Inselaffen

Jan to November 2016 Germany had a GBP 29.23 billion trade surplus with the UK.
They are not going to put that at risk with punitive tariffs.

scrubbedexpat141

Maybe we should get together with the Germans and a load of other European nations and set up some sort of club where we trade easily and don't restrict movement and stuff like that. Would be pretty good right?

The £200+ billion exports of goods and services to other EU countries were worth about 12% of the value of the British economy in 2015, and £230 billion or 13% in 2014. It’s stayed at around 13-15% over the past decade. You can argue that the EU is worth a lot more to the UK than the UK is worth to the EU.

Inselaffen

you mean like EFTA?

Miss Ann Thrope

EFTA = soft Brexit.... including freedom of movement.

ExpatAl

I like Hague even if he was a Remainer

Another general election would be a wise move. Conservatives would clear up and come out with an even stronger hand.

Labour is a shambles with Corbyn at the helm. Ukip had potential but Paul Nuttall scuppered their chances with the loss at Stoke. With the Copeland by-election, it shows that even the working classes approve of May...

scrubbedexpat141

Inselaffen

my point was we should have stayed as EFTA members.

The EU is vastly undemocratic and corrupt behemoth. Personally I would have voted to remain despite the massive reforms that are needed, but unlikely to ever occur, within the EU. However, having seen the reaction of Junker and his cronies I would now probably vote leave (if I had a vote).

scrubbedexpat141

My Mum says something similar, that 'it's not what we signed up for'.

It's an argument I can totally accept, I just think that now, the EU is such a large global player that you're either in or out. Half measures (as it appears we are finding out from all angles) are just not of interest.

Inselaffen

the bureaucrats from the EU institutions are the ones who are making the biggest noise about no half measures. They are not the ones who have to deal with the impact on their nation's economies.

The UK is after all still the world's 5-6th largest economy. The leaders of the main EU nations seem to grasp better that enforcing a hard brexit will also hit the EU economy, which is already in a perilously fragile state.

Johnnyboy11

I enjoyed reading this article on Zerohedge:

European Commission Presents Five Scenarios For The Future Of Europe

Particularly the comments section

scrubbedexpat141

I think, in the grand scheme of things that both will be 'fine'.

I don't however, believe that either will come out of this too positively for quite some time and will be long term worse off. Our service based economy doesn't particularly lend itself to being outside of the parties and negotiating things like access from a point of total weakness.

IKnowNothing

How can it be that we have a negative balance of payments to the EU, ie we buy more from them than they sell to us?

Surely that puts us in a stronger position.

And i really don't think the german carmakers will absorb the alleged 15% hike in prices, living in cloud cuckoo land again there, what they may do is de-spec their cars to still make the same margin.

So buy a vehicle made in Britain instead, Jaguar Land Rover is good (Indian owned but employing and utilising a lot of UK workers), or a Japanese/Korean, even a decent yank tank.

There are options out there.

scrubbedexpat141

IKnowNothing

Oh bugger off, you know what i meant.

scrubbedexpat141

I do. I don't disagree totally to be honest and am having such a wank day that tI don't have the appetite to argue over the EU. **** 'em. It's a mess the whole EU and every single member nation has been responsible for since the vote. Too much mud-slinging and bullshit. Too much threats and rebukes and rebuttals and all round guff.