advice please re UK tv in Spain
#526
Joined: Jun 2011
Location: In the middle of 10million Olive Trees
Posts: 12,053
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
Maybe the loss of the aforementioned programmes will result in a further mass exodus of expats and a significant reduction in visitor numbers, plunging the desperate Spanish economy back into recession again.
Although techniques are continually improving, the propagation and transmission of radio waves is still not an exact or precise science so even with a reduced or redirected footprint there will probably still be fringe areas and side-lobes allowing signals to be received outside the targeted area just as is the case now, so as was previously mentioned it's simply a matter of waiting to see which way the cookie crumbles.
Although techniques are continually improving, the propagation and transmission of radio waves is still not an exact or precise science so even with a reduced or redirected footprint there will probably still be fringe areas and side-lobes allowing signals to be received outside the targeted area just as is the case now, so as was previously mentioned it's simply a matter of waiting to see which way the cookie crumbles.
It is possible to fine tune a satellite signal to concentrate the signal onto a building/antenna with high accuracy if you want to (although probably not with Astra technology)
#527
Forum Regular
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 178
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
yes I noticed the date of the article of course. just searched the origin of the problem looming. there seems to be a switch of satellites going on isn't it ?
what do say local UK sat installers in the costa del sol ?
from Oct 13 ( but also their update on Aug 23):
http://skyinmadrid.com/pages/news.html
Updated Sunday, 13 October, 2013
OCT
11
ASTRA 2E TECHNICIANS WORKING OVERTIME
Artist's impression of Astra 2E in earth orbit
Test transmissions of Astra 2E have unusually continued over the weekend. Its operators Astrium and SES Astra are clearly in a hurry to deploy the satellite by mid-December at the latest. After this time, no changes to the programme guide are permitted by Sky. This is to minimise any technical problems over the Christmas period, when fewer support staff are on duty. The BBC plans to launch five new HD channels when Astra 2E is available: BBC News HD, BBC Three HD, BBC Four HD, CBeebies HD and CBBC HD. It's probable these will be launched before the holiday season. All BBC channels, including new services, will be on the UK-only beam.
what do say local UK sat installers in the costa del sol ?
from Oct 13 ( but also their update on Aug 23):
http://skyinmadrid.com/pages/news.html
Updated Sunday, 13 October, 2013
OCT
11
ASTRA 2E TECHNICIANS WORKING OVERTIME
Artist's impression of Astra 2E in earth orbit
Test transmissions of Astra 2E have unusually continued over the weekend. Its operators Astrium and SES Astra are clearly in a hurry to deploy the satellite by mid-December at the latest. After this time, no changes to the programme guide are permitted by Sky. This is to minimise any technical problems over the Christmas period, when fewer support staff are on duty. The BBC plans to launch five new HD channels when Astra 2E is available: BBC News HD, BBC Three HD, BBC Four HD, CBeebies HD and CBBC HD. It's probable these will be launched before the holiday season. All BBC channels, including new services, will be on the UK-only beam.
Last edited by sam54140; Oct 25th 2013 at 12:47 am.
#528
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
Or they move into an area where the signals are better and can be received (well for potentially the next 15 years - like the Valencia area...good for that areas economy - I think I know of an excellent sat tv installer around there
#529
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
But then in some areas, the UK beam of the first new satellite, 2F, is available on a 1m dish. I can even receive it on my 80cm dish where I live...so although people assume the UK beam is tighter, in some areas the "hotspot" or "side lobe" means reception is a lot better than the past "uk beam" from the previous 2D satellite, that required 1.8 and 2.4m dishes.
So if 2E and 2F are the same, then yes although it is a UK beam, and although the beam has been tightened, some areas will benefit more than others...
Essentially, the "side lobe" from the previous satellite, that was over the costa del sol (where they could receive signals on 1.25m dishes) has been tightened up and based on 2F, has moved up the coast to over the Valencia / Alicante area. The "null area" that used to be over the Valencia / Alicante area has also moved up the costa and is now in the Barcelona / Catalonia area.
So although it says a "uk only beam" there is signal overspill into other areas, so the beam is not simply a "uk only" beam..
#530
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
I agree with your technical assessment - other than IME side lobes aren't a quirk of propogation (if they were they would fade in and out and be subject to sunspot activity more than usual). They are engineered at the behest of the client.
It is possible to fine tune a satellite signal to concentrate the signal onto a building/antenna with high accuracy if you want to (although probably not with Astra technology)
It is possible to fine tune a satellite signal to concentrate the signal onto a building/antenna with high accuracy if you want to (although probably not with Astra technology)
If the side lobes on sat tv transmissions could easily be eliminated, I'm inclined to think some sat tv provider would have done it my now.
#531
Forum Regular
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 87
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
there seems to be alot of US products that are broadcast with Spanish dubbing and the original English language available from selection (a benefit of digital), with the Aussie Sea Patrol just coming to an end.
Some are broadcast in the 3-5 slot, others in the 10.30-0030, the former are usually repeated the following afternoon in the 1-3 slot on another channel.
We are currently getting Vikings, have had Game of Thrones.
But it would be nice to be able to get one or two of the Spanish made series in English.
With the increase in the number of adults as well as children now learning English it would be useful for them to get to see more from the UK, which is the version of English they are learning rather than the American version.
`
Some are broadcast in the 3-5 slot, others in the 10.30-0030, the former are usually repeated the following afternoon in the 1-3 slot on another channel.
We are currently getting Vikings, have had Game of Thrones.
But it would be nice to be able to get one or two of the Spanish made series in English.
With the increase in the number of adults as well as children now learning English it would be useful for them to get to see more from the UK, which is the version of English they are learning rather than the American version.
`
I'm not saying I disagree with you, TDT is alright. Clan has really been good as far as the kids are concerned but I find it hard to find any informative shows, I miss the doco's on the bbc channels, Horizon and I might not even get to see the last episode of Sky at Night before they cull it.
TDT has some good entertainment and movies but it's a bit cheap, watchable but only because there is nothing else on.
Plus the whole thing is a mess, Vikings is a good example. After the first week we had settled in to watch the series but the second week the clowns in the producers office didn't hit the English switch so there was no English option, Week 3 it's back in English but because of a mild case of OCD I will now wait for the dvd at Christmas. This happens quite often with various shows. It may be a regional thing I don't know.
As a side Top Chef which has started is a good show in Spanish to help as a language aid.
At the end of the day I just want the 4 BBCs and I'll be happy, we are supposed to have wimax installed today but again it's been a week without any acknowledgement the appointment was even booked so it's anyone's guess if they'll turn up.
My vote goes with No.
#532
Forum Regular
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 178
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
Yes.
But then in some areas, the UK beam of the first new satellite, 2F, is available on a 1m dish. I can even receive it on my 80cm dish where I live...so although people assume the UK beam is tighter, in some areas the "hotspot" or "side lobe" means reception is a lot better than the past "uk beam" from the previous 2D satellite, that required 1.8 and 2.4m dishes.
So if 2E and 2F are the same, then yes although it is a UK beam, and although the beam has been tightened, some areas will benefit more than others...
Essentially, the "side lobe" from the previous satellite, that was over the costa del sol (where they could receive signals on 1.25m dishes) has been tightened up and based on 2F, has moved up the coast to over the Valencia / Alicante area. The "null area" that used to be over the Valencia / Alicante area has also moved up the costa and is now in the Barcelona / Catalonia area.
So although it says a "uk only beam" there is signal overspill into other areas, so the beam is not simply a "uk only" beam..
But then in some areas, the UK beam of the first new satellite, 2F, is available on a 1m dish. I can even receive it on my 80cm dish where I live...so although people assume the UK beam is tighter, in some areas the "hotspot" or "side lobe" means reception is a lot better than the past "uk beam" from the previous 2D satellite, that required 1.8 and 2.4m dishes.
So if 2E and 2F are the same, then yes although it is a UK beam, and although the beam has been tightened, some areas will benefit more than others...
Essentially, the "side lobe" from the previous satellite, that was over the costa del sol (where they could receive signals on 1.25m dishes) has been tightened up and based on 2F, has moved up the coast to over the Valencia / Alicante area. The "null area" that used to be over the Valencia / Alicante area has also moved up the costa and is now in the Barcelona / Catalonia area.
So although it says a "uk only beam" there is signal overspill into other areas, so the beam is not simply a "uk only" beam..
since you know this field, would the largest dish still allow to "grab" that new beam though, with careful precise orientation ? in the costa del sol
#533
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
But what that size is - I have no idea.
The largest dish I have seen available to buy is a 4m dish.
Next down from that is a 2.4m dish with extension panels to bring it up to 3.1m.
However I have not seen anyone test this size dish in CDS / Portugal area, so I have no idea if it can receive 2Fs uk beam...perhaps they may test when 2E is up and operational...
But there will be plenty for sale in Greece and Cyprus, as the 4m dishes is what they needed for the last 10 years to receive BBC ITVs...
A few years ago a German man in Brazil made his own 8m dish, and was able to receive the Astra 1 analogue signals on it in Brazil - even though he was miles from that satellites focus area...proof that if you have a large enough dish you can get signals...
#534
Forum Regular
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 178
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
4m , 8M???
anyway i guess costa del sol sat installers will get some juicy business replacing a ton of dishes then !!
anyway i guess costa del sol sat installers will get some juicy business replacing a ton of dishes then !!
#535
Banned
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 26,724
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
A 4m dish used on one of the big resorts in the Faro area ( Vila Sol ) apparently could not receive Astra 2F which knocks that idea on the head.
#536
Forum Regular
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 178
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
then which British channels will be still receivable via sat once the sat switch is completed ? I'm not that concerned at all. but I wonder how the community will be.
#537
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
All those that are currently on 2A - ie Sky and FTA channels
Those that are still on Eutelsat 28A - ie Sky and FTA channels
in other words - over 200...way too many to list...
look here: lyngsat.com/Eutelsat-28A-and-Astra-1N-2A-2F.html
anything on the "Uk beam" may be tricky to receive in some areas on their current dishes.
others on European and south beams should be fine.
But like I said, it all depends where you are and what sized dish you have - in the Valencia area you should still be able to receive BBC1HD ITV1, ITV1HD, C4HD and Fives on a 1m dish no problems....since they are available on 2Fs UK beam on a 1m dish in that area and should not be affected by 2E!
#538
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
Now that is the sort of information that is useful I have searched all links to see if anybody was getting 2F round Ayamonte and the answer seemed to be a big NO but no dish size quoted. This is the first indication of a large size that will not pull it in. So despite waiting for the new launch to confirm it looks like it will be DNS FOR ME.
#539
Joined: Jun 2011
Location: In the middle of 10million Olive Trees
Posts: 12,053
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
if they have transferred a sat transmission to another satellite and then subsequently altered the lobe and "tweaked" it, this means the lobe is in the hands of "the powers that be". They can switch it off whenever they like or move it elswhere to where their CEO may have just bought a house.
That they haven't done it means there is an ulterior motive, probably by Sky, to maintain the lobe over Iberia. This they know will enable them to keep several thousands of viewers on their books.
Remember that viewers, like mobil phone owners, are what statistics are made of.
#540
Re: advice please re UK tv in Spain
Dick, I don't think there is anything different between what I have said and what Guy has said.
if they have transferred a sat transmission to another satellite and then subsequently altered the lobe and "tweaked" it, this means the lobe is in the hands of "the powers that be". They can switch it off whenever they like or move it elswhere to where their CEO may have just bought a house.
That they haven't done it means there is an ulterior motive, probably by Sky, to maintain the lobe over Iberia. This they know will enable them to keep several thousands of viewers on their books.
Remember that viewers, like mobil phone owners, are what statistics are made of.
if they have transferred a sat transmission to another satellite and then subsequently altered the lobe and "tweaked" it, this means the lobe is in the hands of "the powers that be". They can switch it off whenever they like or move it elswhere to where their CEO may have just bought a house.
That they haven't done it means there is an ulterior motive, probably by Sky, to maintain the lobe over Iberia. This they know will enable them to keep several thousands of viewers on their books.
Remember that viewers, like mobil phone owners, are what statistics are made of.
Their position, size, shape and coverage are naturally dependent on the set up of the transmitting antenna.
The main objective is surely to ensure maximum signal within a designated area.
Where the side lobe coverage occurs beyond that is left in the hands of the Gods.
What say you GUY ?
An interesting discussion on the same subject below.
http://www.satellites.co.uk/forums/t...-spots.159841/