Jimmy Savile

Old Oct 25th 2012, 1:44 pm
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

Originally Posted by Domino View Post
Keep going - there are bound to be many more.

Leads me to wonder about the digitalising of police radio channels, stops people listening to their conversations and we have to assume they would not be worried about altering/cutting/losing those recordings.

I am positive in my belief that the majority of the police men and women are honest, law abiding citizens. We have had rotten apples before and believed we had got rid of them. It will take a long long while before the general public will be able to look at a police officer without that element of doubt.

Then we open it out to Social Services etc, who are supposed to also be guardians of our children, protecting them. Whilst running homes where "goings on" becomes endemic.

And as to organisations such as the BBC that seems to be full of the racist, sexually deviant, luvvies they keep trying to tell us about in our communities.
Yes well this is what bothers me. If I had young children I wouldn't know who to trust. Come to that who can you trust as an adult either? Its a shame because even with everything thats coming to light its still a minority of wrong doers that spoil the world for every one else.
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Old Oct 25th 2012, 4:55 pm
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

Originally Posted by Dick Dasterdly View Post
All of the above are admissable evidence in a Court of Law.

You only need to consider the number of murderers who have been convicted a great many years after the event, to realise that the exact time and date as well as the means by which the offences were carried out are not a necessity for conviction.
M'lud Sir James Wilson Vincent Savile is charged with
*having underage sex with person or persons - unknown
*on dates - unknown
*in places - unknown

Sir James how do you plead ?

Not guilty M'lud, its all lies, I know I put it into my book but it was an item my publisher told me would help it to sell, see. It didn't do very well until I kicked the bucket, like.
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Old Oct 25th 2012, 4:58 pm
  #273  
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

Originally Posted by Domino View Post
M'lud Sir James Wilson Vincent Savile is charged with
*having underage sex with person or persons - unknown
*on dates - unknown
*in places - unknown

Sir James how do you plead ?

Not guilty M'lud, its all lies, I know I put it into my book but it was an item my publisher told me would help it to sell, see. It didn't do very well until I kicked the bucket, like.
Your'e not really getting this are you? People have been tried in absentia, tried without a body being found, hell, people have been tried when it was well known it wasn't even their fault. Its up to the lawyers to put a credible enough case together, the CPS to follow it up and a jury to decide if there is enough evidence and while circumstantial evidence might not be ideal, people have been put away on less...
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Old Oct 25th 2012, 5:21 pm
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

Originally Posted by rugbymatt View Post
Your'e not really getting this are you? People have been tried in absentia, tried without a body being found, hell, people have been tried when it was well known it wasn't even their fault. Its up to the lawyers to put a credible enough case together, the CPS to follow it up and a jury to decide if there is enough evidence and while circumstantial evidence might not be ideal, people have been put away on less...
I think it is you that isn't getting it old chap.

We may have a body, that was buried at 45degrees, but I can't really see that it is possible to prosecute a dead body that is unable to instruct a solicitor or barrister or QC (if any would take the job on) and what are you going to do if/when the body is found guilty after a kangeroo trial where it has no right of reply - inter it for life ??

oh and for someone of such self professed superior education - please explain what Your'e means.
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Old Oct 25th 2012, 5:39 pm
  #275  
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

Originally Posted by Domino View Post
I think it is you that isn't getting it old chap.

We may have a body, that was buried at 45degrees, but I can't really see that it is possible to prosecute a dead body that is unable to instruct a solicitor or barrister or QC (if any would take the job on) and what are you going to do if/when the body is found guilty after a kangeroo trial where it has no right of reply - inter it for life ??

oh and for someone of such self professed superior education - please explain what Your'e means.
So basically, I pointed out that even when I reply without insults and in depth you still feel the need to try and be snide and pick up on an OBVIOUS typo. So thats it is it? That's your argument? That I made a typo? Brilliant, absolutely brilliant.

As to the rest of your post, yet again you are trying to twist the discussion into something really quite ridiculous so I shall treat it with the contempt it deserves, I thought you were leaving the discussion anyway?
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Old Oct 25th 2012, 5:52 pm
  #276  
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

So Scotland Yard have now come out and said they have, so far, spoken to 130 victims and expect to be contacted by another 114 in the near future, even Caroline Robinson, Savils own great niece has said she was abused by him when she was 12 and while the police are not looking at this as a pedophile ring they are saying it could develop as one of the largest cases of abuse by a single individual.

I bet they were all asking for it though, bloody money grabbers eh?
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Old Oct 25th 2012, 5:52 pm
  #277  
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

Originally Posted by jojojojojo View Post
You dont know that. As you rightly point out, all we know is whats been reported by the media and thats all been sensationalised and made newsworthy - its open season on Savile.

I dont believe he was a pervert or a paedophile - I believe if had been, it would have not been covered up, it would have been brought to light when it happened and he wouldnt have been "sir Jimmy", he'd have been a "Michael Jackson".

He was probably a bloke, like many others who found himself or engineered himself into a position where he was surrounded by pretty young girls, all "glammed up", looking way above their years and he took advantage. Whats that crude saying that I've heard many a man say "I'll bet they're gagging for it" - well he took advantage of his position and the girls eagerness to be grown up and to be special to a celebrity. Wrong yes, stupid yes, but I dont think it was much more than that - but hey, what do any of us know???? Oh yes, what the gutter press have cleverly worded to incriminate him and we all fall for it!!!

Jo xxx
I think you are extremely naive and have no idea how predators operate.
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Old Oct 25th 2012, 6:32 pm
  #278  
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

Originally Posted by Domino View Post
M'lud Sir James Wilson Vincent Savile is charged with
*having underage sex with person or persons - unknown
*on dates - unknown
*in places - unknown

Sir James how do you plead ?

Not guilty M'lud, its all lies, I know I put it into my book but it was an item my publisher told me would help it to sell, see. It didn't do very well until I kicked the bucket, like.

Sad to see the matter looked upon in such a trivial fashion.

As I said it is not uncommon or a necessity to be specific about the time and place in order for a criminal prosecution to successfully take place.

Wonder why I get the impression that the Defence has already run out of arguements and options.
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Old Oct 25th 2012, 10:29 pm
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

Originally Posted by Dick Dasterdly View Post
Sad to see the matter looked upon in such a trivial fashion.

As I said it is not uncommon or a necessity to be specific about the time and place in order for a criminal prosecution to successfully take place.

Wonder why I get the impression that the Defence has already run out of arguements and options.
Dick I am not trivialising this - it is in so many ways from so many different directions a travesty of life in the 60's & 70's, an era that saw so much good in the UK and the rest of the world. That these things could/may have been going on around us, that well respected organisations, senior managers, policemen, social workers and probably a few others were either involved or turned a blind eye. The emotional damage that may have been caused to vulnerable individuals is huge. Individuals who couldnt talk about it to their social workers for fear of being ridiculed or worse.

And it isnt trivialising it to respond to people on this forum who think JS can be prosecuted. The man is dead, the only thing that can happen is to rewrite all the accolades he has received over the years, take his gong away from him by expunging his name from the records. He can never stand trial, serve time.
Unless of course you think that hanging his corpse will do some good ? ?

Now lets get on with the really serious bit - sorting out those who knew and condoned, those who brushed under the carpet, those who were complicit with what happened.

But first of all you know full well the claims being made will have to be carefully investigated, checked, double checked for accuracy and correctness. That isnt our job, I am sure neither you nor I would want to do it, especially with the world's media watching, begging for the slightest slip up.
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Old Oct 26th 2012, 9:38 am
  #280  
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

Originally Posted by Dick Dasterdly View Post
Evidence presented directly from Victims is NOT hearsay.
It is solid evidence.>>>>>>>

Wrong------ it is only evidence when presented in a court of law, someone saying ---" He did this ---he did that --- is still hearsay -- until proven

Evidence received directly from Witnesses is NOT hearsay.
It is solid evidence.>>>>>>>>>WRONG

It can only be used as evidence as and when the investigator presents those findings in a cout of law --until then it is unsubstantiated.

Evidence directly recorded from Saviles lips is NOT hearsay.
It is solid evidence,
as also is that presented in his own written words.>>>>>>>>>>>

So you have proof J.S actually spoke of interfering with young girls, that is WRITTEN PROOF -- not hearsay------- How YOU interpret the written word is not always the way the writer intebded it to be interpreted ---- you just have to read some of the posts on here to recognise that fact.

Continue desperately grasping at straws if you wish Richard, but the rest of the World is moving on and already beginning to address means by which disgusting,despicable affairs such as this can best be avoided in the future.
You have obviously gone along with the "Lynch Mob" --- hang the bastard NOW,------- not waiing to see whether a mans character is bismirched or not. I have said many times ---I AM NOT DEFENDING THE MAN ------ just merely asking that the due process of law be carried out --- If the man is ajudged to have done all that is being bandied about --then and only then can his character / name / knighthood / etc etc etc be exposed to the bile and disgust being levied at his memory --- But also let me say ---- If and I repeat ---- IF -----ALL--- these allegations are proven to have happened in a court of law please don't turn round and start ----BRAYING ---- I TOLD YOU SO ----- because a court of law will have proved they did.
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Old Oct 26th 2012, 9:50 am
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

Originally Posted by Domino View Post
I think it is you that isn't getting it old chap.

We may have a body, that was buried at 45degrees, but I can't really see that it is possible to prosecute a dead body that is unable to instruct a solicitor or barrister or QC (if any would take the job on) and what are you going to do if/when the body is found guilty after a kangeroo trial where it has no right of reply - inter it for life ??

oh and for someone of such self professed superior education - please explain what Your'e means.
Domino,

May I suggest you think before you type, nobody is accusing a dead body of anything.

What has to be proven are the allegations that are now abounding in their hundreds, if they are proven, then I suppose all that can be done is for him to be stripped of his knighthood, ( not that that would do any good) and that all charities return all monies raised by him, ( somehow I can't see that happening), that all those "celebraties" coming out of the woodwork saying they knew of his expolits be prosecuted and sued by those that were proven to be abused, ( somehow I can't see THAT happening either). And they close down the B.B.C. as a house of ill repute ---yeah right.
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Old Oct 26th 2012, 9:56 am
  #282  
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

Originally Posted by Domino View Post
Now lets get on with the really serious bit - sorting out those who knew and condoned, those who brushed under the carpet, those who were complicit with what happened.

But first of all you know full well the claims being made will have to be carefully investigated, checked, double checked for accuracy and correctness. That isnt our job, I am sure neither you nor I would want to do it, especially with the world's media watching, begging for the slightest slip up.
The Police are looking at three groups - Savile on his own, Savile with others and others on their own. Arrests and prosecutions may take place but those who were victims of Savile alone 'will receive acknowledgement' of what happened to them, the police spokesman said. That's it 'acknowledgement' , no criminal charges with a corpse in the dock. That all seems pretty sensible to me.
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Old Oct 26th 2012, 10:17 am
  #283  
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

I find it extremely odd that no investigative journalist picked this up and followed through all those years ago.
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Old Oct 26th 2012, 10:31 am
  #284  
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

Originally Posted by jimenato View Post
I find it extremely odd that no investigative journalist picked this up and followed through all those years ago.
A few journo's did over the years but the freelance ones were warned off and for some reason no one else was prepared to do anything. I find it strange that The Sun, given their hunger for salacious tittle tattle never once went after him yet they were more than happy to tap Millie Dowlers phone. Just goes to show eh?
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Old Oct 26th 2012, 10:33 am
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Default Re: Jimmy Savile

Originally Posted by jimenato View Post
I find it extremely odd that no investigative journalist picked this up and followed through all those years ago.
There is a suggestion that it was considered almost too shocking to believe. I don't think we'll ever really know the truth some of it was just too long ago.

What really bugs me is the business with the BBC Newsnight programme less than 12 months ago. Newsnight is a respected programme so what really happened there and why is the BBC so reluctant to tell us? The current Director General who was in charge of programme schedules at the time has admitted he was told by the Head of News that Newsnight was investigating Savile and that might mean a need to change his Christmas schedules. He said he didn't enquire as to the nature of the programme because of the 'chinese wall'. He trusted he would be told what he needed to know when he needed to know it. OK, its that 'chinese wall' that enables journalists to retain their independance from the rest of the corporation. Thus they supposedly have the freedom to report things that show the rest of the BBC in a negative light.
So what did Newsnight find out and why did they cancel the programme? If it turns out that it was cancelled because it would have made the BBC look bad that has huge implications for current reporting standards. It will seriously damage their standing thoughout the world.
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