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The Real News is Disturbing

The Real News is Disturbing

Old Oct 30th 2014, 3:42 pm
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Default The Real News is Disturbing

There has been a large number of corruption stories in the Spanish press in the last few weeks - ignored for some reason by the English freebies. In reality, things are getting pretty bad with the President actually having to apologise to the Spanish people on Tuesday about the situation, as various ex-worthies were banged up by the judiciary (no bankers though - phew!). The leader of the opposition foolishly tried to make a little hay, only to be told by Rajoy 'yah, and your lot are even worse' (He's right, they are).
Things are so bad now that a group of long-hairs who call themselves 'Podemos' (We Can!), have now pulled forward, past the PSOE and the PP, as the first political power in Spain in intention of vote.
Are the freebies going to report the real news now?
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Old Oct 30th 2014, 3:56 pm
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Default Re: The Real News is Disturbing

Originally Posted by Lenox View Post
Are the freebies going to report the real news now?
You can follow it all in El Pais very easily, nothing is hidden

But yes, Podemos are an exciting and terrifying prospect. They would be the most left-ish government elected in Europe ever I think (other communist groups tended to get in through revolution)

Some of the things in their manifesto include banning private health and education. Effectively taxing foreign assets at 100%. And much higher tax rates overall. So expats should be worried!

They are very democratic though, but if they get elected I am not sure whether I could stay in the country!

Last edited by cricketman; Oct 30th 2014 at 3:59 pm.
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Old Oct 30th 2014, 4:11 pm
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Default Re: The Real News is Disturbing

Hi Cricketman - I agree: head for the hills!!
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Old Oct 31st 2014, 12:01 pm
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Default Re: The Real News is Disturbing

haha it`s like the wild west. Bring on the good, the bad and the ugly music...me to I`m off to the hills and living with the jackals
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Old Nov 1st 2014, 7:03 am
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Default Re: The Real News is Disturbing

Cricketman, could you please explain how they can tax anything at 100% please? In effect that means you own nothing and they own everything! Nobody in their right mind you stand for that. Just look at the UK under Labour back in the 70's when income tax for the wealthy was 75%.
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Old Nov 1st 2014, 8:34 am
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Default Re: The Real News is Disturbing

Originally Posted by Bri and Katee View Post
Cricketman, could you please explain how they can tax anything at 100% please? In effect that means you own nothing and they own everything! Nobody in their right mind you stand for that. Just look at the UK under Labour back in the 70's when income tax for the wealthy was 75%.
You understand that, I understand that.
But do the politicians?
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Old Nov 1st 2014, 9:18 am
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Default Re: The Real News is Disturbing

Gosh I have just signed a long term rental so perhaps pay the penalty clause and withdraw. However I then have two options stay in the UK and with UKIP set to win the Rochester by-election or go to our house in France and Hollande.

Fantastic choice. When please is the election in Spain?
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Old Nov 2nd 2014, 6:30 pm
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Default Re: The Real News is Disturbing

The Guardian and the Financial Times carried articles in the last week but I suspect they are not well read in Spain and let's face it, it's not new news is it? Corruption seems to be an art form in Spain. Tax at 100%? - take off the personal allowances and there is still something to tax though whether there will be people left to tax is another issue.
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Old Nov 2nd 2014, 7:02 pm
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Default Re: The Real News is Disturbing

Erm, just a thought, but isn't it actually a good thing if more corruption arrests are being brought to trial?

Maybe some of you haven't been around that long, but it seems to me that more corruption arrests and convictions have been conducted in the past 5 years than the past 50. I'd call that a "trend".

...or is it simply that we hear of more arrests, so we assume there's more going around... whilst in reality, there was far more of it in previous times - and the fact that so few were arrested is a testament to it...

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Old Nov 2nd 2014, 7:24 pm
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That may or may not be the case. But it is not the arrests and allegations it is the findings and what happens to the guys who allegedly conspired to defraud.

A slap on the wrist does nothing for a society who accept that alleged fraud goes with the Latin culture. In the UK it could be life.

This am and on BBC news in London the Vice President of the newly formed EU Commission was pushed hard as to a variety of issues. He skirted around the problem but admitted that France Italy and Spain has not woken up and smelt the coffee.

I know France well and after 35 years. There the Common Agricultural Policy and the State owning EDF SNCF and the like restricts competition. Then hypermarket's cannot sell painkillers for that is the domain of the pharmacists. Then house sales are the domain of the highly paid and exclusive Notaires who have been to the appropriate Universities in Paris.

They have been on strike in that the 5th Republique wish to open up the system for competition to evolve.

Then the Post Office in France and if you work outside you can retire at 50 then if you work inside at 55. Air France you can retired at 45.

If we are protectionist what chance equality egalitie and freedom.

In 1787 the masses took to the guillotine and that is what Hollande and the like have no undercarriage for a fight.

France I love but it frustrates me - sorry to digress.
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Old Nov 3rd 2014, 8:31 am
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Default Re: The Real News is Disturbing

Originally Posted by Bri and Katee View Post
Cricketman, could you please explain how they can tax anything at 100% please? In effect that means you own nothing and they own everything! Nobody in their right mind you stand for that. Just look at the UK under Labour back in the 70's when income tax for the wealthy was 75%.
Well, most of the things are rumours at the moment, but we must be aware that Podemos are basically a communist party (I am not exagerrating). Their roots are in communism and their policies are a democratic form of communism

Nothing wrong with that, in fact I will vote for them when allowed as will my wife

Some of their manifesto pledges are introducing a universal income, increasing minimum wage to around 1,000 euros per month and introducing a maximum wage of 20 times the minimum wage. They will also only pay the national debt back which they deem to be "legal", will ban tax havens and private education and heath cover and re-introduce border controls.

They will also demand greater autonomy from Europe or say they will leave. They threaten to re-nationalise a lot of public services and industries unless they promise to deliver accessible services to the poorest in society

At the moment Podemos are leading the polls. If they get in I think it is no exageration to say that it will change the entire world

Their policies will be very expensive and when asked who will pay for it they say "the rich" which is rather naive, but basically they say the rich should either pay a lot more taxes or get lost because they don't want them in the country

Last edited by cricketman; Nov 3rd 2014 at 8:34 am.
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Old Nov 3rd 2014, 8:52 am
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Default Re: The Real News is Disturbing

Originally Posted by cricketman View Post
Well, most of the things are rumours at the moment, but we must be aware that Podemos are basically a communist party (I am not exagerrating). Their roots are in communism and their policies are a democratic form of communism

Nothing wrong with that, in fact I will vote for them when allowed as will my wife

Some of their manifesto pledges are introducing a universal income, increasing minimum wage to around 1,000 euros per month and introducing a maximum wage of 20 times the minimum wage. They will also only pay the national debt back which they deem to be "legal", will ban tax havens and private education and heath cover and re-introduce border controls.

They will also demand greater autonomy from Europe or say they will leave. They threaten to re-nationalise a lot of public services and industries unless they promise to deliver accessible services to the poorest in society

At the moment Podemos are leading the polls. If they get in I think it is no exageration to say that it will change the entire world

Their policies will be very expensive and when asked who will pay for it they say "the rich" which is rather naive, but basically they say the rich should either pay a lot more taxes or get lost because they don't want them in the country
They will not 'change the world' but they would impoverish Spain. When you promise to tax all income over roughly $300,000 annually where is the new growth going to come from? No one will start an IT business in Spain under those conditions, hell even France would be better.
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Old Nov 3rd 2014, 9:17 am
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Default Re: The Real News is Disturbing

Originally Posted by Beaverstate View Post
They will not 'change the world' but they would impoverish Spain. When you promise to tax all income over roughly $300,000 annually where is the new growth going to come from? No one will start an IT business in Spain under those conditions, hell even France would be better.
Their argument is that with 200,000 euros per year you can live "de puta madre" so why would you even need any more? To be honest, I agree. I earn about 60k per year here in Spain and feel very well off. Of course in London or New York it would be very different

Remember that society in Spain gives you lots of things for free especially under Podemos; health, education, child and elderly care etc.

Only 30 years ago the average CEO earned between 10-20 times that of the lowest paid worker, so what they are suggesting is reasonable.

Of course this is a very dangerous game Podemos are playing regarding business investment but the Spanish people are fed up of being spat upon by corporations, politicians and bankers. I support them

I can't wait to see what happens. Once people across the world see what has been possible in Spain under real democracy then they may start to think that they want a slice of that for themselves
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Old Nov 3rd 2014, 9:32 am
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Default Re: The Real News is Disturbing

Originally Posted by cricketman View Post
Their argument is that with 200,000 euros per year you can live "de puta madre" so why would you even need any more? To be honest, I agree. I earn about 60k per year here in Spain and feel very well off. Of course in London or New York it would be very different

Remember that society in Spain gives you lots of things for free especially under Podemos; health, education, child and elderly care etc.

Only 30 years ago the average CEO earned between 10-20 times that of the lowest paid worker, so what they are suggesting is reasonable.

Of course this is a very dangerous game Podemos are playing regarding business investment but the Spanish people are fed up of being spat upon by corporations, politicians and bankers. I support them

I can't wait to see what happens. Once people across the world see what has been possible in Spain under real democracy then they may start to think that they want a slice of that for themselves
The first paragraph isn't free, it is paid for from the taxes of growing companies Spain will NEED.

Second paragraph' the business model of then vs the business model now is radically different.

Third paragraph, the Spanish people can be fed up with corporations and bankers all they want, but it will only be the NEW corporations that will provide them the jobs and wealth needed to fund paragraph one.

Paragraph four...You sir are deluding yourself, quite unlikely the world will be following Spains example.
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Old Nov 3rd 2014, 9:37 am
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Default Re: The Real News is Disturbing

Originally Posted by Beaverstate View Post
The first paragraph isn't free, it is paid for from the taxes of growing companies Spain will NEED.

Second paragraph' the business model of then vs the business model now is radically different.

Third paragraph, the Spanish people can be fed up with corporations and bankers all they want, but it will only be the NEW corporations that will provide them the jobs and wealth needed to fund paragraph one.

Paragraph four...You sir are deluding yourself, quite unlikely the world will be following Spains example.
You need to read their manifesto but I don't think it exists in English. They want to invest more in research and investment and create the companies from within Spain rather than with external investment, but let's see. If I had said 6 months ago that from the 15-M movement a democratic communist party would grow and be leading the polls in Spain, you would have called me deluded

Podemos are showing that anything is possible, they are giving people hope

I am sceptical too because they are challenging the liberal capitalist model and creating a new paradigm, but it was about time that it was challenged, it was a long time coming! So let's see what happens.

My bet is that the US will send someone to kill Pablo Iglesias before the end of the year

Last edited by cricketman; Nov 3rd 2014 at 9:39 am.
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