (where Estepona is) are normally issued annually so I think it is more likely the €315 is for the full year. Some Ayuntamientos allow you to pay in instalments if you prefer, but you have to request this specifically (my own now provides a facility to pay by 9 instalments if required, for example). Don't know if Estepona does this or not.

amideislas

When it comes to anything governmental, you have no choice but direct debit. Even if you don't allow it, they will take it from any bank account in your name, so there's no sense in blocking it. But once they have the money, it's a done deal, whether it's legit or not. Better to know in advance what they will be taking and why, because they will rarely tell you when or why.

Utilities are a different kettle of fish. You DO have the choice (even though they will tell you otherwise). We have blocked all direct debits from any utility to prevent bank account drainage due to their "mistakes" or "grossly over-estimated" charges (Endesa is famous for it). And it works marvelously! We haven't been ripped off by Endesa since!

Lynn R

That is absolutely not true. In fact, you have to specifically request to pay your IBI bills (and basura if it applies) by direct debit. If you don't, the bill simply arrives in the post and you have to take it to a bank to pay it - and risk having to pay a surcharge if you are not there to pay it by the due date.

Addendum - if the bill remains unpaid for long enough, they may of course obtain an embargo and take the money out of your bank account. But they do send out notices advising that they are going to do so - I have seen them delivered to other people's addresses as they have brought them to me in a panic, not knowing what they are.

lynnxa

agreed - here you get a discount for paying by dd, if you choose not to, you can even make arrangements to pay monthly

snikpoh

Do you come under Alicante?

The reason I ask is that we don't get a discount so I'm assuming the scheme is not across all of Valencia, just in your region.

Rosemary

I did not realise that there was a discount for DD, I thought that the discount was if you paid by a certain date.

Rosemary