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EUC Annual meeting

EUC Annual meeting

Old Feb 18th 2011, 4:45 pm
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Default Re: EUC Annual meeting

Originally Posted by John & Kath
It appears that not every one thinks that the Mayor and the EUC are the disaster area that some others do. Members should get direct communication from the Secretary if email addresses are correct and when the website is up there will be public areas for general consultation. However in the interest of the principals we were formed on "freedom of information" until then I will put my two pennyworth on here.
Thanks John. Just because there has been criticism of the EUC and the mayor on this forum... has no relevance to the RA communications. THere is no connection between them.

Sending out a message saying (in broad terms) what you are working on can do no harm and in fact could encourage memberships. The people who are pro-mayor and pro-EUC cant have any reasonable argument to stop broad RA comms on this forum. Of course the details should be sent directly to the RA members who have paid.

The objective should be to get as much interest in the RA as possible, as many memberships... not pandering to someones personal dislike of the forum - that reaches many people. Its how you use it that counts and the 'cyber vandals' are ignored by most people - and have gone away.

Thanks for agreeing to use this for the broad/general comms, John.

Jon
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Old Feb 18th 2011, 10:22 pm
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Default Re: EUC Annual meeting

EUC - The situation as I see it

Current Position

My understanding is that the EUC Committee has more or less decided that the current Administration Company (L & G) are not fit for purpose and need to be replaced. Contractual complications have delayed subsequent action. Furthermore, the Chairman (Mayor) hasn't been accessible. Apparently, he has been badly affected by the death of his mother, and I guess he has the problem of forthcoming elections where he could (is likely to?) be deposed. (I almost feel sorry for him!!). As they are aware of their forthcoming doom, L & G have not, to say the least, been very helpful. Consequently, there has been a cessation of any EUC activities. Thus, no annual meeting, no statement of accounts, no new Administrators, and no information dissemination. By the way, there is no point in blaming the Treasurer, as apparently accounts, as produced by the Administrators, are the responsibility of the President and Secretary, and the poor Treasurer is almost as much in the dark as the rest of us.

Financial Situation

Although the potential income is large, I suspect that the amount currently being received is very small. I believe that only a very small proportion of CE owners are paying EUC subs, and that none of the various developers with completed houses/villas at CE are paying anything, apart from Fadesa (MF). My understanding is that MF have, more or less, paid their subs in full. At present, the CE areas external to the Inter-community areas have the appearance of being well looked after. I suspect that the cost of doing so, allied to the not insignificant cost of the L & G fees, is greater than the current EUC income, so God knows where the rest is coming from. I certainly don't believe there is anything available for anybody to stash away illegally at present.

Future Strategy

I feel that the aim should be to try and ensure total transparency with regard to EUC business. CE owners need to be given access to full EUC financial records to date, and to the planned future expenditure. Also, as with the Inter-Community practice, a list of all unpaid EUC subscriptions, detailing the agencies involved, together with the amount owned by each, should be available for scrutiny. All the above should be recorded in both Spanish and English. Action should be set in train to pursue these unpaid subscriptions, and CE owners given detailed information as to what this action is and how it is progressing. My understanding is that when a house is sold, Spanish law calls for all outstanding debts to be transferred to the buyer. There is a need to ensure that when accommodation is sold by Sun & Sea, Albatross Golf and all the other developments at CE, or by the banks that have acquired properties there, any outstanding EUC debt is passed on in that sale.

Finally, the responsibility for looking after the non-Inter-Community areas should have remained with MF until the development was accepted by the local authority. However, when MF went into administration, the EUC was formed to take over that responsibility, as MF did not have the funds to do so. My understanding is that MF will shortly come out of administration and will become fully free to trade once more. Should this responsibility not now be transferred back to MF? It is surely in their interest to ensure that CE site remains in a pristine condition as this will help with the sale of their houses, the hotel, etc. If that was to happen the EUC could adopt a dormant state and only be revived when the local authority adopted the development.

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Old Mar 25th 2011, 10:41 am
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Smile Re: EUC Annual meeting

Originally Posted by CAROL TAFF
EUC - The situation as I see it

Current Position

My understanding is that the EUC Committee has more or less decided that the current Administration Company (L & G) are not fit for purpose and need to be replaced. Contractual complications have delayed subsequent action. Furthermore, the Chairman (Mayor) hasn't been accessible. Apparently, he has been badly affected by the death of his mother, and I guess he has the problem of forthcoming elections where he could (is likely to?) be deposed. (I almost feel sorry for him!!). As they are aware of their forthcoming doom, L & G have not, to say the least, been very helpful. Consequently, there has been a cessation of any EUC activities. Thus, no annual meeting, no statement of accounts, no new Administrators, and no information dissemination. By the way, there is no point in blaming the Treasurer, as apparently accounts, as produced by the Administrators, are the responsibility of the President and Secretary, and the poor Treasurer is almost as much in the dark as the rest of us.

The EUC website has at last been up-dated with the provisional budget for 2011. No mention of a date for an Annual General Meeting. Most startling claim is that the majority of owners want an EUC office established on CE despite almost everyone bar Fadesa at the last meeting voting against the proposal. See :-

http://euccostaesuri.com/index.php?o...estos&Itemid=7

Financial Situation

Although the potential income is large, I suspect that the amount currently being received is very small. I believe that only a very small proportion of CE owners are paying EUC subs, and that none of the various developers with completed houses/villas at CE are paying anything, apart from Fadesa (MF). My understanding is that MF have, more or less, paid their subs in full. At present, the CE areas external to the Inter-community areas have the appearance of being well looked after. I suspect that the cost of doing so, allied to the not insignificant cost of the L & G fees, is greater than the current EUC income, so God knows where the rest is coming from. I certainly don't believe there is anything available for anybody to stash away illegally at present.

I think that despite MF having disposed of the majority of their apartments/houses they still have a 25%+ ownership of Esuri through the GC and the commercial centers/hotel sites so they will have paid a significant sum to the EUC as their proportion of the whole. Certainly 0.5mill plus

Future Strategy

I feel that the aim should be to try and ensure total transparency with regard to EUC business. CE owners need to be given access to full EUC financial records to date, and to the planned future expenditure. Also, as with the Inter-Community practice, a list of all unpaid EUC subscriptions, detailing the agencies involved, together with the amount owned by each, should be available for scrutiny. All the above should be recorded in both Spanish and English. Action should be set in train to pursue these unpaid subscriptions, and CE owners given detailed information as to what this action is and how it is progressing. My understanding is that when a house is sold, Spanish law calls for all outstanding debts to be transferred to the buyer. There is a need to ensure that when accommodation is sold by Sun & Sea, Albatross Golf and all the other developments at CE, or by the banks that have acquired properties there, any outstanding EUC debt is passed on in that sale.

The opposition candidate for the Mayorality in Ayamonte has promissed that within 2 months of taking office he will conduct a rigerous audit of the EUC accounts. Of course he will not at that stage be the President and has hinted that he does not want to be president either.

Finally, the responsibility for looking after the non-Inter-Community areas should have remained with MF until the development was accepted by the local authority. However, when MF went into administration, the EUC was formed to take over that responsibility, as MF did not have the funds to do so. My understanding is that MF will shortly come out of administration and will become fully free to trade once more. Should this responsibility not now be transferred back to MF? It is surely in their interest to ensure that CE site remains in a pristine condition as this will help with the sale of their houses, the hotel, etc. If that was to happen the EUC could adopt a dormant state and only be revived when the local authority adopted the development.

MF are now out of Administration so that is perhaps why the current Mayor was putting it about that he would wind up the EUC this year. Not sure about MF interest since I dont think they own much by the way of houses they have been sold or repossed by the Banks so its only the commercial sites and I don't think major investors would be greatly influenced by the state of the palm trees.

Taff
For ease I have put comments in red with the link to the provisional accounts in blue.

John.

Last edited by EsuriJohn; Mar 25th 2011 at 10:44 am.
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Old Mar 25th 2011, 10:45 am
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Smile Re: EUC Annual meeting

The provisional budget for the EUC for 2011 has now been posted on the EUC website :-

http://euccostaesuri.com/index.php?o...estos&Itemid=7

see also my comments below.
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Old May 24th 2011, 7:12 am
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Default Re: EUC Annual meeting

Hi all

Any news on the EUC please ?

Out in CE soon so will be waving my €5 and hope to see you John (John & Kath) to pay our dues to you, however we are not sure about continuing to pay the EUC fees and wondering about cancelling our DD. Don't want to be hasty but neither do we want to be taken for fools and paying for possibly new offices and entertainment. NADA from the committee, L & G etc etc

Thanks

Mel
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Old May 24th 2011, 9:27 am
  #21  
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Default Re: EUC Annual meeting

Originally Posted by MEL & JOHN
Hi all

Any news on the EUC please ?

Out in CE soon so will be waving my €5 and hope to see you John (John & Kath) to pay our dues to you, however we are not sure about continuing to pay the EUC fees and wondering about cancelling our DD. Don't want to be hasty but neither do we want to be taken for fools and paying for possibly new offices and entertainment. NADA from the committee, L & G etc etc

Thanks

Mel
They didnt have an annual meeting this year - and last year we were told that they were legally obliged to do so a short period after the end of the year.

My feeling is that I should cancel my DD .... if they arent reporting on how they spend the money then they are at fault. And theres many other faults as well.

Also the penalty is 4% I think so no big loss. We need services on CE and Im prepared to pay for it - but this lot in the EUC are not trusted by me. When the financials are not properly transparent - then a warning bell goes off in my head.

Ive heard that many of the Spanish (who know the ins and outs) have decided not to pay and of course there are legal matters going on where people wrote a letter to say that they were not a legal organisation. Those claims need to be responded to as they were made officially. Add to that major national newspapers questioning the Mayors connection with L+G and if there was a conflict of interest there .......... and lack of proper financial reporting and many other things we have heard of on this forum.... and no non-payer being chased, makes me pretty anoyed that I arranged a DD in the first place. Lots of other concerns have also been raised here.

Anyway that aside Mel+John have a wonderful trip over, I know you will!

Jon
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Old May 24th 2011, 9:55 am
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Default Re: EUC Annual meeting

Originally Posted by Jon-Bxl
They didnt have an annual meeting this year - and last year we were told that they were legally obliged to do so a short period after the end of the year.

My feeling is that I should cancel my DD .... if they arent reporting on how they spend the money then they are at fault. And theres many other faults as well.

Also the penalty is 4% I think so no big loss. We need services on CE and Im prepared to pay for it - but this lot in the EUC are not trusted by me. When the financials are not properly transparent - then a warning bell goes off in my head.

Ive heard that many of the Spanish (who know the ins and outs) have decided not to pay and of course there are legal matters going on where people wrote a letter to say that they were not a legal organisation. Those claims need to be responded to as they were made officially. Add to that major national newspapers questioning the Mayors connection with L+G and if there was a conflict of interest there .......... and lack of proper financial reporting and many other things we have heard of on this forum.... and no non-payer being chased, makes me pretty anoyed that I arranged a DD in the first place. Lots of other concerns have also been raised here.

Anyway that aside Mel+John have a wonderful trip over, I know you will!

Jon
Thanks Jon, you have done it again ! - my thoughts in a nutshell.

Yeah, can't wait. I am packed already. 11 more sleeps

Mel
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Old May 24th 2011, 9:59 am
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Default Re: EUC Annual meeting

Originally Posted by Jon-Bxl
They didnt have an annual meeting this year - and last year we were told that they were legally obliged to do so a short period after the end of the year.

My feeling is that I should cancel my DD .... if they arent reporting on how they spend the money then they are at fault. And theres many other faults as well.

Also the penalty is 4% I think so no big loss. We need services on CE and Im prepared to pay for it - but this lot in the EUC are not trusted by me. When the financials are not properly transparent - then a warning bell goes off in my head.

Ive heard that many of the Spanish (who know the ins and outs) have decided not to pay and of course there are legal matters going on where people wrote a letter to say that they were not a legal organisation. Those claims need to be responded to as they were made officially. Add to that major national newspapers questioning the Mayors connection with L+G and if there was a conflict of interest there .......... and lack of proper financial reporting and many other things we have heard of on this forum.... and no non-payer being chased, makes me pretty anoyed that I arranged a DD in the first place. Lots of other concerns have also been raised here.

Anyway that aside Mel+John have a wonderful trip over, I know you will!

Jon
Just to point out that the EUC is a properly registered legal entity with the power to charge fees (which are collected through the Provincial revenue mechanisms not the municipal) and levy charges for non-payment (which are monthly and compound I believe). If you choose not to pay the EUC then you are putting yourself on the wrong side of the law. If, knowing this, you still do not pay on a point of principle then that is entirely up to you of course.
I do have a lot sympathy with those who have been trying to use the proper channels to influence the EUC and got nowhere. If it is thought that the EUC was not constituted correctly then there should be a formal legal challenge - as far as I am aware, apart from a lot of words from political candidates, there is no formal legal process in progress (I'd love to be proved wrong).

The other course of action is through the EUC committee itself, by getting representatives elected and changing the constitution (in line with Spanish law). The snag is of course that the EUC is not behaving according to its existing constitution and Spanish law in not holding mandatory general meetings and publishing it's accounts so it is impossible to make any changes. The EUC is subject to a regulator/registrar (not sure what the correct Spanish title is) who should be ensuring that the EUC committee obey the rules. If this is not happening then presumably there could be legal remedies.

It's a bit of a Catch-22 - we need the law to help us. Personally I don't think acting illegally is the right way to do that but I respect the views of anyone who thinks otherwise. I was rather hoping that the RA would be a suitable pressure group and would be able to align public opinion and come up with an action plan? I did join and paid my dues and would be willing to contribute to a 'fighting fund' if asked.
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Old May 24th 2011, 5:45 pm
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Smile Re: EUC Annual meeting

Just to point out that the EUC is a properly registered legal entity with the power to charge fees (which are collected through the Provincial revenue mechanisms not the municipal) and levy charges for non-payment (which are monthly and compound I believe). If you choose not to pay the EUC then you are putting yourself on the wrong side of the law. If, knowing this, you still do not pay on a point of principle then that is entirely up to you of course. However there are those Spanish and Portuguese, lawyers among them, who say that it is illegally constituted and refusing to pay is the right thing to do since there is no mechanism to pay back if this is proved correct. I understand a legal challenge has been instituted but I don't hold my breath! Spanish Law is so slow it is imperceptable.
I do have a lot sympathy with those who have been trying to use the proper channels to influence the EUC and got nowhere. If it is thought that the EUC was not constituted correctly then there should be a formal legal challenge - as far as I am aware, apart from a lot of words from political candidates, there is no formal legal process in progress (I'd love to be proved wrong).

The other course of action is through the EUC committee itself, by getting representatives elected and changing the constitution (in line with Spanish law). The snag is of course that the EUC is not behaving according to its existing constitution and Spanish law in not holding mandatory general meetings and publishing it's accounts so it is impossible to make any changes. The EUC is subject to a regulator/registrar (not sure what the correct Spanish title is) who should be ensuring that the EUC committee obey the rules. If this is not happening then presumably there could be legal remedies. It is a Judicial Registrar based in Huelva.

It's a bit of a Catch-22 - we need the law to help us. Personally I don't think acting illegally is the right way to do that but I respect the views of anyone who thinks otherwise. I have paid my dues up to now but I am getting a bit pi**** off at no movement and in our road very little gardening, though the Boulevard looks fantastc. I was rather hoping that the RA would be a suitable pressure group and would be able to align public opinion and come up with an action plan? I did join and paid my dues and would be willing to contribute to a 'fighting fund' if asked. There are many views on the EUC committee for instance the EUC treasurer is a committee member. We will keep plugging away.

A point to note is that since Fadesa is now out of administration they should be completing the outstanding works and all of the snagging. However the law allows for an EUC as an interim body until the Ayuntamiento is able to properly adopt the infrastructure. I DO NOT SEE ANY SIGN OF MOVEMENT BY FADESA. After the last formal CERA commttee meeting some one fluent in Spanish and close to the Mayor told me it was his intention to suspend the EUC after the election. This of course fits a pattern since Fadesa are now responsible again so the EUC has less reason to exist and if it is suspended then there is no need to hold an AGM. What about acounts and audit, who knows!

We should also remember that unless all property is sold and every owner votes or gives a proxy, Fadesa with the 2 Golf Courses and the Hotel and Commercial center will outvote as an ally of the Mayor.
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Old May 26th 2011, 9:58 am
  #25  
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Default Re: EUC Annual meeting

Hi Mike and John

Many thanks for your replies and comments, I appreciate your feedback.

We are folk that "do the right thing" but this EUC business is just ridiculous. Not a word from the EUC, L & G.....nothing at all, such a cavalier attitude to those who are paying infuriates me especially when so many are not paying. I think one more payment from us (mainly because I know I will the worry about having an outstanding debt)and then that is it unless we see minutes of meetings accounts etc and know who, why, what we are paying.

Can I ask is there anybody on this forum that has popped into the L & G offices recently ? Anybody spoken to the Treasurer - is it still Steve Tipper?

John - thanks also for your posts on the recent election results

All the best

Mel

Last edited by MEL & JOHN; May 26th 2011 at 9:59 am. Reason: typo
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Old May 30th 2011, 9:08 pm
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Smile Re: EUC Annual meeting

There is a rumour that the delayed AGM for the EUC is to be held in June. Yes that is the day after tomorrow! No definite date yet but the dispute as to who can vote rumbles on. At the moment Inter-Community Presidents only (illegal some who know better than me say) are allowed to vote together with individual Plot Owners and of course the largest plot owner by far is still Fadesa. So if you give less than a couple of weeks notice and the largest plot owner who is also on the Board attends why have a meeting at all? Of course the Statutes require a meeting and the Law governing communities also requires one so lets turn out in strength and push for change.
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Old May 31st 2011, 7:15 am
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Default Re: EUC Annual meeting

24th June at 5pm, John&Kath.

http://euccostaesuri.com/index.php?o...&id=9&Itemid=5
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Old May 31st 2011, 12:59 pm
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Default Re: EUC Annual meeting

So now we know,

"EUC Annual General Meeting is on Friday 24th June at 17.00hrs"

The meeting first call is at 5.00pm with the second at 18.00hrs which from the chaos last time means that the meeting will start sometime after 6.00pm

No agenda yet but as soon aswe see one we will make sure it is on here.

Thank you Carol for the lead. Doh why did I not look there.
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Old May 31st 2011, 3:09 pm
  #29  
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Default Re: EUC Annual meeting

Which is the "Big House"? We shall be over then and may try to attend.
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Old May 31st 2011, 3:44 pm
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Smile Re: EUC Annual meeting

Originally Posted by MikeJ
Which is the "Big House"? We shall be over then and may try to attend.
I am sure that the "Big House" is the google translation of "Casa Grande" which is on the Calle Huelva across the small square from the Piano Bar which is signposted from the "music r/about". Do come along if you can, but bring sandwich's and a flask of tea, it is well worth it to see the Mayor/Fadesa/the Secretary talk their way out of immpossible places.
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