KieronF

I sense the mood is changing with regard to the streaming of UK subscription channels using Kodi and such like. I believe I read that the UK police have arrested a guy for merely owning boxes capable of streaming such content and that case will be heard in May. If there is a conviction then it will become an offence (in the UK at least) to own such a box - even if it isn't used for streaming.

Similarly, on the mainland in recent weeks there have been raids by the Spanish authorities to crack down on streaming. The Premier League are supporting the Spanish police in cracking down on the streaming of football and where they lead Sky are never far behind - WATCH: Spanish cops raid office in Malaga which was illegally streaming Premier League football - Olive Press News Spain

bobd22

From what I have read the guy was dealt with for preparing Kodi boxes for streaming such channels . The Kodi box itself is perfectly legal. As far as I am aware certainly in the UK no one so far has been prosecuted for streaming? The current court cases relates to selling the so called fully loaded boxes. I have not heard the outcome as yet. I believe there was a case some time ago re a pub broadcasting football matches via some overseas site but I can't remember the outcome but think it failed?

KieronF

This link has more information - Are Kodi boxes legal in the UK? How authorities are cracking down on 'plug and play' piracy - Mirror Online - But clearly the intent of the Premier League, FACT and Sky is to establish the legal precedent. Once they have a conviction and established case law with regard to the possession for sale of boxes equipped with add-ons or apps by which to stream copyrighted content then they will simply extend that case law to simple ownership. If their case in May succeeds - and the consensus is that it will, then it is almost certain to become an offence in the UK and the EU to have possession of a box equipped so as to allow the streaming of PL matches and Sky content - even if it is not used for that purpose. That is the key element in their legal argument otherwise it would be a simple defence to say that, while it might be capable of streaming content - it is never used for that purpose.

The Guy

The raid in Malaga mentioned in the first post actually took place in September last year... reports that no arrests were made and the investigation remains ongoing...so not exactly news...5 months later...apart from the release of the video.

But streaming website Rojadirecta has been ordered to close down this past few weeks....

KieronF

It was inevitable that the broadcasters were going to act at some point to protect their very expensive broadcasting rights and now that the Premier League is awash with broadcast rights money I expect them to be particularly pro-active in the coming months. Sky are in a different position - they find themselves in a dwindling marketplace that is increasingly dominated by streaming services such as Netflix and Amazon.


I imagine that Sky will be less pro-active but will be supporting the cost of legal action taken by the PL so that they can take advantage of the rulings that action produces. Whatever the outcome, the days are clearly numbered for the likes of Kodi.

Fred James

There are dozens of sellers on eBay.uk selling satellite receivers, fully loaded with a three year subscription to all the Sky channels for about £75 inclusive. There do not seem to have been any efforts at all to prevent these sales.

KieronF

That is probably due to the fact that the test-case is not due to be heard until May. That is a long delay for a case such as this and suggests that the Premier League and FACT are doing everything in their power to make sure their case is watertight in order to create a legal precedent. It will probably go to appeal, and in doing so create case-law - something that, again, perversely favours the PL.


Once they have established that precedent the floodgates for similar prosecutions will open ,however, in reality most cases will be dealt with by cease and desist letters threatening future action. The PL will be keen to act while the have the EU on their side so I would expect widespread action across Europe in the coming years.

Dondurma

There will always be ways around these things

I do not have a droidbox but have subscribed to a simple app for years which gets me all the free footy I need

bobd22

Kieron I don't see how that logically follows? There would be a stated case of prosecution for the sale of pre prepared Kodi boxes but not for ownership of such a box. Again from the article you quoted there is a stated case under EU law saying that the streaming of copyright material in itself is not illegal so long as not permenently recorded. It is of course an offence to stream to others such material. Personally I use my android box for visiting Spain and viewing TV content and to watch the odd film on a rainy day. I find it better to buy an unloaded box and put on only those addons I require, that way I am not wasting time updating programs I will never use.
I think the main thing realy about this case is those making profit from streaming copyright programs and those making profit from fully loading the boxes. You can go back to the 60's when we got the simple radio cassette and we all used to record the weekly top 20 songs, that was against copyright.

KieronF

The point of the EU court ruling was that streaming of freely available material, albeit copyright, was not in that instance illegal. The problem with Kodi and such like is that there is encryption that has to be defeated in order to access the material. That, I believe is the difference between the cases. The Top 20 was freely available to listen to but we could not (but did) record the tracks. Kodi and similar apps/add-ons are different in that there is a pro-active step between the broadcaster who encrypts and the end-user who has possession of a device that specifically overcomes that. That, I believe, is the issue at hand.

bobd22

Yes I understand and agree with all of that. But reality is technology has come on so far. Point I made re the taping of top 20 was that technology of the radio cassette player recorder meant it was simply a press of the button and you had a copy of the music. I am not sure your explanation is correct re the EU case. That case did deal with copyright material and from what I have read came to the view that streaming and viewing was not illegal. Those streaming of course do infringe copyright law and dependent on location get dealt with and closed.. The reason was given that streaming leaves no permanent copy on the device therefore no ownership of that material occurs by those streaming. Of course that is different if you record what you stream. Again main thing is one could copy and make profit from the material streamed. Again as far as I have found from looking at this issue in the UK no person as ever been prosecuted for simply streaming but some have who have recorded and profited such material. Next stage as you say is prosecuting those adapting for profit Kodi boxes etc.
As for TV again as far as I have read Filmon TV currently does not breach the law re UK TV (Freebies) as the programmes are not streamed live there is a slight delay which can be seen if you compare between say film on and live TV through iPlayer. There are addons such as ftv guide which one can add to Kodi which allow you to link a TV guide very similar to freeview to filmon TV so make it like watching normal TV with no requirement for VPN .
I think the main point of this pending prosecution is criminal profit and loss of revenue re the fully loaded boxes? Of course it is an ongoing situation with constantly changing technology.

The Guy

European Court of Justice ruling (or rather the Opinion of the Advocate General) on "Fully Loaded" boxes released today...

"In a CJEU reference involving the sale of a media player with pre-installed add-ons allowing users to stream films without authorisation from the copyright holder, the Advocate General has recommended that the principle established in GS Media, that the provision of a hyperlink to unauthorised content can in itself be infringing if done for profit or with knowledge that the content is infringing, should also apply to the supply of hardware. The Advocate General also recommended that the CJEU find that the streaming by the end user was not a transient or incidental temporary act of reproduction exempt from the general restriction under Article 2 of the Directive."

Hornets_Nest

My understanding is that at the moment in the UK it is still legal to stream content - it is the distributors of the content who are breaking the law and as they are all outside of the reach of UK authorities they will no doubt carry on as have ThePirateBay when it comes to torrent files.

If the authorities tried to start prosecuting individuals they would have a very large and often fruitless job on their hands as steaming is that widespread, People will simply start to mask their usage using VPNs and the like.

IMO Sky and the other subscription services would do better to make their products more affordable to attract customers who are currently streaming from other services. Long gone are the days when steaming sites offered a below par watching experience - they are mostly quite good providing you have decent internet speed (as with Sky).

I am a BT Sport customer and only yesterday I received an eMail saying from Aug my subscription will be £3.50PM ... excellent value.

Is Kodi legal? - Feature - PC Advisor

bobd22

From what The Guy it would seem that the CJEU ruling announced goes against what the PC Advisor link which is a couple of weeks old says. However I agree that to pursue someone simply streaming for viewing would be both very difficult and expensive for the authorities, no doubt why they so far have not done this. Those streaming for profit is different. Of course as your link says the morality of streaming for free is down to the individual.

KieronF

I think they realise that it would be impossible to prosecute (not track down - that is an easy matter) each individual who streams copyrighted content - so their intent must be to limit the availability of the boxes. That is all well and good, however, when a mainstream device such as an Amazon Fire Stick can be side-loaded with the likes of Kodi/Modbro in a matter of minutes, it makes a nonsense of the whole affair unless the fines prove to be prohibitive as the new CJEU ruling clearly states that streaming is not an innocent act.