Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

Yes doesnt surprise me. Spaniards dont like to get their hands dirty anymore :)

Thats why many of the construction and especially the low paid farming and agriculture jobs go to foreigners. I saw a good documentary on how they are training young Africans to be shephards in Spain :).

I find it very sad that everyone aspires to sit at a computer nowadays, in Spain and most other Western countries.

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

Well they say the same in the UK, but I disagree with your analysis. It's more to do with gang-masters, agencies, and the companies that uitilise them. They bring in a group of people to an area, accommodate them 4 to a room and pay them low wages. Local people who need to pay high rent/mortgages can'r realistically afford to work on those wages. Ok, so in rural areas where locals have moved out you may have a point, but I don't believe that millions of young Brits (or spanish for that matter) have suddenly become idle - it's just the opportunity to work has been taken away from them.,

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

Its the same all over Spain, people are being undercut, and if some employers can get away with not giveing proper contracts and avoid paying SS payments for the workers, they will.

For a recent arrival from a "poorer" country, the only having 4 people sharing a room and low wages is a vast improvement on their previous lifestyle in many cases.

But as you say a family man with rent/mortgage to pay could not possibly manage on the pittance paid.

It is not that the population has suddenly become lazy, it is that in many cases the employer has become too greedy.

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

Well yes, but we are also in an era where people expect t-shirts for 3 euros, a meal for 5 euros and you can buy a car (not a very good one admittedly) for 6k euros!

Everything effects everything else. Noone is going to run a company that doesnt make a profit and employee costs are normally one of the first to get cut along with the quality of the product.

Which is why we buy so much cheap tat from China! For that reason I try and buy food from Spain and clothes that are made in Europe, much better quality, but they do cost more

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

That right everyone wants to make a profit, but if that is at the expence of shafting the employees, then maybe the business need a huge overhaul, of course the burden on the employer as regards SS is far too heavy, and needs to be adjusted.

I am sure every country in the world says the same, the richer countries import workers from the less rich countries and the poorer countries import cheaper labour from the poorest countries.

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

Reducing the SS burden will reduce those meagre pensions you talk about, someone has to pay for it! I guess the workers could pay for it, but that wouldnt be very popular.

Imo the whole capitalist system needs an overhall, globally. But that wont happen unless we have a proper almost catostrophic global crash.

Case in point, 50 years ago, the top 1% of the US population owned 10% of the country's wealth. Now the same 1% owns 25% of the country's wealth! The living conditions of the other 99% of the population have worsened.

Unregulated capitalism only leads to greater inequality. A few people get stinking rich and the rest work of subsistence wages.

I was watching El Follonero the other day, he made a good point to a NY stockbroker, he said, so even though there is little or no evidence, the rating companies (S&Ps) have no confidence in Spain, Ireland and Greece. Is this because they are the last remaining European socialist countries? ;)

I think he has a point, the dice are loaded.

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

I don’t believe in conspiracy theories, but what has been the result of the latest, severe recession? Every country is reducing the deficit and wages have been cut drastically without a murmur from the unions because deficits need to be cut (everybody says so).

Who would benefit from cheap labour and cheap money, especially cheap money?

Obviously not the socialists, nor the much maligned bankers who have had their bonuses cut.

But as I don’t believe in conspiracy theories, I can’t answer my own question, or at least, I’ll keep it to myself.

Apart from this, the worst affected country is the US where it all started with their sub-prime mortgages, and they’re being punished far more than the UK. Spain and the others.

Who whispered in Bush’s ear and told him to let Lehman’s go to the wall?

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

Hi.

i know the basics. but currently learning most nights with audio books etc

Judging by the responses then it seems quite hard to get a job.

sorry for the naivety of my posts, if i was to look into starting a business in Spain. would it be best to try and get some business funding in the UK to take with me or once am there try with the Spanish banks?

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

[QUOTE=HBG;8864581]I don’t believe in conspiracy theories, but what has been the result of the latest, severe recession? Every country is reducing the deficit and wages have been cut drastically without a murmur from the unions because deficits need to be cut (everybody says so).


I am not so sure Bob Crow would agree with you and he has just been re-elcted on to the TUC panel.

I believe the test in the UK will be how the public sector react to the proposed cuts.

In the main they do not have any support in the private sector who have just realised not only the extent of the public sector but also that public sector employees are better renumerated, especially so when pensions, job security, absenteeism rates etc. are taken into account.

I believe that the Public Sector retirement age should be raised to match the state pension age as a start to addressing the imbalance.

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

[QUOTE=johnnyone;8867334][QUOTE=HBG;8864581]I don’t believe in conspiracy theories, but what has been the result of the latest, severe recession? Every country is reducing the deficit and wages have been cut drastically without a murmur from the unions because deficits need to be cut (everybody says so).


I am not so sure Bob Crow would agree with you and he has just been re-elcted on to the TUC panel.

I believe the test in the UK will be how the public sector react to the proposed cuts.

In the main they do not have any support in the private sector who have just realised not only the extent of the public sector but also that public sector employees are better renumerated, especially so when pensions, job security, absenteeism rates etc. are taken into account.



I agree with you in principle that the public sector retirement age should be raised, but there must be exceptions. A soldier. fireman or policeman couldn’t possibly work for 50 years, not at the health standards required for their professions.

I wouldn’t want to be on a battlefield with a 66-year old trotting along at my side with all that heavy kit, and if a frail fireman climbed to the top of one of those long ladders he would never get down again. And those police marksmen make enough mistakes already, without worrying about an old man holding a Heckler and Koch with trembling hands.

Mind you, I’ve never seen a 66-year old hod carrier either. He would have to be carrying one brick at a time.

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

Could well be much trouble and strikes not far ahead as the unions seem hell-bent on confrontation,...again.

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

I agree with you in principle that the public sector retirement age should be raised, but there must be exceptions. A soldier. fireman or policeman couldn’t possibly work for 50 years, not at the health standards required for their professions.


I obviously agree with that to some extent, however fireman and policeman can retire after 30 years service. This could be raised and if not fit for fire or policing duties there are many things that both could do that are not physically demanding such as desk duties, advisory visits etc.

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

People are assuming that a career lasts a lifetime.

I think for people of my generation that wont be the case. I saw a study saying a 20-something will have 5 career changes before retiring.

So a retired policeman or fireman will have to work the tills at the supermarket or something. I am afraid it is the realities of the world we live in. The pension funds are broke and cannot afford people to retire early anymore.

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

I agree. After 30 years in their professions, those people should take degrees, which are impossible to fail in nowadays, and get a desk job, perhaps in PR, management advisory roles and those similar professions which merely involve sitting in front of computers all day and pretending to know something lifted from wikipedia.

That’s the degree they want, a degree in ‘copy and paste’. They could work from home and do that until they’re 90 – they might have to.

Re: Living in Spain - the good things!
 

[QUOTE=HBG;8868227]get a desk job, perhaps in PR, management advisory roles and those similar professions which merely involve sitting in front of computers all day and pretending to know something lifted from wikipedia.
QUOTE]

How did you know what I work in? :rofl: