InVinoVeritas

A recall is outside of normal service intervals. A service bulletin is dealt with at the next service. This will most definitely be a recall but, of course, up to the owner if he waits until he needs to take his car in for something else.

missile

From a car owner's point of view, I can't get excited over this. Many of us have long suspected that MPG and emission figures are "massaged" and don't really reflect real world performance.

olivefarmer

What I was trying to say is "will the recall mod alter for the worse things like fuel economy and power?" We are told or so I understand that the defeat part only comes into operation if it senses it is being emmisions tested. But given this scandal how do we know. ? Given that scenario an untrusting driver might be tempted not to bother with the recall.

Fred James

True, but in the UK you are obliged to follow safety recalls. They could apply the same rules to this as a public health issue. It would also be possible to institute a check at MOT time that the change had been carried out. It could also be done, without your approval, if you have it services at a VAG dealer.

Of course we don't yet know if removing the hack would affect EU tests and if they did, they would also have to include permanent changes that could affect the performance and economy.

InVinoVeritas

There has to be a reason they installed the defeat device - maybe

1. It was cheaper to cheat than make the engine clean - in which case they will have to spend money on a urea injection system or similar
2. The engine wears quicker when in low emission mode
3. The engine produces less power
3. The engine uses more fuel
4. The engine runs less smoothly
5. The catalyser, EGR or something else gets clogged up

or any permutation of the above.

VW are keeping too quiet hoping the spotlight will move onto BMW or Mercedes but they must know why they did it - it was not by accident - so they could tell us but, oh no, we're just the !"£$%^& customer.

mikelincs

Yes, but in many countries the claimed emmissions etc are used to set the level of tax on the vehicle, so does the recall and admission that the fiigures have been 'masssaged' now mean that some people will end up paying more road tax.

These are the UK vehicle figures given by VAG

No. of UK cars affected by VW emission probs:
VW Passenger Cars: 508,276
VW Commercial: 79,838
Audi: 393,450
SEAT: 76,773
ŠKODA: 131,569

Fred James

If the CO2 emissions increased after any changes, I think it very unlikely that the UK government would change things retrospectively from the user's point of view. They would just stick with what it said on the original documents. That said, they could claim from VAG which is apparently what the Spanish government is planning to do with regard to cars subsided under their scrappage scheme.

That scheme gave you a €2000 discount on a new car when you scrapped a 10+ year old car and bought a new car with low CO2 emissions. Currently the maximum allowed is 120g. Their argument is that if the car is retested above that figure, then they will ask VW for their money back!

Fredbargate

Whilst I can see the seriousness in this I can also see the funny side considering this came from the US of A

There's a fleet-duty 4.8-liter V-8 rated at 14/19 mpg, too. The Sierra's luxury-edition V-8 cuts its best figures by at least a third, rated at 13/18 mpg.


2012 GMC Sierra 1500 Gas Mileage - The Car Connection


Which is the dirtier one of those or a VW Golf?

Fred James

They are petrols, so they are cleaner than the Golf with regard to NOx emissions.

Basically, they are killing the planet with CO2, but the Golf is killing the pedestrians with NOx!

I'm saving up for a Tesla - this one looks nice.

New Tesla Model X SUV revealed: pictures, specs and prices | Auto Express

Dick Dasterdly

There are so many different aspects to this affair, that I think anyone who believes it's nothing more than a matter of completing the necessary recalls could not be further from the mark.

That will probably only be the beginning, as the number of different groups of people who could well have a case for making a claim is absolutely mind boggling, apart from a full investigation and likely proceedings with regard to who knew what and who did what within VW itself.

Here are just a few of the questions to begin with.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-34400305

Dick Dasterdly

Good point, but more or less irrelevant as far as this case is concerned.

The big question is which are the illegal ones and who has a case for making a claim including car owners, dealers, shareholders, health authorities and even govts also bearing in mind the different regulations applicable in so many different countries worldwide.

johnnyone

This scandal is the equivalent of drug taking in sport to improve performance. It's cheating and VW/Audi should pay the consequences of that.
This scandal shows two main things to me:-
i) VW/Audi's business ethics are dubious.
ii) Far from being a frontrunner in engine technology VW is/was lagging some way behind the competition.

So much for German honesty and efficiency

InVinoVeritas

An article here on possible consequences for owners:-
Volkswagen's TDI 'Fix' Will Probably Mean Worse Fuel Economy And Less Performance

InVinoVeritas

This statement was issued by VW yesterday. You have to laugh at the last sentence:-

3. The Executive Committee has great respect for Chairman Professor Dr. Winterkorn’s offer to resign his position and to ask that his employment agreement be terminated. The Executive Committee notes that Professor Dr. Winterkorn had no knowledge of the manipulation of emissions data. The Executive Committee has tremendous respect for his willingness to nevertheless assume responsibility and, in so doing, to send a strong signal both internally and externally. Dr. Winterkorn has made invaluable contributions to Volkswagen. The company’s rise to global company is inextricably linked to his name. The Executive Committee thanks Dr. Winterkorn for towering contributions in the past decades and for his willingness to take responsibility in this criticall phase for the company. This attitude is illustrious.

jimenato