Chiclanagir

On www.mycadiz.biz a name and shame thread has been started but I don´t know if it will be closed down because of legal reasons.

jdr

The way I see it is if you buy a property,firstly you must do homework on the area, and the procedures involved, then you should always use a legal lawyer.
You pay him to oversee the legal purchase of your property, therefore if there are any legal problems with the purchase then it is his fault for not doing his job.
Contact him and get him to sort it.

Although a name and shame idea is a good idea I don't think B.E. Admin would be up for it either work wise or legality wise on here.
There have already been posts withdrawn on other threads due to defamatory comments being complained about in a similar vein.

Why don't one of you start a specific website or blog on the pitfalls of buying property in a foreign country.
just have a browse HERE for some help.

EsuriJohn

Hi Jimmy23,

This is what happens if you complete on a new property without a licence of first occupancy (LFO), or licencia de primera ocupación in Spanish. Utility companies need to see this licence – issued by the town hall – before they can supply domestic accounts with water and electricity. But some new developments are not receiving LFOs, often because of planning irregularities.

In order to get the LFO the contractors Electrician would have to issue an electrical Boletin to certify the electrical installation.

So there are several pieces of paper that your lawyer should have got for you and shown to you before he allowed you to sign the escritura.

Start by asking to see all the right bits of paper and if they are not available denounce all those involved to the police and enlist the aid of the consumers department at the Ayuntamiento.

Regards,

John.

poollounger

John this may work with a large scale development like CE but I am not sure this is good advice. The intricacies of buying a new villa in the campo in Chiclana are many and well documented, and it is perfectly feasible that one can have a legal meter without any of the procedures you detailed.
Your solicitor should be your first port of call. My solicitor said that previously one never checked that one could get a meter...it wasn't a problem. Glynis's advice is sound...and CDL caretaking has managed to help a number of people in tricky situations.

jimmy23

From the help and advice that I have had it would seem that a visit to an English speaking Spanish Abogado would be a good place to start. The process does seem to be a lot more complicated and involved than I was led to believe and that the period of time from application to installation is again totally different to what I was told by the people that were applying on my behalf. I would like to thank everybody for their honest advice it is a breath of fresh air. I will keep you informed of progress in the hope that my experience may be of help to others

mitzipurr

This is the problem Glynis that people are frightened to name and shame and these "despicable" people know it. They have a lot of money, strong legal representation etc and so therefore can continue doing what they do and leave the poor individuals to pick up the pieces. Unfortunately it appears that the Town Hall can or will do nothing to stop the goings on and indeed it seems condone it.

Everywhere you go in Chiclana and surrounding areas there is construction going on and I dont know how much more the resources of electricity etc can cope with.

I feel at the end of the day the only people who will put a stop to it will be the Junta...

On a seperate issue I read that there has been over 15,000 complaints made to the EEC about illegal constructions in Spain!!

EsuriJohn

Hi poollounger,

I am not sure about that. There have been and still are serious problems over "completion" at Esuri. Most people have been delayed by at least 6 months from their due date. Some much longer than that where their Abogado has given them strong advice not to complete until all services are in legally. Understandably some have given in driven by all sorts of pressures and signed early. So far the outcomes have been good but you will still read of people on "builders" (illegal) supply after almost 12 months

My position is that I should have completed 12/2005 but still not there yet. I am told this is because the "legal" electricity is not available to my plot. I now have all the permissions I need to commence construction and could get by with the builders supply but I have not been called to complete.

However I paid €11,000 for the licence to build and this will all be lost if I do not commence within 3 months of approval. To get a new approval will require major redesign to comply with the new energy efficient building regs.

So what do I do. I will ask to sign in the knowledge that it is not "kosher" and commence in time to save my €11,000 and hope that the electricity supply is regularised before we have to apply for the LFO.

Spain will have to get its act together and come down hard on developers who mislead the buyers. Also agents who seem to me to be the real villains (though I did not use one). Not forgetting lawyers who are sometimes in cahoots with the developer or agents or both.

Regards,

John.

EsuriJohn

Hi Jimmy23,

There is a lawyer down your end of CDL who specalises in construction law. She posts on a few websites but not this one I think her name is Maria Castro and everything I have read from her is very sound.

Her email address is [email protected] and they are based in Cadiz she may be worth a visit.

Regards,

John.

jdr

The main trouble is if people are signing on the dotted line before everything is kosher, the more the builders will hang back and not bother to get things sorted.
If you sign and move in without the habitation licence etc and the authorities crack down, just think what could happen.
I wont list the possibilities, just think about them.

Just down the road from me are about 30 townhouses which have been completely finished for about 3 months, but have not been released for habitation yet due to paperwork delays. The local council is cracking down around here now at last and will only get better since Operation Malaya stirred the mud.

Billy Banana

just looked at it, nobody has been named yet, will keep looking though

poollounger

Are you saying that you didn't use an English speaking lawyer for your purchase????

NicCol

I think some of the problem is the culture difference. The spanish attitude seems to be, why be in a rush to pay if you get it for free? When I asked my solicitor (who has been very good by the way) when he thought we would be urbanised, he asked why was we in such a rush? We are getting our water/elec for free, why be in a hurry to part with our money. I also know of locals who don't pay for their bins. They don't think they should as they have only been collected for 2 years!!!

jimmy23

Yes we used an English speaking lawyer at all stages of the transaction. The problem seems to arise from he general assumption that counter meters are not illegal. The reason for this assumption is because a blind eye appears to have been turned to the practice and consequently there does not seem to have been a need for the issue to be highlighted during the purchase of the property. Having thought to have done my homework and having ensured that the property was being bought with a meter and not having the dubious nature of the meter highlighted the present situation was unfortunately unavoidable.

Chiclanagir

They have started to name and shame on mycadiz.biz. Still feel nervous about actually doing it though!

Chiclanagir

What websites does she post on then?