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Heading for Europe
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Re: Heading for Europe
Wouldn't you?
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Re: Heading for Europe
I already have !
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Re: Heading for Europe
Originally Posted by scot47
(Post 11311022)
I already have !
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Re: Heading for Europe
For want of a better life.
Something that we should all encourage I think. |
Re: Heading for Europe
That is just so shocking and very sad.
Who could deny anyone a chance of searching for a better life. It's what my Mum did when she ran away from Ireland, so perhaps I have a bias. |
Re: Heading for Europe
I suppose your viewpoint could be coloured by the distance you live from the beachhead that that lot are going to try to establish.
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Re: Heading for Europe
Originally Posted by two tubes of toothpaste
(Post 11313083)
I suppose your viewpoint could be coloured by the distance you live from the beachhead that that lot are going to try to establish.
They just want to live a half way decent, safe life. Like the rest of us. And they risk their lives because it's better than what they are leaving behind, which says something. |
Re: Heading for Europe
Originally Posted by Lion in Winter
(Post 11313253)
They aren't trying to establish a "beachhead".
They just want to live a half way decent, safe life. Like the rest of us. And they risk their lives because it's better than what they are leaving behind, which says something. I’m merely pointing out that someone sitting in New Zealand or Norfolk, for sake of argument, would look at that boatload of Africans, heading towards Europe, differently from someone like me who lives 7 kilometres as the crow flies from a possible nocturnal ‘Red Beach’, evidenced by the numbers of Africans gleaning the countryside around here for any bits of metal not actually concreted in. Twice now I have had to have a polite word with two-man African teams making off with my neighbour’s homemade barbecue set (an oil drum and a few other bits of metal), pointing out it was needed. The second time, I was challenged as to what the hell it had to do with me and was I the owner of the property ? Putting the point more forcibly led to a stone-throwing incident that only ended when I had locked myself in my house. They left the set. This is affecting my Spanish neighbours and myself now. I live surrounded by 44 million pine trees in a National Forest. In pairs, the Africans make their way into the woods with a long bamboo pole and a white hessian bag. One of the Africans will shin up a pine tree (in boots - an unbelievable sight), whilst the other passes up the bamboo pole. He uses this to knock down pinecones from the trees, and the bloke at the bottom bags them up. They sell them later for firelighters. Excellent enterprise, except for the fact that they used to have a liking for the pine tree on my property. They would bend over the chain-link fence (still do occasionally) climb in and climb up. The fact that the tree has the best view of the hillside and most of the houses on it probably explains why. I have the telephone number of a neighbour with a licensed shotgun, and the number of visits have now tailed off. Stuff is going missing, and the locals are now using their guns on sight. Remember that these ‘people who are only trying to better themselves’ are coming into a region with 21% unemployment. It’s a bit like a boatload of Africans pitching-up on the beach at Jarrow just before The March and asking if there was ‘any chance of anything ?’. How the hell are they expected to better themselves except by crime ? |
Re: Heading for Europe
There are a lot of issues around the current global levels of conflict. My problem is with the title and tone it immediately sets.
Clearly Europe (or the US, Canada, Australia) cannot absorb everyone displaced by various disasters in the world. So let's look at what to do about it, not demonize these people. Who would want to be in their position? Could we even imagine it? |
Re: Heading for Europe
Originally Posted by Sally Redux
(Post 11313277)
There are a lot of issues around the current global levels of conflict. My problem is with the title and tone it immediately sets.
Clearly Europe (or the US, Canada, Australia) cannot absorb everyone displaced by various disasters in the world. So let's look at what to do about it, not demonize these people. Who would want to be in their position? Could we even imagine it? |
Re: Heading for Europe
Originally Posted by two tubes of toothpaste
(Post 11313268)
I’m merely pointing out that someone sitting in New Zealand or Norfolk, for sake of argument, would look at that boatload of Africans, heading towards Europe, differently from someone like me who lives 7 kilometres as the crow flies from a possible nocturnal ‘Red Beach’, evidenced by the numbers of Africans gleaning the countryside around here for any bits of metal not actually concreted in.
Twice now I have had to have a polite word with two-man African teams making off with my neighbour’s homemade barbecue set (an oil drum and a few other bits of metal), pointing out it was needed. The second time, I was challenged as to what the hell it had to do with me and was I the owner of the property ? Putting the point more forcibly led to a stone-throwing incident that only ended when I had locked myself in my house. They left the set. This is affecting my Spanish neighbours and myself now. I live surrounded by 44 million pine trees in a National Forest. In pairs, the Africans make their way into the woods with a long bamboo pole and a white hessian bag. One of the Africans will shin up a pine tree (in boots - an unbelievable sight), whilst the other passes up the bamboo pole. He uses this to knock down pinecones from the trees, and the bloke at the bottom bags them up. They sell them later for firelighters. Excellent enterprise, except for the fact that they used to have a liking for the pine tree on my property. They would bend over the chain-link fence (still do occasionally) climb in and climb up. The fact that the tree has the best view of the hillside and most of the houses on it probably explains why. I have the telephone number of a neighbour with a licensed shotgun, and the number of visits have now tailed off. Stuff is going missing, and the locals are now using their guns on sight. Remember that these ‘people who are only trying to better themselves’ are coming into a region with 21% unemployment. It’s a bit like a boatload of Africans pitching-up on the beach at Jarrow just before The March and asking if there was ‘any chance of anything ?’. How the hell are they expected to better themselves except by crime ? So it would be more to the point to stop trying to build futile walls to keep out human waves of misery and instead focus on doing something about the conditions they are fleeing. |
Re: Heading for Europe
Originally Posted by Lion in Winter
(Post 11313296)
So they must be pretty desperate to risk their lives for that then, eh?
So it would be more to the point to stop trying to build futile walls to keep out human waves of misery and instead focus on doing something about the conditions they are fleeing. |
Re: Heading for Europe
Originally Posted by two tubes of toothpaste
(Post 11313307)
No. These are young, fit and able males on economic migration.
What exactly do you suppose they left that makes them willing to do that? |
Re: Heading for Europe
Originally Posted by Lion in Winter
(Post 11313312)
Ie. desperate enough to let you shoot at them for pine cones.
What exactly do you suppose they left that makes them willing to do that? The pine cones bit is a cover for looking over remote properties and opportunistic theft. What they left ? Poverty. Films, TV, and magazines show them that Europe's streets are paved with gold and that a bright youngster can make a decent living, just by being there. |
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