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Spain: Paradise lost

Spain: Paradise lost

Old Dec 1st 2009, 4:08 am
  #136  
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

Originally Posted by jackytoo
I suppose most of you read the spanish forums. Most spanish are in favour of demolitions calling the guiris alcoholics and peverts (wonder how some of our PC members would cope with some of the comments!!).

Originally Posted by agoreira
I bet there's a lot that don't read their forums and perhaps that's just as well. How many times have I read about Brits telling about their hordes of Spanish friends, how well they get on with everyone, blissfully unaware of a lot of the simmering discontent amongst the locals, without reading some of the hate spewed out in the forums. They all think they love us!
While I am sure there is a lot of resentment and even hatred among some of the spanish, I don't think that should be taken as representative of the population as a whole, and I'm sorry if that's been your experience here.

In just the same way, while you can read/hear Brits in the UK giving their opinions on how all the woes of the british economy are down to immigrants doesn't mean that the whole population hates them.

People are individuals
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Old Dec 1st 2009, 4:13 am
  #137  
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

Originally Posted by cricketman
I'm not missing the point at all...
Yes you are!

Originally Posted by cricketman
We live in a free European market. British people are free to go and live and work in Spain and Poland - and they are free to work in Britian
Doesn't mean it's a good thing, just because we can doesn't mean we should!

Leave them too it
Originally Posted by cricketman
Of course Poles may be able to work for cheaper, but it benefits the British economy, it means people get better work for a lower price - and makes British companies more competitive as they'll need to buk up their ideas
Just exactly how is the economy of the UK benefited from this and how do companies "buck up" to compete?
Originally Posted by cricketman
Many British people complain because they are either underskilled or lazy.
I've never heard anyone complain they are "underskilled", I welcome skilled workers where there is a shortage, I don't welcome boat loads of people coming over to do the jobs that the average worker was happily doing.
Originally Posted by cricketman
You can still get a job picking crops in Britian for a good hour wage - as you can in Spain, but the local people refuse to do it.

Do let foreigners come and do it, it benefits everyone
What do you consider a "good hourly wage"? I can only assume you have thought about the cost of living in those areas, possibly there wasn't a fair wage offered in the first place maybe, you tell me.


Originally Posted by agoreira
Or write hopefully, with your spelling!

funny you should say that, I made a comment last night to my OH that I keep having to google basic words now as I´m getting confused with languages lol
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Old Dec 1st 2009, 4:40 am
  #138  
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

I think the main objection that the British have to immigrants coming in and taking their jobs, is a valid one.

The company can offer crap wages, because the immigrants will take the jobs and claim top up benefits to make up their wage to a liveable level.

Of course the top up money comes out of taxes which is always has been and mainly still is paid by the long term British workforce.
So in effect, the tax payer is subsidising the foreign worker with working tax credit etc, while at the same time seeing them undercut the local workforce.

The main difference between this and a Brit taking a Spaniards job is, that if the job is badly paid, there are not top up benefits, so the Spanish taxpayer is not being fleeced in the same way to support "incomers" who have not contributed to the system.
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Old Dec 1st 2009, 4:46 am
  #139  
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

Originally Posted by Madridboy

funny you should say that, I made a comment last night to my OH that I keep having to google basic words now as I´m getting confused with languages lol
Yes, I often get similar English and Spanish words the wrong way around, but how do you explain "North Hamptonshire"? There is no such county as Hamptonshire, north or south.
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Old Dec 1st 2009, 4:47 am
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

Originally Posted by JLFS
I think the main objection that the British have to immigrants coming in and taking their jobs, is a valid one.

The company can offer crap wages, because the immigrants will take the jobs and claim top up benefits to make up their wage to a liveable level.

Of course the top up money comes out of taxes which is always has been and mainly still is paid by the long term British workforce.
So in effect, the tax payer is subsidising the foreign worker with working tax credit etc, while at the same time seeing them undercut the local workforce.

The main difference between this and a Brit taking a Spaniards job is, that if the job is badly paid, there are not top up benefits, so the Spanish taxpayer is not being fleeced in the same way to support "incomers" who have not contributed to the system.
The benefit argument is a valid point. Although there are plenty of Brits who are happy making a living of the back of that

I'm undecided about the benefit system and which is better, the British or the Spanish system
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Old Dec 1st 2009, 4:51 am
  #141  
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

Originally Posted by agoreira
Yes, I often get similar English and Spanish words the wrong way around, but how do you explain "North Hamptonshire"? There is no such county as Hamptonshire, north or south.
Northamptonshire

It's a sad state of affairs when your Spanish OH has to remind you how to spell as well.
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Old Dec 1st 2009, 4:52 am
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

Originally Posted by JLFS
Of course the top up money comes out of taxes which is always has been and mainly still is paid by the long term British workforce.
I agree. I have often heard the argument put forward that whilst they are working here they are paying tax into the system, but of course those on low wages pay very little tax, but are eligible for tax credits and child allowance etc. I'm no tax expert, but I'm guessing they stand to get a lot more back than they ever pay in.
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Old Dec 1st 2009, 4:55 am
  #143  
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

Originally Posted by agoreira
Yes, I often get similar English and Spanish words the wrong way around, but how do you explain "North Hamptonshire"? There is no such county as Hamptonshire, north or south.
Shame really though, isn't it? There's a Hampton Palace I understand, so maybe we should press for a North Hamptonshire...
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Old Dec 1st 2009, 4:58 am
  #144  
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

Originally Posted by cricketman
The benefit argument is a valid point. Although there are plenty of Brits who are happy making a living of the back of that
I'm undecided about the benefit system and which is better, the British or the Spanish system

That is another valid point about the British who live of the system, and a good argument for the fact that, the British taxpayer is already supporting the home grown benefit claimants, without having to import more from other countries.
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Old Dec 1st 2009, 5:07 am
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

Originally Posted by agoreira
Or write hopefully, with your spelling!
Love it They have such high-flying jobs too and spend most of their time on this forum, trawling jobsites or wikepedia.

Is no-one moderating this thread it is OFF TOPIC

The Polish do seem very good workers though
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Old Dec 1st 2009, 5:19 am
  #146  
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

Originally Posted by jackytoo
Love it They have such high-flying jobs too and spend most of their time on this forum, trawling jobsites or wikepedia.

Is no-one moderating this thread it is OFF TOPIC

The Polish do seem very good workers though
It breaks up my day
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Old Dec 1st 2009, 5:23 am
  #147  
 
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

Originally Posted by jackytoo

Is no-one moderating this thread it is OFF TOPIC
Yes, it is way off topic.

Let's keep to the original question otherwise I will close the thread.
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Old Dec 1st 2009, 5:26 am
  #148  
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

One of the points in favor of the EU is the free movement of people and trade.

In fact the whole world.

Whilst its sad that people loose jobs, its not a right granted to everybody.

Work is meant to be found, not handed on a plate.

The days of generation after generation doing the same job for the same company went long ago.

Polish don`t just walk into work, its business and if they offer a service, then either beat it or move on.

Its a fact of business life, if you were to open a successful shop, within weeks a competitor is likely to open nearby.

Now there likely to be foreign.

Takeaways in the UK are a prime example, there is nothing wrong with an English fish shop selling Chinese Food, but do they, not likely.

Most now are Indian, Chinese and Kebabs, but at least the Arabs have learn`t business, most Kebab shops in my area sell Indian and Pizzas.

And now there all suffering because Asda`s (mainly) and Tesco now sell Insian and Chinese style takeaways for less and now the takeaways are selling up or closing down.

Soon I`ll be able to buy bog rolls in Mcdoners.
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Old Dec 1st 2009, 6:13 am
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Default Re: Spain: Paradise lost

OK, since you choose to ignore my request the thread is closed.
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