The other side of the coin...

http://my.telegraph.co.uk/expat/anna...-put-in-spain/

Looks like a typical Telegraph infomercial. Links to companies who have a vested interested in such news.
I used to like read the Torygraph on-line but a lot of articles, which are non main stream news, are getting like this.

But I have to say there seems to be some more questions about moving on this forum.

Yes, the usual churnalism with links to estate agent written by a happy clapper. these type of articles are paid for by the agents mentioned. About as reliable as someone saying they saw a bar full of people in Spain

If there isn't an exodus why are there thousands of homes owned by expats in Andalucia on sale...are they down/up sizing

Where I have a house there are definitely less expats, but are they being replaced by 2nd homers from the UK who eye a "bargain"?

No doubt there are quite a few who have deregistered due to the punitive measures taken by the Spanish Govt, and are now living under the radar.

Spain's loss is the UKs gain in that respect, as far as taxes are concerned, so the Spanish authorities in their extremely limited wisdom have shot themselves in the foot........... yet again........big-time.

Regarding the overall exodus, I see that the Spanish TV News has just confirmed that the total population has reduced yet again, for the second year running.

So the exodus overall is no myth at all but FACT and hardly a sign of a miraculous recovery, methinks.

Predicting the weather isn't a perfect science, but we do know that certain conditions produce certain results.

Considering that most expats only live comfortably in Spain if they have income from elsewhere, I'd have to believe those who don't have income from elsewhere have either left or are in process. Expat exodus? Only if they came here in search of work in the first place.

Plus, obviously young Spaniards are highly likely to leave in search of a life. There isn't much hope for a job for them here.

So, I'd have to believe that the conditions certainly exist for an exodus of certain profiles... But the latter is a far larger group than the former...

I believe it's all about tax. Expats, especially British ones, took fright when they saw their fellow expats lose money in Cyprus a couple of years ago; money they didn't owe which was just taken from their bank accounts. The Cypriots were going after the Russian tax cheats but the British expats just got in the way.

In a similar way the Spanish authorities have gone after Luis Barcena and their other big tax cheats and again the British expats have got in the way and look like losing their hard-earned money again.

But the expats are more alert this time. They've stopped believing all the tax advisors who only get them into trouble - they're trying a new way to get justice in a crooked and unjust system.

They're simply disappearing from the system, deregistering as though going home but in reality merely reverting from residence to tourist status.

The authorities are scratching their heads but nobody is counting.

I think you are right. My neighbour was actually advised to become non resident, though living here full time.
If these fraudsters are state pensioners and therefore on the Spanish health system, surely declaring themselves non residents would mean they are no longer entitled to free care, or do they continue their cheating ways by abusing the Ehic?

I actually walked the walk as well as talked the talk

Yes, in my mind was the tax situation which many on here poo poo (mainly because they don't seem to have large assets). However the original plan was to become non resident to avoid the tax declaration and rent the villa to holidaymakers. However we also put it up for sale, and despite the doom merchants saying we wont sell in Spain for years, it sold almost immediately.

It has been purchased it seems by a Brit Expat living in another part of europe, and although purchased as a holiday home he is now renting it out to holidaymakers. I suspect the incidence of holiday lets will increase. Although the 720 tax issue is still a mute point, many of those with sizeable assets will take what action they need to protect themselves

Good points made and a.

as you say it is very easy to poo poo the 720 And all it implies, if the harsher tax regime in Spain would not affect ones finances in a negative way.

For the expats that it could be detrimental to, many have adjusted their living arrangements accordingly, like us

We would rather pay the lions share of tax to a country that is a lot fairer to its citizens, and sadly Spain is not a fair country.

Will the holiday lets increase, though? New rules will make it much harder to rent out, so most will become illegal

the new rules you speak of do not seem to have been as draconian as was first told. As long as you register your property it seems to be fine (in the CB North anyway), and I know people who have done it with ease. The intimation was that the authorities would refuse permission or make impossible demands, but in reality it seems its a case of going down and paying the money

These new rules you write about are not covering all of Spain, at present. Plus it should be said where they are laws they are differing from comunidad to another comunidad. Most of the new regulations do not make it hard to rent out. Just a few more bits of paperwork to deal with.

I have also just read this:
Glut of cheap Costa properties.
Again the cynic in me says this in another commercial for a property company.

At the end of the day the Exodus is no Myth, but cold hard facts and not only in one sense, but two,
........ unfortunately in both cases, Spain is the big time loser.

On the one hand there is the exodus of expats and others from the punitive Spanish taxation system, most preferring instead to opt for the much fairer UK system.

On the other hand we have the continued exodus of Spanish workers, many of them highly skilled, having earned their qualifications at the expense of Spain.

Even worse many of those who don't make the grade or can't cut the mustard abroad, return to add to Spanish unemployment figures, while many of the better or more successful ones look to stay in their newly adopted country permanently.