Property Fraud
 

Yesterday I went on a photo walk in central Birmingham.

I got chatting to one of the guys there and he happened to mention he had moved back from abroad. In the conversation it turned out that he had invested his life savings in properties in Spain through a property developer and that the developer actually stole the money through a network of builders/estateagents/solicitors that it appears were all working together.

I'm sharing this because the guy was clearly on the verge of being made homeless in the UK because of what happened. He's done an ebook on the whole story

I guess Rosemary & Fred can take this down if they don't think it is ineresting or appropriate. You can buy the ebook on amazon, but thats not why I'm posting the link (which is a preview), it's just so you can see a short resume of what happened to him and how it almost bought him to suicide and possible homelessness

FlipBook

"It deals with the issue of international property fraud. What is it like to lose your wealth to a corporate monster? I trusted, only to have my home stolen from underneath my feet to satisfy their rich lifestyles? Find out, read this book, could they have driven me to suicide. I have had to live through the memory of this every second for that last six years"

Re: Property Fraud
 

started reading but nothing new, people will always want more.. some get it... some do not..... will we ever learn?

A boat was docked in a tiny Mexican fishing village.
A tourist complimented the local fishermen on the quality of their fish and... asked how long it took to catch them.
"Not very long" they answered in unison....
"Why didn't you stay out longer and catch more?"
The fishermen explained that their small catches were sufficient to meet their needs and those of their families.
"But what do you do with the rest of your time?"
"We sleep late, fish a little, play with our children, and take siestas with our wives. In the evenings, we go into the village to see our friends, have a few drinks, play the guitar, and sing a few songs.
We have a full life."
The tourist interrupted, "I have an MBA from Harvard and I can help you! You should start by fishing longer every day. You can then sell the extra fish you catch. With the extra revenue, you can buy a bigger boat."
"And after that?"
"With the extra money the larger boat will bring, you can buy a second one and a third one and so on until you have an entire fleet of trawlers.
Instead of selling your fish to a middle man, you can then negotiate directly with the processing plants and maybe even open your own plant. You can then leave this little village and move to Mexico City, Los Angeles, or even New York City!!! From there you can direct your huge new enterprise."
"How long would that take?"
"Twenty, perhaps twenty-five years." replied the tourist.
"And after that?"
"Afterwards? Well my friend, that's when it gets really interesting," answered the tourist, laughing. "When your business gets really big, you can start buying and selling stocks and make millions!"
"Millions? Really? And after that?" asked the fishermen.
"After that you'll be able to retire, live in a tiny village near the coast, sleep late, play with your children, catch a few fish, take a siesta with your wife and spend your evenings drinking and enjoying your friends."
"With all due respect sir, but that's exactly what we are doing now. So what's the point wasting twenty-five years?" asked the Mexicans.
And the moral of this story is:
Know where you're going in life, you may already be there! Many times in life, money is not everything.
“Live your life before life becomes lifeless”

Re: Property Fraud
 

So badly written and full of sh**te. If it wasn't such a sad tale it would be hilarious.

Re: Property Fraud
 

From what I understand he did everything like we all tell people to do it, just got caught by unscrupulous people

To be honest it is a sad tale, and I dont really care that it's badly written if it drives home the point to people that might be thinking of doing such a thing.

Re: Property Fraud
 

Well not quite. He walked into a Spanish property show in the UK.

Re: Property Fraud
 

We did that too :o

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And did you also use a solicitor with a connection to the developer and agent?

I am pretty sure that's not the advice given here.

Re: Property Fraud
 

Property fraud is so rare in Spain, that the UK government recently appointed a special overseas property advisor to help deal with the lack of scams and to better understand how to help those who haven't been ripped off.

British government intervenes to help expats caught in Spanish property scams - Telegraph

Re: Property Fraud
 

Oh for Gods sake

He walked into a property show in the Uk. NOT a law against it
Then he used a solicitor, and did it the right way. His mistake, if you like, was niavity in that he believed it would be handled correctly by solicitors

Re: Property Fraud
 

He is not the only one who thought a Spanish solicitor would act in a professional way in the interests of his client. Nor I suspect did he envisage other Spanish crooks would be complicit in this sad situation. I can sympathise with the author and it is comforting to see that Horlics who finds generalisation such an anathema, giving a detailed and informed review.

I hope others read this account as it will hopefully avert more disasters. My Spanish nightmare is nearly at an end and I am being optimistic when I say I will just about fill my car to return to England with what I have left from a not too dissimilar situation.

Re: Property Fraud
 

You should read the book you recommend to us.

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Pete,

No generalisations here, I am talking about one specific case. I read the book, did you?

Re: Property Fraud
 

I'll be clearer about my thoughts on this.

I think the person in question is very unfortunate indeed to have become involved with these people. Clearly, they were not operating honestly and if such a thing as karma exists, they shouldn't be sleeping very soundly.

What I am arguing is that the path taken was not the one that is most often "like we all tell people to do it".

I see advice about getting to know an area, renting before buying, discovering the good and the bad about a place.

The thing not to do is walk into a Ramada hotel (or other) somewhere in the UK. We are talking about buying a place to live somewhere on the Iberian peninsula (a pretty big place). The Ramada probably isn't the best place to experience it.

The error was when the desire to buy a home turned into the "opportunity" to make a quick buck.

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:goodpost:

I agree, I think you nailed it, especially the last sentence

Re: Property Fraud
 

So, you appear to be saying that those who wish to turn a legal profit deserve to be cheated at every turn?

Re: Property Fraud
 

No, I didn't say that.

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I did. You didnt because you are looking at a condensed edition, if you look at the "end" of the chapters.

Look at chapter 5 for instance where the "in house" lawyers are introduced into the scenario, already having been mentioned in chapter 2

And thats exactly why I posted the link, as it's important for people to see.
Not everyone is as smart as some think they ought to be. He shouldn't have been so daft. We know that because of places like this, but there are still plenty of people going to these property exhibitions that get advertised, and they get taken in by the sales guff.

No you didn't. At least not properly. Obviously :lol:
I also sat with the guy
A man who is likely to be homeless, albeit through his own niavity.

It never ceases to amaze me how sometimes people just have no feelings or sympathy for others, whatever the circumstances.

On the way to the photography group on the Sunday, in the freezing cold early morning, I came across an Irish guy who was obviously sleeping rough and I gave him a few quid. I dont know how anyone can get by in these temperatures, sleeping in the streets. The person who is the subject of this thread could end up the same way, and this thread is here therefore in the hope that anyone who is considering the same course of action can see what can happen. I hope it does so without further ridicule.

Re: Property Fraud
 

Well said, good post. :goodpost:

Apart from the fraudsters who are not always easy to detect no matter how smart you think you are, buying property in Spain today is like a game of Russian roulette.

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Think you got this summed up in 1 or should I say 3or4

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Many of us started off our property search by visiting a property show, few of us got scammed. :cool:

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Spain!

You should try Dubai.

Everything said about Spain applies there. I know it's fashionable here to think Spain is the worst, but it's really not.

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Hey Mitzy,

Now don't go off on one.

The debate here was about whether this guy did what is most often recommended here, and he didn't.

You posted the link as a warning/example to help others. I can see that, I'm not saying it's not useful to get these things to a wide audience, it is.

Finally, if the bit below is aimed at me, there's no reason it should be. I have a massive amount of sympathy and feelings for people who get conned. I hope that those involved in the conning get what they deserve. I'm pretty sure they won't, either legally or through Karma, but that's the world we live in.

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Comments removed by me. I overstepped the line. Apologies to Horlics if you have already read this.

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Look we all knew from the 70s Spain was renowned for cold greasy eggs for breakfast, I feel when you purchase in a country that has had the land problems that Spain has you dip a toe in the water, no this person brought several and it was because he saw the rents paying for the mortgages and he would do well out of the deal...wonder what made him think property developing and management is a thing anyone can do? any idea what he done for a living? would anyone open a business just because the sums stacked up...I don't think so you need to know the business the market,trend,competition and so on....and yes it is sad for anyone to loose a home or a business.

Re: Property Fraud
 

Buying several properties in the hope of making an easy profit in a country you hardly know is a decision driven by pure greed

Buying one property to live in, OK I have a little more sympathy there, but the get-rich-quick investors, well, I only hope that the same happens to all those currently "investing" in London or Dubai.

Re: Property Fraud
 

I never go off on one. Ive been around here for too long to be sucked in, in that way ;):lol:

He bought property, he used a solicitor, he got conned. Thats it, in a nutshell. The thing he did, which I assume you are referring to, is go to a property show and get sucked in by the salesmen. Many people do it, because many are gullible. Those who dont use solicitors to some extent are just asking for what they get. Those who do use solicitors and aren't all knowing all seeing are unfortunate, to say the least

Yes, you're right .... and how many people have we seen come on here throwing in the idea of moving to Spain to open a bar! It seems easy doesnt it. The ones that happen to come here, well, hopefully we change their minds. BUT ... if you don't get the benefit of people who have been around, you tend to take the advice of professionals and believe what they say.

Unfortunately there are some nasty greedy barstewards around in this day and age.

Frankly, trust is a commodity in short supply

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Frankly, trust is a commodity in short supply

I second that.

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C'mon Mitzy, work with me here.

The only point I disagreed with you on is that he did it they way people here say is best. He didn't.

I know my opener came across as a little heartless but the reason I said it would be hilarious if not so sad is that he walked into a hotel to buy a property in Cyprus to live in, and left having bought 4 in Spain none of which had been built. He then had to rent a place to live in!

I was... huh? what? why?

Re: Property Fraud
 

No problem Pete. I saw it but was a bit too busy for a bit of cut and thrust :-)

But good man for removal if you felt you went further than you were comfortable with. I've had to do the same myself before now. Forums eh :-)