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Doing business in Spain

Doing business in Spain

Old Apr 26th 2012, 12:31 pm
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Default Doing business in Spain

Hello again

I am on here looking for some more advise, nothing as dramatic as my last thread thank God!

We are settling in very nicely over here and are now thinking about moving our UK business over here, it seems only right that we should be paying into this system rather than into the UK system since we are using the services over here.

I am a web developer so physically there is nothing to move over as I have all my equiptment and have been operating my business as usual. My company is registered as a LTD company in the UK, how would I go about moving this to Spain and paying my tax and contributions to the system over here as opposed to the UK? I have an NIE number and have read the next step is a social security number, can anyone advise me on how to go about this?

Many Thanks
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 12:39 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

Hi willoween

I'm glad your are settling in now

Changing your company to an S.A. (i.e. a Spanish limited company) would be relatively complicated and you need to hand in a deposit of several thousand euros. If you want to go down this route then you should hire an accountant to do it for you

However, whatever you do, you will need to pay your autonomo social security fees (250 euros per month per person i.e. 500 euros per month if you and your husband work) and declare your earnings in Spain

Tax is residence based so it doesnt matter if your company is in the UK. If you are doing the web design in Spain then you need to be autonomo and declare your earnings, otherwise it is fraud
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 12:52 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

Originally Posted by willoween
Hello again

I am on here looking for some more advise, nothing as dramatic as my last thread thank God!

We are settling in very nicely over here and are now thinking about moving our UK business over here, it seems only right that we should be paying into this system rather than into the UK system since we are using the services over here.

I am a web developer so physically there is nothing to move over as I have all my equiptment and have been operating my business as usual. My company is registered as a LTD company in the UK, how would I go about moving this to Spain and paying my tax and contributions to the system over here as opposed to the UK? I have an NIE number and have read the next step is a social security number, can anyone advise me on how to go about this?

Many Thanks
You will soon realise Spain is anti small business , I`d advise against going Ltd/SL as its much more expensive and complicated than in the UK ,being self employed / autonomo can also be very expensive , you have to pay at least 250 euros P.M even if you dont make a sale! but on the plus side if your clients are UK based and pay you at UK rates it could be a good way to go,personally with your type of business that does not have an office (I assume) I`d pop over to Gib to do all work /transactions and keep the Spanish authorities out of the loop
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 1:06 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

Originally Posted by Rotor
I`d pop over to Gib to do all work /transactions and keep the Spanish authorities out of the loop
Just a note that this is entirely illegal

If you register your child with the state nursery or school and the authorities see that you have no declared income then you could find yourselves investigated. My sister in law is a tax lawyer and says this is a common way that hacienda catch people
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 1:12 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

Thanks for the info, yes that is expensive, so far technically we have not committed any fraud as my partner is not registered for NIE over here, only I am and we are entitled to be out of country for a number of weeks every year before it becomes a problem, it only becomes a problem when we over stay the amount of time we are allowed to without returning to the UK.

I don't know what we will do now, I am not sure how it is possible to remain here and cut the Spanish out of the loop, it seems at first glance at least one of us will have bite the bullet and go self employed. Can anyone tell me why the Spanish love to make everything complicated? Hahaha the two most used words in Spain has to be "No" and "Problem" and not in the same sentence!

Thanks for the info
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 1:15 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

Yes if we stay here long term my baby will have to eventually go to school and this will cause a problem if we are not all legal beagle registered and declaring our income, it seems the only way is to work harder and pay them their pound of flesh! Anyone need a website? hahaha
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 1:17 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

Originally Posted by willoween
Yes if we stay here long term my baby will have to eventually go to school and this will cause a problem if we are not all legal beagle registered and declaring our income, it seems the only way is to work harder and pay them their pound of flesh!


it IS worth it in the end - you'll be entitled to state healthcare & be paying towards a pension, too
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 1:18 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

Originally Posted by Rotor
You will soon realise Spain is anti small business , I`d advise against going Ltd/SL as its much more expensive and complicated than in the UK ,being self employed / autonomo can also be very expensive , you have to pay at least 250 euros P.M even if you dont make a sale! but on the plus side if your clients are UK based and pay you at UK rates it could be a good way to go,personally with your type of business that does not have an office (I assume) I`d pop over to Gib to do all work /transactions and keep the Spanish authorities out of the loop
Might help explain we have so many living in the "black" economy here. One the world's largest. It's rather rampant, really.

They're trying to crack down on it, but it's so fundamentally embraced, it's going to be very difficult. And IMHO, making it more difficult and expensive to operate "above the table" isn't the solution, either.

Black Economy of Spain equal to 70pct of Health budget


The Growth of the Black Economy in Spain
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 1:19 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

I suppose the only other option would be to try and get a job over here so the tax issue is dealt with by the empolyer? I am guessing that jobs are not easy to find though, especially with the limited amount of Spanish I can speak and there is something very wrong with speaking Spanish in a Welsh accent, I think it should be illegal!
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 1:24 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

Originally Posted by cricketman
Hi willoween

I'm glad your are settling in now

Changing your company to an S.A. (i.e. a Spanish limited company) would be relatively complicated and you need to hand in a deposit of several thousand euros. If you want to go down this route then you should hire an accountant to do it for you

However, whatever you do, you will need to pay your autonomo social security fees (250 euros per month per person i.e. 500 euros per month if you and your husband work) and declare your earnings in Spain

Tax is residence based so it doesnt matter if your company is in the UK. If you are doing the web design in Spain then you need to be autonomo and declare your earnings, otherwise it is fraud



I though S.A. 's were large corporations and S.L's were the equivalent to the UK Ltd. company? - or have I got it the wrong way 'round?
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 1:28 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

Originally Posted by willoween
Thanks for the info, yes that is expensive, so far technically we have not committed any fraud as my partner is not registered for NIE over here, only I am and we are entitled to be out of country for a number of weeks every year before it becomes a problem, it only becomes a problem when we over stay the amount of time we are allowed to without returning to the UK.

I don't know what we will do now, I am not sure how it is possible to remain here and cut the Spanish out of the loop, it seems at first glance at least one of us will have bite the bullet and go self employed. Can anyone tell me why the Spanish love to make everything complicated? Hahaha the two most used words in Spain has to be "No" and "Problem" and not in the same sentence!

Thanks for the info
If you both work in the same business then you may be able to get away with only one of you registering as autonomo. There is a rule where the other half of the marriage can do some hours in the business without having to pay another set of autonomo fees

Whatever the case you could do with some advice from a professional

Pretty much no chance of getting a job I'm afraid!
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 1:32 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

Originally Posted by snikpoh
I though S.A. 's were large corporations and S.L's were the equivalent to the UK Ltd. company? - or have I got it the wrong way 'round?
I'm sure you're right.
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 1:35 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

Originally Posted by cricketman
Pretty much no chance of getting a job I'm afraid!
Yes just what I thought!

Though we have a lovely neighbour who is self employed, he asked my better half to go putting cards out with him and when he gets some more work he said he can go with him, we also met another couple and the husband makes the gates and bars for the doors and windows over here, he said there might be some work there for him though I am guessing neither of these people will be able to employ him as such and he will still have to register self employed and pay.

Oh well, if I can use the health service and wont have to pay the private cover that will save me 150 a month so will only be another 100 worse off and it will be worth it to be able to use the schools and other services without worrying.

Thanks again peeps for the info
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 2:26 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

Originally Posted by amideislas
Might help explain we have so many living in the "black" economy here. One the world's largest. It's rather rampant, really.

They're trying to crack down on it, but it's so fundamentally embraced, it's going to be very difficult. And IMHO, making it more difficult and expensive to operate "above the table" isn't the solution, either.

Black Economy of Spain equal to 70pct of Health budget


The Growth of the Black Economy in Spain
From a guy I read,
TAX INCOME FALLS OFF CLIFF The Bank of Spain said it was the fall in tax income that increased Spain’s deficit so much in 2011, and the same thing is happening this year. It has already fallen a further 2.5%, although the government thinks it will increase by 4% this year.
http://www.publico.es/dinero/430789/...e-los-recortes
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Old Apr 26th 2012, 3:45 pm
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Default Re: Doing business in Spain

Originally Posted by snikpoh
I though S.A. 's were large corporations and S.L's were the equivalent to the UK Ltd. company? - or have I got it the wrong way 'round?
Sociedad Anónima (a corporation)

Sociedad Limitada (a limited liability company)

It's better to look it up than to rely on those who aspire to appear important, but are too lazy to look it up.
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