Annetje

Hi,

I am just curious to know why people, who live in another EU country voted for Brexit. I fail to see the logic in that.

Surely, if Spain were to vote Spexit, it would give a lot of traveling problems for UK people ... no more ''popping over'' between Spain and Gibraltar or Portugal or France of Belgium for that matter.
Might need a visa or other travel document to go for a quick lunch in Castro Marim .

Personally, I love going to see my family in Belgium, go on holiday in Spain and shopping in London without hassle. Even (apart from the UK that is) no need to change money. Freedom of movement means a lot to me.

If it is that they don't trust the EU, then (I assume) they will all move back to the UK after the UK left the EU ? I wouldn't like to live in a country I do not trust, reason I do not live in South Africa even though I love Capetown.

Anyway, Just wondering.

Fredbargate

Why no popping over?

We did it before the EU with the exception of Gibraltar due to Spain's closing of the frontier there in 1969 without visas

Money well I have to change that every trip.

I for one will not be moving to the UK

Annetje

Well, I remember, living close to the border with the Netherlands, the long queues to go to the Netherlands, just for a shopping trip to Bergen op Zoom
Dad had to show his passport and loads of cars getting checked to see there was any smuggling going on.
I assume it was the same between Spain and Portugal or France ? (never went there in those days).
I think, maybe Gibraltar in general is a special case ?

olivefarmer

Could be people voted that not out of self interest but what is best for the long term for their country and children?

amideislas

Long-term interest of the country? How do you rationalise that?

There has yet to be identified even one tangible upside for all involved - especially for the long-term. Nobody gains anything from Brexit, everybody loses.

Retired in Euskadi

We live in the Basque country, Spain. I voted Brexit with a heavy heart simply because I am pro-Europe but anti "Brussels" with its unelected fat cat commissioners & their secular-humanist mind-set of wanting to make Europe into a federal state and increase their control of our Parliament.
I was hoping that their way of thinking might be persuaded to change if Britain remained in the EU, but that was a forlorn hope.
At present we are at the mercy of the financial markets & have to live with a poorer exchange rate, but I believe it will improve.
The various Commissioners are fearful that Marine Le Pen might win next year & upset their Euro-dream.
Interesting times we are experiencing.

Annetje

I have read a lot of articles regarding the voting and it seems to me that it was mainly the older generation that voted Brexit. The youngsters saw the opportunity in the EU.
Sad so many didn't bother to vote though, but a majority that did vote wanted to remain.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...o-remain-in-eu

Annetje

Surely it is better to change Brussels within the EU than leaving, especially since the UK was going to be president of the EU next year ?

http://en.euabc.com/word/127

amideislas

Unfortunately, the fear of these "threats" is largely manufactured. Or, in the case of the "federal state" is widely misconceived as a "bad" thing. In any case, Britain had no obligation to be a part of any "Federal state".

Virtually all of the crises that Europe has experienced are directly attributable to the fact that it is not a "federal state" and therefore has little authority to deal with these crises on a national level. The Euro debt crisis is one that would have been page four news by now, if Europe were a "federal state" with a true fiscal union. Greece would not be in eternal crisis. The rest of the PIIGS would not be teetering (although there has been significant improvement in many of them since the ECB took control of Euro monetary policy). The "migrant crisis" would have been solved in short order, had there been a federal border system, and not left up to individual members.

Fact is, that for Britain, a unified, federal Europe would be about the greatest economic dream it could imagine. Britain should have been championing it all along, rather than fearing it. If it had, and it came to pass, Britain would have all the benefits of having the world's largest economy as it's key trading partner. Something it is very likely to lose with the tactic it has chosen.

In contrast, if the extreme Brexiters get their way, and Europe does fail, aside from the rest of Europe, Britain will go down with it.

There is nothing positive in any of this for anyone.

olivefarmer

Not as easy as it sounds. One country trying (half heartedly as all its political parties support the EU ) against 27 others toeing the line? The leaders of the Eu should have and could have seen the way things were heading BUT were complacent and did not change. Only a small amount of change would have been necessary to have obtained a remain vote.

In any case our prime minister at the time (Cameron) gambled on holding a referendum to further his own interests. Sadly he hadn't weighed up the risks or done any preparation for a possible out vote. Yet more breathtaking complacency.

olivefarmer

Long term when the EU and euro projects fail as they will, then Great Britain will be cushioned from the shocks by being out of the union and trading freely with other countries. That simple.

amideislas

The EU "failing" is largely naively wishful thinking on the part of nationalists who have little understanding of what it means (see the current government in Britain, only recently discovering what the EU is, and how it works), although since Brexit, the possibility is certainly greater.

The idea that Britain can somehow be shielded from a failure of the EU is simply not supportable by any existing facts. It's also just wishful thinking.

There is nothing positive for anyone in any of this. The only thing to do now is limit the damage.

Retired in Euskadi

But that's what's wrong; they don't want to change.

amideislas

Who says? The Daily Express?

Fact is, the EU will have to change significantly to realise its dream of a federal republic. And for the better. I seriously doubt anyone in the halls of Brussels thinks all is hunky-dory as it is. Especially now.

Retired in Euskadi

As Prince Phillip once famously said "The Daily Express is a bloody awful newspaper". I've never read it since about the 1960's & don't intend to now.

Britain has always been somewhat different from other current EU states. For a start we were never invaded (since 1066) so we still have a constitution & democratic institutions going back centuries, something many EU states (the big ones at any rate) lost & had to re-start in 1945.
The CAP for instance needs major surgery, all the more since it swallows around 60% of the total EU budget, favouring smaller farmers such as exist in France & Germany. Neither wish to get rid of it, especially the French whose farmers are more militant than ours & whose Minister of Agriculture is someone rising in status compared to ours, whose probable next job would be Northern Ireland.
The CAP artificially drove up the price of food, but unfortunately not always to the benefit of the farmer, especially these days.
Economic union would be fine if they left it there but they're hell bent on a political union as well. Being inside the EU won't change that.