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Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Old Feb 18th 2010, 3:24 am
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Originally Posted by yes we can
Hi A.B.C. Welcome to the forum!
As I said before I'll be the first to join the Owners Group/Residents Association.
Well done
Hi thanks to those that have emailed me re the new association - Ive been off email for a short while... so sorry for any delays

I noticed that there is a thread regarding this new association

http://britishexpats.com/forum/showthread.php?t=654935

Wow the mods are training me well, the 'old dinosaur' is recommending multiple threads

Jon

Last edited by Jon-Bxl; Feb 18th 2010 at 3:31 am.
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Old Feb 18th 2010, 11:55 am
  #452  
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Originally Posted by John & Kath
I intend to email on the 21st and ask if Fadesa have paid their dues.
Very doubful it will have been paid as the 20th falls on the Saturday?,would give them another excuse.

Ken.
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Old Feb 18th 2010, 4:16 pm
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Originally Posted by Carol&John
I too need to ask L&G for a copy. I'm not sure but I believe that at the last meeting LGC said tha they had translating documents.Have you asked if they have a copy of the Constitution in English?.

I am only guessing that this copy is the one. I haven't had it confirmed (S_L states she/he not being aware of any adoption of statutes - that's bizarre (not S_L, but the issue of the statutes), but the rules & regulations are similar to other EUC estatutos.. Sorry, but I don´t understand you. Statutes which you have attached are the our EUC CE.

Regarding quorum of the board, I don't know really how it all works. I think it's written in one of the paragraphs about the election of the members of the consejo rector: Pres/V.P/Sec. Then there's the Treasurer, and then the 2 vocales. 5 in total. So, 3 would make quorum? One official has to be from the Ayuntamiento, and I think the Secretary doesn't have to own property on the EUC. Am I correct?. Yes, it´s correct.

I can't understand why the Registro de entidades colaboradoras would have 2 different names on it for the EUC CE.: ¿¿¿???. Registro Entidades Colaboradoras, is the same Register for all EUCs.
.

Regards.
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Old Feb 18th 2010, 4:26 pm
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Originally Posted by John & Kath
I think it goes back to the early Fadesa days when they seem to have set up all the communities intercommunities and the EUC with the same pair of officals at the dead of night on the 31st December in 200* so that they would have the majoity for a long time since they owned all of the properties. As property was released that would gradually change but then they went bust and we are where we are now trying to pick up the pieces.
SL who must have read the Registration says the the Fadesa menare stil down as the President and Secretary so how can any meeting held since Dec 2008 have been properly constituted?
Worse still, John & Kath: how are properly constituted the meetings in May 2009 and, the last, in February 2010?. I remind you that calls the firm Mr. Mayor, as Presidet of the EUC, when he really is not.

The registry (Registro de Entidades Colaboradoradoras) is public. It's in Huelva. Anyone can go and ask for information. I said that I am not alone in having such information.
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Old Feb 18th 2010, 4:52 pm
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Originally Posted by John & Kath
I intend to email on the 21st and ask if Fadesa have paid their dues.
I think it's also important to know the percentage of EUC´s members (other than MF) who have paid. MF is 24%, and the rest???.

I've already said before, in my opinion: If EUC´s members agreed, they should pay the bill; if they disagreed, they should appeal.
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Old Feb 18th 2010, 7:22 pm
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

With thanks & in reply to S_L's insertions to this post (S_L in blue, mine in red):

Originally Posted by Carol&John
I too need to ask L&G for a copy. I'm not sure but I believe that at the last meeting LGC said tha they had translating documents.Have you asked if they have a copy of the Constitution in English?.
That's good news. I'm thinking that I can wait a bit longer for my copy; however, on second thoughts, I might need to ask specifically for this document.

I am only guessing that this copy is the one. I haven't had it confirmed (S_L states she/he not being aware of any adoption of statutes - that's bizarre (not S_L, but the issue of the statutes), but the rules & regulations are similar to other EUC estatutos. Sorry, but I don´t understand you. Statutes which you have attached are the our EUC CE.
Glad to hear this confirmed, because I don't believe what I read online all the time. After all, I "Googled" the information.

Regarding quorum of the board, I don't know really how it all works. I think it's written in one of the paragraphs about the election of the members of the consejo rector: Pres/V.P/Sec. Then there's the Treasurer, and then the 2 vocales. 5 in total. So, 3 would make quorum? One official has to be from the Ayuntamiento, and I think the Secretary doesn't have to own property on the EUC. Am I correct? Yes, it´s correct.Thanks.

I can't understand why the Registro de entidades colaboradoras would have 2 different names on it for the EUC CE. ¿¿¿???. Registro Entidades Colaboradoras, is the same Register for all EUCs.
Please allow me to rephrase: I can not understand why someone has written the names of two different people (name from MF and the other name Pérez Pérez) as President and Secretary of the EUC CE in the Registro de entidades colaboradoras. (John&Kath has answered my question in post #446.)

---------------------

Is this a deliberate mistake or negligence?
Are all EUCs required to register by law and how soon must they register?
I understand that the EUC CE was constituted "correctly" by the Ayuntamiento in October 2005. Yet, why was the modification to the statutes of the EUC CE allowed (in May 2008) if it was known to be "incorrect" (dare I say it, "illegal"?) By calling for the formation of the EUC CE at the end of 2008, only then was it deemed "illegal" because the Ayuntamiento had not received the completed works?


http://www.derecho.com/l/bop-huelva/...ipal-ayamonte/

----------------

I am struggling to comprehend all this; does any of this past history matter today? (Yes) The EUC CE must take place, I am told. (Yes) But, only if the work (El Plan Parcial del Sector Uno "Costa Esuri") is completed and received by the town hall technicians. (Yes)

So, someone has made a big mistake in the organisation of this entity?
Have the last 12 months been a wasted experience because the law/rules have not been followed correctly?
Can it be fixed and can we all move forward?

Perhaps the mayor can not ask for the money from the bank because perhaps he is not the president of the EUC CE? Ah, if perhaps MF is the President...

Last edited by Carol&John; Feb 18th 2010 at 7:28 pm.
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Old Feb 18th 2010, 7:58 pm
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Smile Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Originally Posted by Carol&John
With thanks & in reply to S_L's insertions to this post (S_L in blue, mine in red):

Originally Posted by Carol&John
I too need to ask L&G for a copy. I'm not sure but I believe that at the last meeting LGC said tha they had translating documents.Have you asked if they have a copy of the Constitution in English?.
That's good news. I'm thinking that I can wait a bit longer for my copy; however, on second thoughts, I might need to ask specifically for this document.

I am only guessing that this copy is the one. I haven't had it confirmed (S_L states she/he not being aware of any adoption of statutes - that's bizarre (not S_L, but the issue of the statutes), but the rules & regulations are similar to other EUC estatutos. Sorry, but I don´t understand you. Statutes which you have attached are the our EUC CE.
Glad to hear this confirmed, because I don't believe what I read online all the time. After all, I "Googled" the information.

Regarding quorum of the board, I don't know really how it all works. I think it's written in one of the paragraphs about the election of the members of the consejo rector: Pres/V.P/Sec. Then there's the Treasurer, and then the 2 vocales. 5 in total. So, 3 would make quorum? One official has to be from the Ayuntamiento, and I think the Secretary doesn't have to own property on the EUC. Am I correct? Yes, it´s correct.Thanks.

I can't understand why the Registro de entidades colaboradoras would have 2 different names on it for the EUC CE. ¿¿¿???. Registro Entidades Colaboradoras, is the same Register for all EUCs.
Please allow me to rephrase: I can not understand why someone has written the names of two different people (name from MF and the other name Pérez Pérez) as President and Secretary of the EUC CE in the Registro de entidades colaboradoras. (John&Kath has answered my question in post #446.)

---------------------

Is this a deliberate mistake or negligence?
Are all EUCs required to register by law and how soon must they register?
I understand that the EUC CE was constituted "correctly" by the Ayuntamiento in October 2005. Yet, why was the modification to the statutes of the EUC CE allowed (in May 2008) if it was known to be "incorrect" (dare I say it, "illegal"?) By calling for the formation of the EUC CE at the end of 2008, only then was it deemed "illegal" because the Ayuntamiento had not received the completed works?

http://www.derecho.com/l/bop-huelva/...ipal-ayamonte/

----------------

I am struggling to comprehend all this; does any of this past history matter today? (Yes) The EUC CE must take place, I am told. (Yes) But, only if the work (El Plan Parcial del Sector Uno "Costa Esuri") is completed and received by the town hall technicians. (Yes)

So, someone has made a big mistake in the organisation of this entity?
Have the last 12 months been a wasted experience because the law/rules have not been followed correctly?
Can it be fixed and can we all move forward?

Perhaps the mayor can not ask for the money from the bank because perhaps he is not the president of the EUC CE? Ah, if perhaps MF is the President...
Your too clever by half you are. Of course if Fadesa hold the two top positions and are registered as such they are hardly going to press for a call in of the guarentee are they.
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Old Feb 19th 2010, 4:41 pm
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Hi Carol & John

Why or how, then, did Isla Canela get rid of theirs?

•The question about Isla Canela can be here:

http://www.ayamonte.org/modules/news...hp?storyid=127

Regards.
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Old Feb 19th 2010, 4:55 pm
  #459  
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Originally Posted by yes we can
Hi Carol & John

Why or how, then, did Isla Canela get rid of theirs?

•The question about Isla Canela can be here:

http://www.ayamonte.org/modules/news...hp?storyid=127

Regards.
My gosh - talk about deja vu! Will they never learn?
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Old Feb 21st 2010, 9:45 am
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Originally Posted by yes we can
Hi Carol & John

Why or how, then, did Isla Canela get rid of theirs?

•The question about Isla Canela can be here:

http://www.ayamonte.org/modules/news...hp?storyid=127

Regards.
If the residents of Isla Canela were forced to form an association, we (with the problem of MF) should learn.
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Old Feb 21st 2010, 10:48 am
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Carol&John in red, mine in blue:

Originally Posted by Carol&John
With thanks & in reply to S_L's insertions to this post (S_L in blue, mine in red):

Originally Posted by Carol&John
I too need to ask L&G for a copy. I'm not sure but I believe that at the last meeting LGC said tha they had translating documents.Have you asked if they have a copy of the Constitution in English?.
That's good news. I'm thinking that I can wait a bit longer for my copy; however, on second thoughts, I might need to ask specifically for this document.

I am only guessing that this copy is the one. I haven't had it confirmed (S_L states she/he not being aware of any adoption of statutes - that's bizarre (not S_L, but the issue of the statutes), but the rules & regulations are similar to other EUC estatutos. Sorry, but I don´t understand you. Statutes which you have attached are the our EUC CE.
Glad to hear this confirmed, because I don't believe what I read online all the time. After all, I "Googled" the information.

Regarding quorum of the board, I don't know really how it all works. I think it's written in one of the paragraphs about the election of the members of the consejo rector: Pres/V.P/Sec. Then there's the Treasurer, and then the 2 vocales. 5 in total. So, 3 would make quorum? One official has to be from the Ayuntamiento, and I think the Secretary doesn't have to own property on the EUC. Am I correct? Yes, it´s correct.Thanks.

I can't understand why the Registro de entidades colaboradoras would have 2 different names on it for the EUC CE. ¿¿¿???. Registro Entidades Colaboradoras, is the same Register for all EUCs.
Please allow me to rephrase: I can not understand why someone has written the names of two different people (name from MF and the other name Pérez Pérez) as President and Secretary of the EUC CE in the Registro de entidades colaboradoras. (John&Kath has answered my question in post #446.)

---------------------

Is this a deliberate mistake or negligence?
Are all EUCs required to register by law and how soon must they register?
I understand that the EUC CE was constituted "correctly" by the Ayuntamiento in October 2005. Yet, why was the modification to the statutes of the EUC CE allowed (in May 2008) if it was known to be "incorrect" (dare I say it, "illegal"?) By calling for the formation of the EUC CE at the end of 2008, only then was it deemed "illegal" because the Ayuntamiento had not received the completed works?


http://www.derecho.com/l/bop-huelva/...ipal-ayamonte/

I do not believe that the EUC was established successfully by the Town Hall in 2005. I think they eliminated key steps of the creation process.

Why statutes were modified in May 2008?. In my opinion, someone was in a hurry in the EUC work. I think they thought that if they modified the statutes (Article 1), EUC might work. However, as I said, legally the EUC can be formed without having the work completed, but can not work until the Town Hall had not received the completed works.

The statutes of your link are the statutes after the modification. I think you ought to ask LGC if they have been translated into English. It is important that you understand the rules governing the EUC.



----------------

I am struggling to comprehend all this; does any of this past history matter today? (Yes) The EUC CE must take place, I am told. (Yes) But, only if the work (El Plan Parcial del Sector Uno "Costa Esuri") is completed and received by the town hall technicians. (Yes) Perfect. I know it's hard to understand. You're doing a good job.

So, someone has made a big mistake in the organisation of this entity? I do not believe, as I said, that is the product of a mistake.Have the last 12 months been a wasted experience because the law/rules have not been followed correctly?
Can it be fixed and can we all move forward?

Perhaps the mayor can not ask for the money from the bank because perhaps he is not the president of the EUC CE? Ah, if perhaps MF is the President...

Here you get confused. The only one who can request the money from bank guarantees is the Mayor of Ayamonte, not the President of the EUC. In CE the Ayamonte´s Mayor and President of the EUC is the same person.
.

Last edited by spanish_lawyer; Feb 21st 2010 at 10:51 am.
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Old Feb 21st 2010, 12:02 pm
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Hola! S_L,

Thank you for your reply.

I do not have the legal knowledge to understand whether or not the estatutos 2005 have been drafted correctly. Who is responsible for these estatutos?

Do you believe that I would understand a translation of this document any better than I do at this moment? I'm not so sure, unless the use of legal terminology is obscure deliberately. (Even an english translation may not pick up on this.)

So, the Junta de Andalucia (please correct me) has a Registro de entidades colaboradoras which contains information that may be incorrect? Who is responsible for this?

Lastly, I thought the name of the President of the EUC CE is written on the Registro as that of MF. How then can the mayor be the President? Yes, I do understand that only the mayor can request the bank guarantee, but MF must be pulling a few strings, in my opinion. Why is the mayor protecting MF? Who is responsible to the people?

I wish for more transparency in this matter.

The local municipal elections are in May 2011. Too late for the deadline of the 6M.-euros.
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Old Feb 21st 2010, 4:07 pm
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Carol&John, I reply you:

Thank you for your reply.

I do not have the legal knowledge to understand whether or not the estatutos 2005 have been drafted correctly. Who is responsible for these estatutos?. The Town Hall is the last responsible. It is the supervisory body.

Do you believe that I would understand a translation of this document any better than I do at this moment? I'm not so sure, unless the use of legal terminology is obscure deliberately. (Even an english translation may not pick up on this.). I'm sure you perfectly understand statutes if they were in English. I admit that the legal regulation of the EUC is complex, regardless of language. However, understanding the rules (statutes) is simple.

So, the Junta de Andalucia (please correct me) has a Registro de entidades colaboradoras which contains information that may be incorrect? Who is responsible for this?. Correct. The Register does not check the data. Only it limited to storing information. The Registry is the responsibility of the Junta de Andalucía.

Lastly, I thought the name of the President of the EUC CE is written on the Registro as that of MF. Correct. How then can the mayor be the President?. Because, he was appointed by the Meeting. Yes, I do understand that only the mayor can request the bank guarantee, but MF must be pulling a few strings, in my opinion. Why is the mayor protecting MF? I do not know!!. Who is responsible to the people? The mayor.

I wish for more transparency in this matter. Me too.

The local municipal elections are in May 2011. Too late for the deadline of the 6M.-euros. Not exactly. There are 3 guarantees (#385). Only the first bank guarantee (1.742.262,43 €) is a expiration date prior to call municipal elections. The others could be executed (= ask for money to the bank).

Thanks to you.

Last edited by spanish_lawyer; Feb 21st 2010 at 4:16 pm.
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Old Feb 21st 2010, 5:14 pm
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

I have forgotten about the 3 guarantees. Thanks for the reminder; here's a copy&paste of the paragraph from the earlier post #385:
- The first guaranties (is a document that the bank have to pay, it isn´t a promise) is for 1.742.262,43 €. It is valid until July 19, 2010.
- The second guaranties: 3.005.060,52 €. It´s valid until November 14, 2011.
- The last guaranties: 1.262.778,09 €. It´s valid until November 24, 2012.

Salu2
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Old Feb 21st 2010, 5:55 pm
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Default Re: Costa Esuri - Ayamonte - EUC

Originally Posted by spanish_lawyer
If the residents of Isla Canela were forced to form an association, we (with the problem of MF) should learn.
Agree. Thank you for the link Yes we can. I don't think the IC residents had a limited time frame, however.
I look forward to hearing (soon I hope) more news from the CE Owners' Group.

"The more people, the louder the voice", I think that was the phrase. OK, so we have some voice at the EUC CE level, but ultimately the Ayuntamiento is the supervisory body of the EUC. At this moment in time, how can the voice of the people (owners & residents) at CE be heard at the municipal level? (Owners' Group?) After all, the mayor is responsible to the voice of the people.

How easy/difficult would it be to gather 20% of the total EUC coefficient, especially if the news in the next few days were to be disappointing?

I did my maths the other night and thought it would need almost all the communities', plot owners', and other developers' coefficients to meet MF's. It is possible.

(should really post a rolling my thumbs smilie)

Last edited by Carol&John; Feb 21st 2010 at 6:32 pm. Reason: slow thought process!
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