Corruption across EU
 

Corruption across EU 'breathtaking' - EU Commission

The extent of corruption in Europe is "breathtaking" and it costs the EU economy at least 120bn euros (£99bn) annually, the European Commission says.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26014387

Another reason to get out ?

Re: Corruption across EU
 

they know about it, have known about it ever since the EU started.
is that one of the reasons why France (and Germany) blocked the UK's membership all those years ago ??

and still they can't balance their own books - where does corruption start, and is there anyone in the EU hierarchy of old politicians from various countries who is prepared to do anything about it.
:thumbdown:

Re: Corruption across EU
 

Never mind the politicians doing anything about it. What is so maddening about this is the way the amount is referred to as 'at least €120bn'. But that isn't their money, it is ours, the tax we have paid. They have lost it, it has been stolen, I don't care how they phrase it but they have failed in their duty of care and it is incredible that we simply treat the entire thing as if it is terrible but... and hope matters improve.
In my youth I would have advocated pitchforks and torches and burn everyone of the bastards but nowadays I seem to be content with ranting on a forum.
What the hell have we allowed to happen to us? Will people ever be as motivated as those of the Ukraine to actually take to the barricades and make our Governments and Eurocrats frightened of us again? Somehow, unless Eastenders is scrapped or whatever holds other countries in equal thrall and football is banned, I see no chance of Europe ever breaking free of it's shackles and drowning the whole sorry lot of them.
/rant

Phew.

Re: Corruption across EU
 

No surprise that the EU accounts haven't been signed off for about 18 years:sneaky:

Re: Corruption across EU
 

:goodpost:
I like this post the pitchfork part made me laugh, I feel your passion.

Blaming Eastenders for the apathy that abounds gave me a right old chuckle.

Is it so hard to riot when Phil Mitchell is on the screen?

Re: Corruption across EU
 

Nice one Pedro.

Re: Corruption across EU
 

The auditors can't sign off a budget if you've got tax havens like Monaco and Gibraltar. These places are created purely to cheat the 'mother' countries out of tax revenues. in this case the UK and France.

We have romantic notions of swashbuckling pirates and smugglers operating out of hidden coves in Cornwall and Scotland, we've got books, songs and films about those exciting people.

The truth is that they're a bunch of bloody crooks cheating the rest of us out of tax benefits.

Re: Corruption across EU
 

The irony is that the demonstrations in the Ukraine are because the government does NOT want closer ties with the EU but the population does.
I wonder why ??

Re: Corruption across EU
 

Probably a toss up as to which is the lesser of the two evils I suppose.:cool:

Re: Corruption across EU
 

Stating incorrectly makes a mockery of your entire post

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_haven

Re: Corruption across EU
 

I can only presume the Ukraine conflict has a lot more to do with Russia's corruption than corruption in the EU.

True, there is no shortage of "corruption" in the EU, but that pales by comparison to the east (and relative to the EU mindset of what the perfect society is). And frankly, it's not all that surprising. After all, is there a more "legal" way to circumvent obsessive regulation and taxation?

Naturally, as we write every aspect of everything into law, it's becomes much more likely that even perfectly honest, well-intentioned people will eventually go foul of the law at some point. In the EU, there's simply a lot of laws to break. Your chances of engaging in "corruption" are quite good, actually. Plus, the EU imposes amongst the highest taxation on the planet. I'd find it hard to accept that this alone doesn't inspire significant incentives to engage in "corrupt" measures to avoid them

In Spain, it could be argued it's a necessary part of life. And if that's the norm, then what's the difference between "forgetting" to charge 21% IVA in trade or giving a public servant a "gift" of a few €1000's for their help in getting say, a building permit that would otherwise be impossible to get without paying someone off? Both are illegal. Both could be considered "corruption", yet both are pretty common and expected means of getting things done.

So I reckon much of the population could therefore be deemed "corrupt" in some way, just by getting through life.

I find the entire concept of "tax haven" an interesting one. If you look at it another way, it could be characterised as a strategic demonisation of jurisdictions that don't happen to impose obsessive taxation on their population and their businesses.

Wouldn't it be ideal if there were no chance of achieving tax relief in the world? You think taxes are high now? Wait till there's no competition; 80% income tax, 40% VAT. And nowhere to go...

Re: Corruption across EU
 

I propose that the EU Commission havent got a clue whether the 120 billion figure is anywhere near right or wrong

Firstly, this isnt new news. This survey comes out every year

Secondly, the percentage of people in Spain saying corruption "affects" them has gone through the roof in the past few years. That is probably because the Barcenas scandel has put the corruption of politicians in the spotlight so Spaniards feel like they live in a corrupted country. But in monetry terms, we are speaking about a few million.

And what is defined as corruption? Not charging VAT? That isnt corruption in my book. MPs expenses in the UK? I'm not that is corruption either

Taking VAT off normal people to line the pockets of millionairres or start illegal wars is the very definition of corruption

Re: Corruption across EU
 

Agreed. Unfortunately, places like Spain are in the top tier of those engaging in lining pockets of the politically-connected. And you're right, it's nothing new. The problem is systemic in Spain and the south of Europe in general. It's been that way for generations. It's just more illegal now.

Starting illegal wars? Well, the current Syrian civil war is an excellent example of that. So far, the cost to the population is the greatest in modern history. But that isn't Europe, is it? Nonetheless, Russia clearly took the major role in supporting it for their own self-interests, so I reckon that's distantly relevant.

Re: Corruption across EU
 

The Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) identifies three key factors in considering whether a jurisdiction is a tax haven:

Nil or only nominal taxes. Tax havens impose nil or only nominal taxes (generally or in special circumstances) and offer themselves, or are perceived to offer themselves, as a place to be used by non-residents to escape high taxes in their country of residence.

Protection of personal financial information. Tax havens typically have laws or administrative practices under which businesses and individuals can benefit from strict rules and other protections against scrutiny by foreign tax authorities. This prevents the transmittance of information about taxpayers who are benefiting from the low tax jurisdiction.

Lack of transparency. A lack of transparency in the operation of the legislative, legal or administrative provisions is another factor used to identify tax havens. The OECD is concerned that laws should be applied openly and consistently, and that information needed by foreign tax authorities to determine a taxpayer’s situation is available. Lack of transparency in one country can make it difficult, if not impossible, for other tax authorities to apply their laws effectively. ‘Secret rulings’, negotiated tax rates, or other practices that fail to apply the law openly and consistently are examples of a lack of transparency. Limited regulatory supervision or a government’s lack of legal access to financial records are contributing factors.

However the OECD found that its definition caught certain aspects of its members' tax systems (some countries have low or zero taxes, Ring Fencing for certain favored groups). Its later work has therefore focused on the single aspect of information exchange

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_haven

Re: Corruption across EU
 

It happens all the time in the UK too, but in the UK you will be sure that the politicians have passed a law to make lining their pockets legal beforehand. They are better at covering their backs than the Spanish politicians

The Iraq war was illegal by thw way. The United Nations rejected the notion, but the UK, US and Spain went ahead anyway. The US in the search of profits, and the UK and Spain for their own sycophantic needs