We need to use more electricity!
 

As crazy as it may seem it appears that decreased electricity consumption due to energy-saving measures and increased power generation via green systems is causing a problem - what a strange world we live in!

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/czkkgnp1d2xo

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

It is even more bizarre than that. According to analysis by energy technology company Axle Energy, using publicly available data from the electricity system's balancing market platform Elexon, in 2022 the National Grid spent £215m paying wind generators to turn off, reducing the total amount generated by 6%, and a further £717m turning on gas turbines located closer to the source of demand, in order to fill the gap. It is said that this was done over 30 times. Furthermore the National Grid pays fossil fuel producers to be on standby should the wind be insufficient to generate enough electricity to satisfy demand.

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

In France they have had to turn off the Nuclear reactors because of excess "green" energy...

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

Bottom line: high energy prices are a complete SCAM. From here we need to deduce who is to blame for this.

It's absolutely ridiculous that with today's technology we are paying more for energy than we used to...

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

In the UK, we're frequently told that more renewable energy is the route to lower energy prices. But green taxes keep increasing to fund new renewable projects. Further, whilst the proportion of renewable energy has increased, electricity prices have not reduced. The wholesale price of electricity is largely determined by the price of gas, so when the gas price increased significantly due to the Ukraine war the price paid for renewable electricity also increased, despite the running costs of wind, solar, etc. being unchanged. Result, renewable energy companies are making an absolute killing at the expense of the consumer.

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

Expensive domestic energy is the scam of our lifetime.

Privatisation of any utility company always end in the same way. Massive dividends, massive debts... and then tax-payer money (and surging bills) being needed to save them.

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

Can someone explain to me why electricity in the UK is about three times the price it is in Spain?

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

In a word - no! Because it doesn’t seem to be. This is the latest figures issued this month

Price

Day. Month Year Date
UK Electricity 72.05 -3.05 -4.06% -4.00% -24.04% Jun/21
Germany Electricity 72.63 0 0% 7.65% -31.75% Jun/21
France Electricity 68.29 -2.42 -3.42% -21.10% -65.16% Jun/21
Spain Electricity 85.92 -4.68 -5.17% 91.96% -29.83% Jun/21
Italy Electricity 115.73 -0.65 -0.56% 22.60% -10.56% Jun/21

Of course, these are only spot prices and don’t take into account all the other’extras’ such as standing charges, time/ demand related charging, and distribution costs. ’

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

According to that the spot price in the UK and Spain is the same, the UK's is given in pounds and the rest are given in euros.

If I compare current spot prices then the UK is about double the cost and if I compare monthly energy bills then the UK's prices are also higher.

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

I couldn’t care less about spot prices. All I can say is that I currently pay the equivalent of 9p per unit and the new UK capped rate is 24.5p. Standing charges in Spain are not significantly higher unless you have a higher than average potencia.

When the UK rate was nearly 40p I was paying 12p.

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

And UK bills are much higher even though they pay only 5% VAT on domestic energy (permanently) whereas our IVA in Spain has now gone back up to 21% and there is also the 5% tax on electricity consumption. I believe that if consumers in the UK want fixed rate deals they have to accept being tied into their supplier for the duration of the contract whereas here we have the "sin permanencia" contracts where we pay a fixed rate but are free to switch suppliers at any time.

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

And as you are now using Imagina, not only are you free to leave at any time, they are contracted not to increase your price for three years.

Definitely a “cake and eat it” situation. I can’t see that happening in the UK!

My bill from them today was zero, thanks to the solar.

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

I've now had my second bill from them and the new contract is keeping my bills at exactly the same amount they were for the same months last year, in spite of the 15% increase in IVA and the reinstatement of the 5% electricity consumption tax so I am happy with that and grateful for you bringing them to my attention. Their potencia charges are higher than my previous supplier though (around €7 a month more than I was paying with Iberdrola), so I wouldn't recommend them for second home owners, that's my only caveat. My potencia isn't particularly high at 5.75kw and we are all electric so I wouldn't want to lower it.

You will be stuffing your cushions with €50 notes soon with all the cash you are saving on electricity bills!

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

Even more satisfying was deducting €3000 from my tax declaration this week!

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

Can you share more?

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

Share what? The €50 notes?

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

Well, that would be a start!

I was thinking more of your tax-saving ideas...

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

It's not an idea, it's a fact. If you install a solar system and it achieves a significant improvement in your EPC energy rating, you can claim up to 60% of the cost as a deduction against your Renta bill. It's limited to €3000 in one tax year but you can carry forward the unclaimed balance for up to 4 tax years.

On top of that, there is an EU grant of another 60% paid into your bank account. Inevitably you can't claim both in full but you can get up to 84% of the total cost subsidised.

Any energy that you generate over and above your usage is sold to the energy company for up to 15 centimos per Kwh meaning that, with a big enough system you pay nothing for your electricity every month of the year.

In the UK there are virtually no subsidies and the buy back price is pitiful.

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

OK good to know thanks

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

One of the issues of solar, heat pump and general EPC improvement upgrades is the requirement for significant taxpayer subsidies for many of them to be economically viable. Whilst the upgrades are cheap or free for the individual, they're not overall it's just that the cost is shared between all taxpayers. And if every taxpayer wanted to make subsidised upgrades, the aggregate cost is very high. The upgrade cost needs to be lower so they are economically viable without large taxpayer subsidies; this will encourage large scale take-up, not just in western countries but worldwide. Hopefully, technology improvements and economies of scale will get us there.

The low electricity buy back rate in the UK feels like a scam.

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

The main 60% subsidy comes from the EU "Next Generation" fund, not directly from the Spanish government. The income tax deductions are only available to people who pay sufficiently high amounts of tax.

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

Spain sparks fears of energy industry crisis as renewable supply exceeds demand | BBC News

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

From 2021:

Spain energy crisis: Soaring bills hamper recovery from Covid

I think I prefer this crisis to the other one.

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

UK households pay more for electricity than all of the EU
Closing the gap between electricity and relatively low gas prices should be a priority for the next government, experts said

Re: We need to use more electricity!
 

It's very possible they will incentivise people to move from gas boilers to electric heat pumps by making gas more expensive by adding various green levies to the cost of gas. Of course, it would be better to instead make electricity cheaper, but I wouldn't hold your breath.