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what if GB leaves the EU...

what if GB leaves the EU...

Old Oct 10th 2014, 8:25 pm
  #61  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

Originally Posted by amideislas
There's plenty of non-EU citizens legally living and working in the EU and doing just fine. And they enjoy freedom of movement like any EU citizen. That includes South Americans, North Americans, Russians, Asians, etc..

So what exactly would be any different? Would the EU gestapo suddenly start peeling the rights away from all non-EU residents that happen to have UK citizenship? I seriously doubt it.

In Spain, if you are a legal resident and pay your taxes, you get health care, just the same as in any EU member state. How would that change? Would Brits solely be denied access to health care simply for being Brits, even if they pay for it?

Reciprocal? the NHS would suddenly start refusing to provide care to UK citizens if they lived abroad? They seem to happily provide care to foreigners without thinking twice about it, so why refuse UK citizens?

Nationalism? I don't think that has all that much to do with it. It's just that each nationality harbours certain discomforts with a very distant, rather elitist Brussels dictating everything to them, which is understandable.
We recently helped an American citizen who found that he couldn't buy a business in Spain, couldn't get autonomo, paid a fortune for private medical cover and is now operating illegally, the only way.

I think it depends on where you live in Spain. In my area, that large expat belt in Alicante province where around 300,000 expats live has long ago overwhelmed the Spanish authorities who find it much easier to pocket a few Euros rather than mess about with all those daft forms. The prisons are full of ex-mayors, all of them millionaires.

After many hours of queuing and getting literally hundreds of official Spanish forms which fill two large cardboard boxes in my garage, two years ago I attended my local padron office with my official briefcase full of legal papers and the required copies.

It was a lovely sunny day and my wife came with me. We were met by a particularly surly functionario, already will known to us from many previous visits.

I lasted less than 10 minutes, picked up my papers awaiting stamping by this horrible man and walked out into the sunshine and five minutes later we were sitting in our favourite beach side cafe, savouring the smell of freedom.

My wife couldn't stop giggling. 'You're not going to ever speak to a functie again, are you?'

I haven't.
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Old Oct 11th 2014, 1:03 am
  #62  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

Originally Posted by la mancha
Has UKIP’s first Member of Parliament got to you? Try this one on.

A rise in immigration.

A welfare bill spiralling out of control.

What does this add up to?

Rising immigration + Rising welfare bill = A rise in UK borrowing (and set to borrow more in 5 years than Labour did in 13 years of government.)

And you have to pay for it.

Sweet dreams.

You cannot be very happy with the new UKIP MP who is already distancing himself from " der leader " Nige.
Comments such as " I have no difficulty with Britain as Britain is today " or that immigration is beneficial " he does want a stronger line taken on Illegal immigration as do we all.

Do I smell a challenge for the leadership of a " new Ukip " in the future !!
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Old Oct 11th 2014, 1:33 am
  #63  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

Originally Posted by EMR
You cannot be very happy with the new UKIP MP who is already distancing himself from " der leader " Nige.
Comments such as " I have no difficulty with Britain as Britain is today " or that immigration is beneficial " he does want a stronger line taken on Illegal immigration as do we all.

Do I smell a challenge for the leadership of a " new Ukip " in the future !!
You still do not understand, do you? How many times must I spell it out for you?

I strongly resent the unskilled from Eastern Europe, Africa, Asia and the Middle East coming to the UK and burdening themselves on our, yes OUR, the UK taxpayers, NHS, housing, schools and benefits system, for which the Conservative government has borrowed more in 5 years than Labour did in 13 to keep the system going, if you can call the mess we are in now, going. And the British taxpayer has to pay for it.

I am all in favour of our skilled Commonwealth cousins, to use a word, coming to the UK and merging with the UK and its institutions, adding to our community and paying taxes.

I am not in favour of letting the unskilled from Eastern Europe, Africa, Asia and the Middle East walk unchallenged into Britain while refusing engineers, IT specialists, etc. from the Commonwealth countries. The system is crazy and your Con/LibDems have had 5 years to do something about it and have done nothing.

NOW do you understand?

And I think UKIP needed some experience at the top to stop the silly gaffs they keep making. Farage said last year he will not go on for longer than another 10 years, possibly less, as UKIP leader. Yes, the new UKIP MP Douglas Carswell or Reckless will make excellent leaders of UKIP. Look out the other parties. UKIP are on the march.
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Old Oct 11th 2014, 5:50 am
  #64  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

Originally Posted by la mancha
You still do not understand, do you? How many times must I spell it out for you?

I strongly resent the unskilled from Eastern Europe, Africa, Asia and the Middle East coming to the UK and burdening themselves on our, yes OUR, the UK taxpayers, NHS, housing, schools and benefits system, for which the Conservative government has borrowed more in 5 years than Labour did in 13 to keep the system going, if you can call the mess we are in now, going. And the British taxpayer has to pay for it.

I am all in favour of our skilled Commonwealth cousins, to use a word, coming to the UK and merging with the UK and its institutions, adding to our community and paying taxes.

I am not in favour of letting the unskilled from Eastern Europe, Africa, Asia and the Middle East walk unchallenged into Britain while refusing engineers, IT specialists, etc. from the Commonwealth countries. The system is crazy and your Con/LibDems have had 5 years to do something about it and have done nothing.

NOW do you understand?

And I think UKIP needed some experience at the top to stop the silly gaffs they keep making. Farage said last year he will not go on for longer than another 10 years, possibly less, as UKIP leader. Yes, the new UKIP MP Douglas Carswell or Reckless will make excellent leaders of UKIP. Look out the other parties. UKIP are on the march.
Clearly and sadly I and many others all too well understand wher you are coming from which is why with views such as your UKIP will never be more than a a fringe party.
You are also clearly not in agreement with your I MP who is happy with Britain as it is today, and wants UKIP to appeal to ALL Britains.
Keep it up you and those who think like you are the best reasons why no one should vote UKIP,

Last edited by EMR; Oct 11th 2014 at 7:11 am.
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Old Oct 11th 2014, 8:02 am
  #65  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

Originally Posted by HBwhy1435197
We recently helped an American citizen who found that he couldn't buy a business in Spain, couldn't get autonomo, paid a fortune for private medical cover and is now operating illegally, the only way.

I think it depends on where you live in Spain. In my area, that large expat belt in Alicante province where around 300,000 expats live has long ago overwhelmed the Spanish authorities who find it much easier to pocket a few Euros rather than mess about with all those daft forms. The prisons are full of ex-mayors, all of them millionaires.

After many hours of queuing and getting literally hundreds of official Spanish forms which fill two large cardboard boxes in my garage, two years ago I attended my local padron office with my official briefcase full of legal papers and the required copies.

It was a lovely sunny day and my wife came with me. We were met by a particularly surly functionario, already will known to us from many previous visits.

I lasted less than 10 minutes, picked up my papers awaiting stamping by this horrible man and walked out into the sunshine and five minutes later we were sitting in our favourite beach side cafe, savouring the smell of freedom.

My wife couldn't stop giggling. 'You're not going to ever speak to a functie again, are you?'

I haven't.
I wonder why they pick out your one American to block from owning a business. After all, there are plenty of yanks who own yachtie businesses here, not to mention Chinese nationals owning Bazaars and Arabs owning kebab restaurants. I wonder how bad it would be for Brits if GB left the EU. Probably same as the rest..
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Old Oct 12th 2014, 2:07 am
  #66  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

Originally Posted by EMR
Clearly and sadly I and many others all too well understand wher you are coming from which is why with views such as your UKIP will never be more than a a fringe party.
You are also clearly not in agreement with your I MP who is happy with Britain as it is today, and wants UKIP to appeal to ALL Britains.
Keep it up you and those who think like you are the best reasons why no one should vote UKIP,
I like a debate on BE, I really do. There are those on here with whom I enjoy debating whatever the subject. There are also those I disagree with and still enjoy debating with because their views, although opposite to mine, are as strong as mine, and although it gets a little heated sometimes I enjoy their company and respect them, as I hope they do me, whatever our differences.

And then there is you. You are bottom of the pile. By a long margin.

You do not read any of my posts. You repeat yourself in the hope that someone will eventually think you are talking sense. You post unsubstantiated comments time after time and refuse to back them up, again hoping someone will think you are knowledgeable. (I am still waiting to see from where you got the information that Arron Banks wants to be a UKIP candidate.) You post sarcastic comments to cover up your lack of intelligent debate when you cannot think of anything else to post.

You have now, somehow (and please tell me how), come to an assumption, an erroneous assumption, about me and what I am and am not in agreement with. In fact, you have posted a complete untruth about me.

I will ask you to read my post #50. Never mind, I will post my comment here for you because I know there is something in your head that just doesn’t want to listen. I said, ‘And good luck to the first UKIP Member of Parliament for saying what he did, i.e. those born in this country, something we all agree with.’ Do you understand this statement of mine? I don’t think you do because if you did bother to read my posts and understand them you would not post such rubbish as you did in your post #64 as in ‘You are also clearly not in agreement with your I MP who is happy with Britain as it is today, and wants UKIP to appeal to ALL Britains.’

I also posted #63, ‘I am all in favour of our skilled Commonwealth cousins, to use a word, coming to the UK and merging with the UK and its institutions, adding to our community and paying taxes.’, and ‘I am not in favour of letting the unskilled from Eastern Europe, Africa, Asia and the Middle East walk unchallenged into Britain while refusing engineers, IT specialists, etc. from the Commonwealth countries.’

My views, I might add, are in agreement with Duncan Smith and Theresa May (see above FACTUAL comments).

Now can we leave UKIP and immigration, a subject YOU brought up on here first on post #43, to remind you, because you are conveniently forgetful.

I posted #50, ‘Keep at it. Who knows, you might make sense one day.’ Sadly I was wrong. You will never make sense because when you run out of things to say you turn to sarcasm and untruths to help you overcome your lack of real debate when it is best for you to just say nothing.

I ask you, if you must answer my posts, to read them first. It is quite easy. They are enclosed in a little box and you start at the beginning and you finish at the end.

And Carswell is not my MP. He is the UKIP Member of Parliament for Clacton, and over 20,000 voted for him.

Sorry if I’m boring some on here but I feel I had to go into detail with this post in the possibility that some of it will sink in to the poster I am answering. Somehow, I don’t hold out much hope.

In your twisted thoughts make of this what you will. I have stated what I have and if you want to spew out more sarcasm then I leave it to others to draw their own conclusions.
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Old Oct 12th 2014, 3:36 am
  #67  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

la mancha an excellent post but unfortunately a total waste of space.
Far to well put for our resident expert on all and every subject to understand.
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Old Oct 12th 2014, 7:33 am
  #68  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

You are right of coursem it is impossible to have reasoned debate with any one who has such extreme views and supports UKIP.
Anyone watching Farage today would have seen that, untruths like 75% of UK laws made in Brussels is a typical example of te strange claims made.
Odd coincidence that when Farage was cornered and would not answer straight questions stangely the line went.
If you want to keep the NHS, then DO NOT vote UKIP.
Farage wants to hand it over to private enterprise.

I could not resist re posting this seen on TIO.


Quote from a UKIP clacton voter,

"Yes I voted UKIP, the TORY MP has done nothing for years. " !!!!!

Last edited by EMR; Oct 12th 2014 at 7:36 am.
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Old Oct 12th 2014, 8:18 am
  #69  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

Originally Posted by EMR
You are right of coursem it is impossible to have reasoned debate with any one who has such extreme views and supports UKIP.
Anyone watching Farage today would have seen that, untruths like 75% of UK laws made in Brussels is a typical example of te strange claims made.
Odd coincidence that when Farage was cornered and would not answer straight questions stangely the line went.
If you want to keep the NHS, then DO NOT vote UKIP.
Farage wants to hand it over to private enterprise.

I could not resist re posting this seen on TIO.


Quote from a UKIP clacton voter,

"Yes I voted UKIP, the TORY MP has done nothing for years. " !!!!!
What extreme views are they? Please answer this.

I thought we’d cracked it and you’d finally given a quote for some comments you are making. Then I look again and it is from TIO! Ah, well, there you go.

Anyway…

‘Quote from a UKIP clacton voter,

"Yes I voted UKIP, the TORY MP has done nothing for years. " !!!!!’

If you bother to read what Carswell said, he will be going into the House of Commons Monday (as UKIPs first MP) and he can say what he likes for or against Labour, the LibDems and, more importantly, the Tories, BECAUSE HE WILL NOT BE SHACKLED BY TRIBAL LOYALTY. Which means he will not have to tow the party line. Which means he can do things now for Clacton which he could not do before when under orders from the Tories. Which, if you bother to reason things out in your head, is the reason he left the Tories in the first place and joined a party where he can do the things he wants to do for Clacton. Understand?

And don’t forget, tell me about my extreme views.
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Old Oct 12th 2014, 8:53 am
  #70  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

Carsewell clearly is not shackled by tribal loyalty by already departing from the Farage line on immigration.
See yesterdays DM.
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Old Oct 12th 2014, 9:05 am
  #71  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

Originally Posted by EMR
Carsewell clearly is not shackled by tribal loyalty by already departing from the Farage line on immigration.
See yesterdays DM.
You read the Daily Mail? So tell me what it says.

And you are wriggling like a worm on a fish-hook. I asked you to explain yourself and tell me what my extreme views are. You told another untruth about me. EXPLAIN YOURSELF.
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Old Oct 12th 2014, 9:24 am
  #72  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

I never quite follow the logic of the people in the Spain forum being UKIP supporters.
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Old Oct 12th 2014, 9:31 am
  #73  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

Originally Posted by la mancha
You read the Daily Mail? So tell me what it says.

And you are wriggling like a worm on a fish-hook. I asked you to explain yourself and tell me what my extreme views are. You told another untruth about me. EXPLAIN YOURSELF.
EMR sits on the far left, therefore, anyone in the centre left, centre or right of centre is extreme in his view - simples!
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Old Oct 12th 2014, 9:32 am
  #74  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

Originally Posted by Sally Redux
I never quite follow the logic of the people in the Spain forum being UKIP supporters.
it does seem a tad counter intuitive
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Old Oct 12th 2014, 9:33 am
  #75  
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Default Re: what if GB leaves the EU...

Originally Posted by Garbatellamike
EMR sits on the far left, therefore, anyone in the centre left, centre or right of centre is extreme in his view - simples!
UKIP well right of centre in anyone's book.
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