No Deal Brexit

Old Jan 15th 2019, 7:55 am
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

If they had had a mind two all parties could have ratified and then ringfenced the agreement on citizens rights which was the very first item on the agenda in the withdrawl negotiations.
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Old Jan 15th 2019, 10:25 am
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

Originally Posted by BritInParis View Post
The pound has gone pretty much as low as it will go. A ‘No Deal’ Brexit would depress it further for a while but it would start to climb again after six months or so when the sky has failed to fall in. I would more concerned about the next recession that’s brewing.
Any chance you could give me the winner of the 3:45 at Uttoxeter ?
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Old Jan 15th 2019, 11:43 am
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

Originally Posted by Notdunroamin View Post
If they had had a mind two all parties could have ratified and then ringfenced the agreement on citizens rights which was the very first item on the agenda in the withdrawl negotiations.
The UK tried that; the EU wasn’t having any of it.
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Old Jan 15th 2019, 11:45 am
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

Originally Posted by Mike Gas View Post
Wow love the FX predictions if your that certain put your money into the mighty GBP
Already is.

Originally Posted by Hornets_Nest View Post
Any chance you could give me the winner of the 3:45 at Uttoxeter ?
I’m keeping that one to myself
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Old Jan 17th 2019, 1:52 pm
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

It's good to see at least most governments considering how much this would effect peoples lives...

Just wondering though, does anyone know what is considered "exercising freedom of movement rights"? I am a new arrival, registered my address, getting the NIE soon (not sure if I will get temporary or permanent yet) although my non-EU spouse might not get her article 10 (family member) residence permit for another few months...
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Old Jan 17th 2019, 2:32 pm
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

Originally Posted by noz03 View Post
It's good to see at least most governments considering how much this would effect peoples lives...

Just wondering though, does anyone know what is considered "exercising freedom of movement rights"? I am a new arrival, registered my address, getting the NIE soon (not sure if I will get temporary or permanent yet) although my non-EU spouse might not get her article 10 (family member) residence permit for another few months...
There is no such thing as a temporary NIE - it's just your NIE!

Why do that separately and not go straight for residency?

Can she get her permit before you are legally resident here? - I don't think so.
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Old Jan 17th 2019, 4:06 pm
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

Originally Posted by noz03 View Post
It's good to see at least most governments considering how much this would effect peoples lives...

Just wondering though, does anyone know what is considered "exercising freedom of movement rights"? I am a new arrival, registered my address, getting the NIE soon (not sure if I will get temporary or permanent yet) although my non-EU spouse might not get her article 10 (family member) residence permit for another few months...
I think this is one of the issues on which there has been no clarifying document from either the EU or the UK . Currently , while you have the right to settle in a another EU country when you are from the UK and retain your social security rights, UK index-linked pension ( if you have one ! ) etc what has not been agreed is what happens if you decide to move within the EU post-Brexit, e.g. up sticks from Spain and move to Portugal. It is quite feasible the UK benefits would then disappear. Similar but not exactly the same is the issue of UK citizens who live in an EU country but work across the border in another.

Last edited by Loafing Along; Jan 17th 2019 at 4:07 pm. Reason: Correct text
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Old Jan 17th 2019, 10:14 pm
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

Originally Posted by noz03 View Post
It's good to see at least most governments considering how much this would effect peoples lives...

Just wondering though, does anyone know what is considered "exercising freedom of movement rights"? I am a new arrival, registered my address, getting the NIE soon (not sure if I will get temporary or permanent yet) although my non-EU spouse might not get her article 10 (family member) residence permit for another few months...
Slightly different rules apply depending on what you are doing in which country but broadly speaking employment, self-employment, study or self-sufficiency will all count.
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Old Jan 18th 2019, 11:23 am
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

Originally Posted by noz03 View Post
does anyone know what is considered "exercising freedom of movement rights"?
All here https://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ...77:0123:en:PDF

Originally Posted by Loafing Along View Post
I think this is one of the issues on which there has been no clarifying document from either the EU or the UK . I think this is one of the issues on which there has been no clarifying document from either the EU or the UK . Currently , while you have the right to settle in a another EU country when you are from the UK and retain your social security rights, UK index-linked pension ( if you have one ! ) etc what has not been agreed is what happens if you decide to move within the EU post-Brexit, e.g. up sticks from Spain and move to Portugal. It is quite feasible the UK benefits would then disappear. Similar but not exactly the same is the issue of UK citizens who live in an EU country but work across the border in another.
Those are big issues of course, but up to Brexit, exercising FoM rights simply means, complying with the Directive.
After that Brits will no longer have FoM so the Directive will no longer apply to them. AFAIK, what has been agreed in the event of a deal is: there will be no provision for onward movement; cross border workers will have their rights protected; and as regards UK benefits that's up to the UK.
But for the time being all that matters for new arrivals is to be able to show they were exercising your EU right to FoM correctly before Brexit.

Last edited by EuroTrash; Jan 18th 2019 at 11:26 am.
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Old Jan 19th 2019, 6:38 am
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

After Brexit, Brits will be subject to "3rd country" EU immigration rules, which ironically, are more demanding than UK immigration.
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Old Jan 19th 2019, 8:41 am
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

Originally Posted by amideislas View Post
After Brexit, Brits will be subject to "3rd country" EU immigration rules, which ironically, are more demanding than UK immigration.
I read this this morning :- https://www.gbc.gi/news/mps-try-prev...-whether-or-no
Meanwhile, Portugal has announced it plans to continue offering fast track access to British tourists after Brexit, whether or not the UK manages to secure a deal.Prime Minister Antonio Costa says millions of Britons visit Portugal every year, and the country will ensure the flow is not interrupted.

Then I took a look on the Portugal forum where I found the following thread
https://britishexpats.com/forum/port...inking-921163/
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Old Jan 19th 2019, 1:18 pm
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

Originally Posted by snikpoh View Post
There is no such thing as a temporary NIE - it's just your NIE!

Why do that separately and not go straight for residency?

Can she get her permit before you are legally resident here? - I don't think so.
Oh I didn't know that. I was told I should go to a different office and get the NIE that is for people who want to stay up to 3 months (including job seekers, students, etc.), and they only give a number on a piece of paper (with no card). So I was wondering if that is enough to be sure I can stay or I should make sure I have the more long term one with a plastic card.

As for what is considered using your right to free movement, technically taking a weekend holiday is as tourism is using your right, but I very much doubt they will let someone move to the country just because they had a short weekend away there. Nor do I think they will let people who lived in other EU countries to move to Spain if they weren't already living there. Some clarity would definitely be nice.
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Old Jan 19th 2019, 1:31 pm
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

Sounds like you are getting things mixed up. The NIE is effectively a number that identifies you as a non Spanish national. It remains with you for an unlimited time and is used for property purchases, car purchases, bank accounts , tax.etc. The number provides you with no rights and does not identify your residence status. To stay in Spain beyond 3 months you need to acquire the plastic card which effectively proves you are registered in Spain as a foreign resident from EU.. Anyone who hasn't registered after Brexit will be subject to non EU immigration rules. So you will need to try and book an appointment to register and gather together a range of documents to prove you won't be considered a burden on the Spanish state. Good luck
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Old Jan 20th 2019, 6:05 am
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

Originally Posted by amideislas View Post
After Brexit, Brits will be subject to "3rd country" EU immigration rules, which ironically, are more demanding than UK immigration.
AFAIK the EU doesn't have immigration rules.
Individual EU countries set their own immigration policy, in line with the national economy and how many migrant workers that country needs / can stand.
Is Spanish immigration more demanding than British? I thought the UK income requirement was around £35k for a single person and Spain was around €26k but I don't know what other requirements Spain has?
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Old Jan 20th 2019, 7:28 pm
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Default Re: No Deal Brexit

Originally Posted by EuroTrash View Post
AFAIK the EU doesn't have immigration rules.
Individual EU countries set their own immigration policy, in line with the national economy and how many migrant workers that country needs / can stand.
Is Spanish immigration more demanding than British? I thought the UK income requirement was around £35k for a single person and Spain was around €26k but I don't know what other requirements Spain has?
Well, you need to prove you have sufficient income to support yourself, you need to produce proof of no criminal record, you need to produce proof of health insurance. You also are obliged to declare all assets in your name worldwide. You will not be able to access welfare for at least one year (it might be 2 years now) And that's if you're an EU citizen.

If you're not an EU citizen (as you will be post brexit), you will also need to request approval for residency, which not only requires all of the above, you'll need to prove that you're either wealthy enough to retire without any risk of state burden for the rest of your life, or that your employer cannot find your talents within the EU labour pool or the Spanish labour pool, or that you're married to an EU citizen (and living in Spain WITH your spouse). Buying a property or investing at least half a million euros into the country is also a consideration. You're right, each country has it's own policy (although there are clear EU rules regarding non-EU immigrants, per above) I can only speak for Spain and Germany, and the same applies in both.

I don't believe the UK imposes these requirements on EU citizens. AFAIK, EU citizens have no need to even declare their existence in the UK. But that's just UK policy. Has nothing to do with EU law.

Last edited by amideislas; Jan 20th 2019 at 7:46 pm.
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