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Spain is the best country in Europe...

Spain is the best country in Europe...

Old Mar 25th 2011, 1:32 pm
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

Unfortunately it's not just Dentists that are poor compared to what they were years ago. I was in Hospital in the UK about 10 years ago, long story but went in for a simple thing and they ended up stuck inside me ripping tubes off and they had to cut me open to sort out my insides and retrieve their tools after their cock up, I had to be transferred to ICU miles away as no beds where I was, when I got back to my local hospital, the nurses were more interested in what they did last night, and the toilets and things were filthy with blood all over the floors.

Compare this to treatment I have just had in Hungary, I went to my local Doc she gave me the consultants number, I phoned him, he told me to come in, and it was all systems go, I had some stuff done there and then, no coming back in a month or so for treatment, I was then moved to another hospital, I was in for about a month and treated like Royalty, had my own private room TV Internet the lot (a little extra cost for this though) I am still treated like royalty when I go for check ups, the doctor will come over to me and apologise profusely if they see me waiting in a que, Always greet me with hand shakes and pats on the back, I can not praise them enough, my only gripe is, in the UK they want you out of your bed fast, here they tend to want you in for an necessarily long time. I got signed off this week.

When you go through this abroad it is not hard to see where I would rather be.

Oh yeah and just taxed my car for the year last week less than 18 quid.

Last edited by anonimouse; Mar 25th 2011 at 2:58 pm.
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Old Mar 25th 2011, 11:22 pm
  #107  
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

Originally Posted by JLFS View Post
I always thought that working people have always had to pay for dental treatment, there were certain groups that always had it free, but I remember when my wife was preganant, everybody said "OOH GREAT NOW YOU CAN HAVE FREE DENTAL TREATMENT" because befor although it was NHS we still had to pay a percentage of the treatment.
I stand corrected

I didn't actually mean 'free', rather low cost as the treatment was subsidised.
I always had to pay for treatment but it was less than the the cost of paying privately. I think there is maximum you have to pay for a full course of treatment, though I'm not sure what that limit was or now is.
In the part of the country I come from it's been virtually impossible to get on the books of a NHS dentist for many years!

Last edited by megmet; Mar 25th 2011 at 11:31 pm.
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Old Mar 27th 2011, 3:11 am
  #108  
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

Originally Posted by Dick Dasterdly View Post
I think you shoud check out the levels of grants Spain has received over the years, for many years being by far the biggest net benefactor at the expense of countries like the UK.
Some of the funds have been wisely spent on roads and railways, however quite a lot in the agricultural dept are open to question, much of it squandered on big time investors with little interest in farming but more in quick and easy profits from the fat grants they received, but never justified.
How about agriculture? By joining the EU, the EU puts limitations in Spain. Limited our industrial sector, shipbuilding, fisheries, agriculture ... Yes, the agriculture also. Benefits for Spanish farmers to join the EU? None. At least, to the little farmer? None. Since then they have been in decline. Because for starters, to enter the EU had to limit quotas, and millions of fruit trees were removed. Had to produce less

And not only this, is that in addition to Spanish farmers were required to modernize the agricultural facilities. Many have spent a fortune on upgrading their land, installing drip irrigation, etc. etc. And for what? At the end, for nothing. Now, large corporations now pay them a pittance for their product, and then sold in large supermarkets at the price of gold. Or to allow facilities to foreign products. A Spanish farmers have been required of all: modernization, monitoring of their products ... And for what? For nothing. I mean, a brutal sanitary requirements, and now the glorious EU will allow the entry of foreigners products (for example, moroccan) without ever put them tariffs, nor sanitary, etc etc etc. This is protectionism in the EU with Spanish farmers?

This is a lie
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Old Mar 27th 2011, 8:49 am
  #109  
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

Originally Posted by Relampago View Post
How about agriculture? By joining the EU, the EU puts limitations in Spain. Limited our industrial sector, shipbuilding, fisheries, agriculture ... Yes, the agriculture also. Benefits for Spanish farmers to join the EU? None. At least, to the little farmer? None. Since then they have been in decline. Because for starters, to enter the EU had to limit quotas, and millions of fruit trees were removed. Had to produce less

And not only this, is that in addition to Spanish farmers were required to modernize the agricultural facilities. Many have spent a fortune on upgrading their land, installing drip irrigation, etc. etc. And for what? At the end, for nothing. Now, large corporations now pay them a pittance for their product, and then sold in large supermarkets at the price of gold. Or to allow facilities to foreign products. A Spanish farmers have been required of all: modernization, monitoring of their products ... And for what? For nothing. I mean, a brutal sanitary requirements, and now the glorious EU will allow the entry of foreigners products (for example, moroccan) without ever put them tariffs, nor sanitary, etc etc etc. This is protectionism in the EU with Spanish farmers?

This is a lie
Most of the problems in the Spanish agricultural section have been caused through the sheer greed of many of those involved.
Greed to grab all the massive handouts given to them by the EU.,much greater than for any other country at the time.
I have seen costings related to the orange farmers you mention for instance.
The handouts in many cases have covered virtually all the costs involved in setting up a new plantation plus the costs of the first four years of maintenance and production.
The payments they received could include everything involved in the clearing of a piece of useless,waste land, levelling it all out, trucking in massive quantities of top soil,fixing drainage systems,new perimiter fences and walls,new buildings to hold the equipment and handle the produce, some of them very strangely resembling houses with all mod cons by the way, on top of all of which even more money to cover virtually all the costs involved during the first few years, quite substantial to say the very least !
Those who have taken full advantage probably couldn't care a toss about the price of oranges, because they have had a piece of useless land converted into an extremely valuable asset c/w associated buildings and numerous other facilities.
Granted there are quite a lot of old-timers who just tried to plod on as they were, without grabbing all the available grants, and things no doubt have been very difficult for them, but only because of the greed of their fellow countrymen.
I could continue the same theme with regard to bananas and tomatoes in the Canaries and other instance of multi million grants that have produced absolutuly nothing, apart from making some Spanish guys very happy and very rich, or maybe Spanish fishermen hoovering the seas throughout European waters.
Maybe I should even write a book on it sometime.
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Old Mar 27th 2011, 9:02 am
  #110  
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

Oh, and by the way it's not so many years ago I spent some time around your neck of the woods.
It was truly amazing how many dairy farmers with small herds of cows, say twenty or thirty max had just built superb new villas to replace their farmhouses, most of which still looked to be in fairly good order anyway and no doubt able to improve their income even further.
Farming can be tough as I well know myself, and there is no guarantee of profit on a year to year basis, but for those who have had their assets increased by multiple factors thanks to crazy EU handouts, I think should get over it OK.
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Old Mar 27th 2011, 9:19 am
  #111  
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

Originally Posted by Relampago View Post
How about agriculture? By joining the EU, the EU puts limitations in Spain. Limited our industrial sector, shipbuilding, fisheries, agriculture ... Yes, the agriculture also. Benefits for Spanish farmers to join the EU? None. At least, to the little farmer? None. Since then they have been in decline. Because for starters, to enter the EU had to limit quotas, and millions of fruit trees were removed. Had to produce less
Ive obviously been a bit dim here. You're saying that the reason that there are so many oranges left to rot on trees around here rather than be picked, is because of EU control? I've been complaining about it for years, saying what a complete waste it is
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Old Mar 27th 2011, 9:51 am
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

I have often seen them plough melons into the ground too...the EU is crazy.

Why is it that a sack of oranges can be bought for a few euro and cafe's selling "fresh" squeezed orange juice charge 3 euro or more
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Old Mar 27th 2011, 9:57 am
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

Originally Posted by jackytoo View Post
I have often seen them plough melons into the ground too...the EU is crazy.

Why is it that a sack of oranges can be bought for a few euro and cafe's selling "fresh" squeezed orange juice charge 3 euro or more
The same way I suppose that sugared water costing 5p to make (eg coke, fanta) can be sold at 2 or 3 euros or pounds. It's called markup, and establishments do it to pay their staff wages and to make money. Hope that helps!
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Old Mar 27th 2011, 11:06 am
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

Originally Posted by jackytoo View Post
I have often seen them plough melons into the ground too...the EU is crazy.

Why is it that a sack of oranges can be bought for a few euro and cafe's selling "fresh" squeezed orange juice charge 3 euro or more
Normally around 1.50 around here Although yes 3 euros is about right for a cafeteria in the middle of a city
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Old Mar 28th 2011, 10:17 am
  #115  
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

Originally Posted by anonimouse View Post
Unfortunately it's not just Dentists that are poor compared to what they were years ago. I was in Hospital in the UK about 10 years ago, long story but went in for a simple thing and they ended up stuck inside me ripping tubes off and they had to cut me open to sort out my insides and retrieve their tools after their cock up, I had to be transferred to ICU miles away as no beds where I was, when I got back to my local hospital, the nurses were more interested in what they did last night, and the toilets and things were filthy with blood all over the floors.

Compare this to treatment I have just had in Hungary, I went to my local Doc she gave me the consultants number, I phoned him, he told me to come in, and it was all systems go, I had some stuff done there and then, no coming back in a month or so for treatment, I was then moved to another hospital, I was in for about a month and treated like Royalty, had my own private room TV Internet the lot (a little extra cost for this though) I am still treated like royalty when I go for check ups, the doctor will come over to me and apologise profusely if they see me waiting in a que, Always greet me with hand shakes and pats on the back, I can not praise them enough, my only gripe is, in the UK they want you out of your bed fast, here they tend to want you in for an necessarily long time. I got signed off this week.

When you go through this abroad it is not hard to see where I would rather be.

Oh yeah and just taxed my car for the year last week less than 18 quid.
I bet you didn't get that for free though, you could have had all that in the UK, in any private hospital.
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Old Mar 28th 2011, 10:48 am
  #116  
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

Originally Posted by anonimouse View Post
Compare this to treatment I have just had in Hungary, I went to my local Doc she gave me the consultants number, I phoned him, he told me to come in, and it was all systems go, I had some stuff done there and then, no coming back in a month or so for treatment, I was then moved to another hospital, I was in for about a month and treated like Royalty, had my own private room TV Internet the lot (a little extra cost for this though) I am still treated like royalty when I go for check ups, the doctor will come over to me and apologise profusely if they see me waiting in a que, Always greet me with hand shakes and pats on the back, I can not praise them enough, my only gripe is, in the UK they want you out of your bed fast, here they tend to want you in for an necessarily long time. I got signed off this week.

When you go through this abroad it is not hard to see where I would rather be.

Oh yeah and just taxed my car for the year last week less than 18 quid.
Originally Posted by mikelincs View Post
I bet you didn't get that for free though, you could have had all that in the UK, in any private hospital.
As my husband was down as my dependant his treatment was free in Spain. He was ill for several weeks before he visited the doctor who ordered blood test etc, when the results came back she sent him to urgencias who admitted him immediately for more tests. When these results were known he was told to go home for 4 days to put his affairs in order as the operation he needed was very dangerous. He was treated as an important person with handshakes and pats on the back throughout the hospitalisation, in fact the ward staff would always welcome him back like a long lost friend (due to being there so much). Sometimes he was kept in hospital when we thought that it was unnecessary and sometimes sent home when we thought that he should not have been. On one of the occasions when he was sent home too soon he was back in within 8 hours so we were right. The way he was treated in general was beyond reproach. I think that if we had been in the UK there would have been too much delay in the beginning and whenever there was a difficulty which means that I think that he would not be alive now.

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Old Mar 28th 2011, 11:13 am
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

Originally Posted by The Oddities View Post
As my husband was down as my dependant his treatment was free in Spain. He was ill for several weeks before he visited the doctor who ordered blood test etc, when the results came back she sent him to urgencias who admitted him immediately for more tests. When these results were known he was told to go home for 4 days to put his affairs in order as the operation he needed was very dangerous. He was treated as an important person with handshakes and pats on the back throughout the hospitalisation, in fact the ward staff would always welcome him back like a long lost friend (due to being there so much). Sometimes he was kept in hospital when we thought that it was unnecessary and sometimes sent home when we thought that he should not have been. On one of the occasions when he was sent home too soon he was back in within 8 hours so we were right. The way he was treated in general was beyond reproach. I think that if we had been in the UK there would have been too much delay in the beginning and whenever there was a difficulty which means that I think that he would not be alive now.

Rosemary
I realise that Rosemary, it was a reply to the person stating that his Hungarian treatment was a lot better than the NHS.
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Old Mar 28th 2011, 11:20 am
  #118  
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

There are horror stories every week in the spanish press about health service treatment, as there are in the UK and maybe every country in the world!

My OH had excellent treatment in Spain. He used to be a volunteer at the CDS hospital and could tell a few horror stories himself. I am not sure if private treatment is always better, I think they sometimes do unneccesary procedures when you are covered...money grabbers!
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Old Mar 28th 2011, 11:51 am
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

Originally Posted by mikelincs View Post
I realise that Rosemary, it was a reply to the person stating that his Hungarian treatment was a lot better than the NHS.
Yes I realised that and the fact that you informed him that if in UK under private health that he would have got the same sort of treatment. I was trying to say (badly probably) that our experience of Spanish health care (free not paying) was similar to to the Hungarian experience and used your post for emphasis.

Everyone will have different experiences of each of the countries mentioned. When my OH was in for the first round of tests we talked to a Spanish man who had experience of being in hospital in UK and he told us that there were no Spanish speakers to help him out. So I think that all of us who have been lucky enough to have some form of help from a Spanish person speaking English should be extremely gradeful.

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Old Mar 28th 2011, 3:38 pm
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Default Re: Spain is the best country in Europe...

Originally Posted by The Oddities View Post
When my OH was in for the first round of tests we talked to a Spanish man who had experience of being in hospital in UK and he told us that there were no Spanish speakers to help him out. So I think that all of us who have been lucky enough to have some form of help from a Spanish person speaking English should be extremely gradeful
Whilst I agree with you totally that the treatment is better here than the UK, having experienced bungled operations and bad nursing myself that put an end to my working life....
There is a translation telephone service in the UK just as there is here, and just like here not many people know about it.
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