Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

bob, this is business - finance ethics have nothing to do with Corporate Responsibility (at the moment)
Even under CR when making donations to charities, local or national, there is always a tax relief break that decides just how much they can donate "safely".

although we originally joined European Free Trade and then the European Economic Community (we never joined the European Union) we have surely always understood that "All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others". So although we have a Union, Community call it what you will, every country has its own rules on which it bases its Tax Take, with differences here, differences there.
The UK has hardly any apple orchards because the French were allowed to dump their rubbish, the breakfast bacon was predominately from Denmark but now from Germany and Poland.

Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

Daniel Hannon was right when he said "We thought it would be free trade, but what we found is that it's actually highly regulated trade, under the control of distant Eurocrats representing not the interests of any local constituency, but simply, other Eurocrats".

Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

my dad always used to say "there is nothing free in this world"
mind you, with the tax pittance being paid by some companies it is almost "free"

the only reason the MD can pay less tax than the office cleaner is that he can afford a good accountant - and gets tax relief on that expense.

perhaps now is the time to stop Tax Relief, but that will never happen because there will always be some country somewhere that will not toe the line and every company will dive in there.
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Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

I'm a big believer in a flat tax rate. Period. Tax revenues would soar, we'd spend a fraction of what we do in accountants and tax collections and enforcement, taxpayers would not only be obliged to pay a simple, easy to calculate rate, but would likely be much happier doing it, since the average tax rate would likely be much lower.

But you're right. Nothing like that will ever happen. What would bureaucrats do if they couldn't spend their days making up new laws for things?

Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

but if we didn't have so many tax rates/allowances/etc then we wouldn't need to have so many accountants, so that would be the same as turkeys voting for Christmas.
but fewer accountants ? No loss, they could sit in the jobcentre fiddling with their abacus
:rofl:

In 2009 it was reported that the UK tax code had exceeded that of India and, at 11,520 pages was the longest in the world2. Many of us remember when the Butterworths/Tolley’s Yellow Tax Handbook (or the equivalent CCH Green Book) was a much more manageable two (or even one!) volumes, instead of the five volumes that there are today. The increasing length of UK tax legislation is often cited as indicating that the tax system is becoming more complex
http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/d/ots_...tion_paper.pdf

Perhaps the bureaucrats would find the time to get all legislation right first time instead of fiddling with a penny here and a penny there.

Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

Isn't that the point. Starbucks generate their profit on sales made in the UK but do not pay UK tax on that profit.
M&S pay tax on their UK profits, it is their overseas profits that may be treated differently.

Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

as private individuals we are taxed on our world income, subject to any DTA there may be in the various countries.

companies try to pass as much as they can up the pyramid to a point where the tax is the least, something we as individuals are not able/allowed to do.

Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

Yes but how does that really work. OK Starbucks is reasonably easy because if you go to one of their UK outlets and buy a coffee you expect the profit made from that coffee to be reported in the UK and the appropriate taxes paid on it in the UK.
What about Amazon. I sit in Spain and order from Amazon UK. The product is usually shipped from the UK (but not always) because I'm buying it in Spain to be sent to Spain it gets spanish IVA on it but the invoice says Amazon Luxembourg and thats where the corporation tax goes. So morally who should get it? Most would say if the product is bought on Amazon UK then the UK should.
Now look at M&S. When I used to shop on their UK website I imagine the UK got the profits and paid the taxes there. Now I shop on the EU website and Ireland get the benefit - but nothing has really changed - the product still comes from the UK. Companies like DELL use Ireland but they actually manufacture and ship from there. Is one more morally correct than the other?
Personally I think its far more difficult to unravel than people think. I've never been in a Starbucks and would never want to because its not my kind of place but I'll keep on using Amazon and M&S.

Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

[QUOTE=Domino;10432697]bob, this is business - finance ethics have nothing to do with Corporate Responsibility (at the moment)
Even under CR when making donations to charities, local or national, there is always a tax relief break that decides just how much they can donate "safely".

Domino yes I full agree that businesses are not worried by what is ethical as they are interested in making profit for shareholders etc. I mentioned the ethical as in that the public see it as unethical i.e. in the case of Starbucks some stopped buying their overpriced coffee. How long that would last in reality? as for the others that have been mentioned Amazon etc well people will continue to use them as they save money which no doubt dulls the pain of it not being ethical.

Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

Well if people continue to use them, they should stop whingeing about their unethical practices! We can't change things through the ballot box, because no political party is going to change the system. We only have power as consumers, and only if we all join together!

I now shop online directly at the companies I used to use via Amazon, like Awesome Books (free delivery to Spain!). Most suppliers supply goods online these days, it's not such a big deal. They are all delivered by MRW where I live.

Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

Pocaloca I fully agree with your sentiments I just think that you will find that people will do without coffee for a while and at least that got Starbucks attention. However my feeling is people will not boycott Amazon the same way.

Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

Absolutely:thumbup:

Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

A bit of good news:

Samsung agrees to pay back taxes on Spanish profits

"South Korean electronics giant Samsung has reached an agreement with the Spanish tax authorities under which it will pay more taxes.

Samsung agreed with the AEAT tax agency to revise the prices of transfers of products from overseas to increase its profit margin. As a result, in the wake of an inspection of its books, it will pay 9.5 million euros in back taxes for the period 2005-2008."

Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

it only takes "a little slip of the pen" to ship products at "the wrong" prices
but probably not much of a coup for the taxman as its only about €3.3million per annum, but keeps other companies aware they could be watched or next on the visit list.
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Re: Tax Avoidance ?
 

yes, the point is actually the good thing which we will have seen.