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Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Old Jan 17th 2013, 12:50 pm
  #16  
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Originally Posted by cricketman View Post
If you are talking about Spain for the above than this is all nonsense

For a start, there hasnt been national service in Spain for years now. And second, anyone from the EU can adopt Spanish nationality if they are born in that country or if they have lived their 10 years.

As for racism, that depends what forums you visit. You can find hideous racist opinions from British or Spanish people if you go to the right forum. From time to time, one or two pop up on here.

From my day to day life I've heard a lot more racists opinions from Brits than from Spaniards. When I lived in the CDS I had a number of Brits tell me that they had moved to Spain to get away from all the foreigners
Quite so.

You can also get Spanish citizenship if you marry a Spaniard. I might go down that route eventually - but the thought of swearing allegiance to el Rey Juan Carlos is too awful to contemplate!
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Old Jan 17th 2013, 4:06 pm
  #17  
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

I have never seen a Morrocan driving a bus in Barcelona although many were born here and would have the required level of Catalan. There may a legal right to apply for the job but that does not mean you will be successful, or why you were rejected. There are many South Americans working as shop assistants but you will struggle to find any working in El Corte Ingles.

Unions are well represented in the public transport industry and it would not be surprising if there is a desire to keep jobs for “our own kind”, whether that includes Europeans you will not know until you apply. As for racism I offer you this snippet..

“Xavier Garcia Abiol, Mayor of Badalona, has defended the inspections of Pakistani shops...In their country perhaps it is normal to sell out of date food and and have the meat on sale side by side with the maggots, but in Badalona this has finished”.

http://www.minutodigital.com/2012/08...se-ha-acabado/

Having said that I find the Spanish generally to be as welcoming and hospitable as you will find anywhere, but times are difficult.
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Old Jan 17th 2013, 4:48 pm
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Originally Posted by guirijohn View Post
I have never seen a Morrocan driving a bus in Barcelona although many were born here and would have the required level of Catalan. There may a legal right to apply for the job but that does not mean you will be successful, or why you were rejected. There are many South Americans working as shop assistants but you will struggle to find any working in El Corte Ingles.

Unions are well represented in the public transport industry and it would not be surprising if there is a desire to keep jobs for “our own kind”, whether that includes Europeans you will not know until you apply. As for racism I offer you this snippet..

“Xavier Garcia Abiol, Mayor of Badalona, has defended the inspections of Pakistani shops...In their country perhaps it is normal to sell out of date food and and have the meat on sale side by side with the maggots, but in Badalona this has finished”.

http://www.minutodigital.com/2012/08...se-ha-acabado/

Having said that I find the Spanish generally to be as welcoming and hospitable as you will find anywhere, but times are difficult.
How do you know whether someone driving a bus is Morrocan, Catalan or Argentinean?

And I doubt many Morrocans were born in Spain, after all that would make them Spanish

Yes, the Badalona mayor is racist as is the mayor of Vic, who featured on Salvados a few years back

Immigrants have only been in Spain for 15 years in any kinds of large numbers, it takes until the 2nd generation to see them completely integrated, but if you watch TV there are already plenty of "ethnicities" on offer. There are British presenters, African presenters, Chinese presenters, Latin American presenters etc - not to mention music, cinema, the arts and sport
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Old Jan 17th 2013, 5:17 pm
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Originally Posted by guirijohn View Post
I have never seen a Morrocan driving a bus in Barcelona although many were born here and would have the required level of Catalan. There may a legal right to apply for the job but that does not mean you will be successful, or why you were rejected. There are many South Americans working as shop assistants but you will struggle to find any working in El Corte Ingles.

.
According to your article, immigrants make up 15% of the population in Barcelona, never mind bus driver, have you seen many immigrant judges, MP's, police, firemen, politicians, funcionarios, teachers, TV presenters etc? Never mind 15%, you'd be lucky to find 1%.
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Old Jan 17th 2013, 6:25 pm
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Spain does not recognize dual nationality with Morocco. Moroccans must renounce their Moroccan nationality to become Spanish nationals and this creates difficulties for them if they wish to visit, or return to Morocco. Moroccans therefore generally live in Spain as legal residents but stop short of being citizens. This is probably Mr Azaf´s point, Spain permits dual nationality for South Americans but not for Moroccans as well as requiring fewer years of residence.

It is curious that preference is given to Spain´s cultural ties with South America; Spain´s links with South America go back five hundred years, but North Africans ruled most of Spain for eight hundred years.
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Old Jan 18th 2013, 9:10 am
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Originally Posted by guirijohn View Post

It is curious that preference is given to Spain´s cultural ties with South America; Spain´s links with South America go back five hundred years, but North Africans ruled most of Spain for eight hundred years.
What a ridiculous point. Spaniards were immigrating in huge numbers to South American right up until the 1960s - and then in the past 20 years they have immigrated in huge numbers to Spain

Nothing like the relationship with Morroco
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Old Jan 18th 2013, 10:01 am
  #22  
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Actually it's not that ridiculous.

Both regions fought bitterly to rid themselves of the occupying powers.

Large numbers of Spanish emigrated to North Africa after the Reconquista when they were expelled for being Muslims or Jews.

Morocco was a Spanish protectorate for 40 years in the 20th century and lots of Moroccans emigrated to Spain then, and still do now.

Both regions maintain contentious trade agreements with their former occupiers(fishing rights with the Moroccans for example, oil and minerals in S. America).
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Old Jan 18th 2013, 5:44 pm
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Spain found America five hundred years ago. North Africans have had a continuing relationship with Spain for thousands of years, their DNA is in the Spanish population, their architecture is everywhere and the Spanish language has incorporated their words. More recently there was even a Moroccan regiment in the Spanish military and northern Morocco only ceased to be a Spanish colony in 1956.

Spain has absorbed and developed North African culture as its own whereas there is very little evidence of South American culture in Spain. “Chile con carne”, Mexican restaurants, etc. are better known in London than Spain. Spain is the European country which best reflects with the culture of both Africa and Europe. So to me it is ironic that priority now given to cultural links with South America, especially as Spanish emigration to the Americas killed of most of the native population and its culture. Sorry about the digression.
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Old Jan 18th 2013, 6:15 pm
  #24  
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

I agree accept for
Originally Posted by guirijohn View Post

Spain has absorbed and developed North African culture as its own whereas there is very little evidence of South American culture in Spain.
Despite wiping out most of the locals we managed to salvage potatoes, tomatoes, pimientos, maize, chocolate, pineapples, mangos ...

And these days most of the best literature written in Spanish comes from the Americas, no?

Then there is the music - salsa, rumba, merengue, tango ... All very popular here. Zumba comes from Columbia, there is a zumba plague in this country at the moment with sessions in every village!
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Old Jan 18th 2013, 6:33 pm
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Originally Posted by guirijohn View Post
. Spain is the European country which best reflects with the culture of both Africa and Europe.
Not surprising, "Africa empieza en los Pirineos".
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Old Jan 18th 2013, 6:47 pm
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Originally Posted by Pocaloca View Post


Then there is the music - salsa, rumba, merengue, tango ... All very popular here. Zumba comes from Columbia, there is a zumba plague in this country at the moment with sessions in every village!
Zumba may have come from Columbia but it's been popular for a few years in the USA. Even the cruise boats have been featuring it for years.
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Old Jan 18th 2013, 7:35 pm
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Originally Posted by jackytoo View Post
Zumba may have come from Columbia but it's been popular for a few years in the USA. Even the cruise boats have been featuring it for years.
And here, it's old hat now! But then Spain is several years behind!
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Old Jan 18th 2013, 7:43 pm
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Originally Posted by agoreira View Post
And here, it's old hat now! But then Spain is several years behind!
The new dance-based class is called Sh'Bam (b****y awful name). Supposed to burn off more calories per session than Zumba, but I haven't tried it yet. My health club offers all the Les Mills classes so gets all the new stuff at exactly the same time the UK does. It takes time for them to filter down to the local classes held in the villages, just as it would to get from the gyms to the local church hall or wherever in the UK.
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Old Jan 18th 2013, 7:56 pm
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Default Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Here's a question......let's say I took Spanish nationality (I'd be eligible in a couple of years)......would I then lose my right to my UK pension which is due in 6 years?
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Old Jan 19th 2013, 7:41 am
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Smile Re: Are Spanish nationals and Spanish citizens the same thing?

Originally Posted by Unmutual View Post
Here's a question......let's say I took Spanish nationality (I'd be eligible in a couple of years)......would I then lose my right to my UK pension which is due in 6 years?
No.
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