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Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Old Jun 2nd 2014, 2:27 pm
  #76  
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by Norm_uk
That is very presumptuous of you. Do you actually know what I believed in or are you assuming it wasn't Islam so therefore wasn't true?



Nothing wrong with pondering and questioning. Some of the greatest critics in early Islam can from within Islam.

Christianity teaches people to 'work out their salvation with fear and trembling' and certain sects of Judaism make study a majority priority so your claim that the Koran is unique in this regard doesn't hold water with me - but this is a side issue of course.
My real question is if you find evidence indicating the claims in the Koran might not be as true and perfect as you clearly believe they are will you adjust your beliefs or even leave Islam should the evidence be overwhelming?

N.

Faith in Islam is hierarchical in nature, you establish one belief then you build the next belief on top of it. When scientists, for example, established without a shroud of doubt that the earth is round they began to understand the natural phenomenons around them and every new natural phenomenon they discover it reinforces their belief that the earth is round. Equally well, my faith goes all the way back to my firm belief that this physical world must have a supernatural creator that exists outside it. When I’d established this belief I began to follow that route of thinking and began to understand all the worlds phenomenons around and each one of them reinforced my belief that there has to be a creator. May be if scientists finds out later on that the earth after all is actually flat and not round then I may change my idea about the creation!
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Old Jun 2nd 2014, 2:46 pm
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by redShark
/Quran clearly states there is no compulsion in religion
And yet the penalty for apostasy is death. So how do your push that square peg into a round hole? The usual religious cognitive dissonance.
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Old Jun 2nd 2014, 3:27 pm
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by redShark
Faith in Islam is hierarchical in nature, you establish one belief then you build the next belief on top of it. When scientists, for example, established without a shroud of doubt that the earth is round they began to understand the natural phenomenons around them and every new natural phenomenon they discover it reinforces their belief that the earth is round. Equally well, my faith goes all the way back to my firm belief that this physical world must have a supernatural creator that exists outside it. When I’d established this belief I began to follow that route of thinking and began to understand all the worlds phenomenons around and each one of them reinforced my belief that there has to be a creator. May be if scientists finds out later on that the earth after all is actually flat and not round then I may change my idea about the creation!
Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.-cards.jpg
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Old Jun 2nd 2014, 11:31 pm
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by Bahtatboy
I quick ham shank's alright now and again, but you really need to felake a flake, try 3 Musketeers, a Big Turk or Mr Big, lose your Cherry Cocktail, get your lips round a Curly Wurly, do the Double Decker, glide down a Glosette, take a Grand Slam, join up with some Nut Lovers, scream Oh Henry!, get Rocky Hard, try a Seven Up Bar, Take 5, tease a Texan, tongue a Toblerone, and caress some Woodies.

But only After Eight.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ate_bar_brands
You forgot playing with my pineapple lumps and licking chocolate fish, two New Zealand staples
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Old Jun 2nd 2014, 11:35 pm
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by redShark
Faith in Islam is hierarchical in nature, you establish one belief then you build the next belief on top of it. When scientists, for example, established without a shroud of doubt that the earth is round they began to understand the natural phenomenons around them and every new natural phenomenon they discover it reinforces their belief that the earth is round. Equally well, my faith goes all the way back to my firm belief that this physical world must have a supernatural creator that exists outside it. When I’d established this belief I began to follow that route of thinking and began to understand all the worlds phenomenons around and each one of them reinforced my belief that there has to be a creator. May be if scientists finds out later on that the earth after all is actually flat and not round then I may change my idea about the creation!
Where does this supernatural creator come from ? Did it conjure itself from thin air or was it created by another creator ? And so on and so on.
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Old Jun 2nd 2014, 11:36 pm
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by martinbkk
Combining sex with pork might be questionable, this Jock thought sex with a bike okay though

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/7095134.stm
Let's not complicate things further by bringing apparatus into the argument
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Old Jun 3rd 2014, 5:20 am
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by redShark
Faith in Islam is hierarchical in nature, you establish one belief then you build the next belief on top of it. When scientists, for example, established without a shroud of doubt that the earth is round they began to understand the natural phenomenons around them and every new natural phenomenon they discover it reinforces their belief that the earth is round. Equally well, my faith goes all the way back to my firm belief that this physical world must have a supernatural creator that exists outside it. When I’d established this belief I began to follow that route of thinking and began to understand all the worlds phenomenons around and each one of them reinforced my belief that there has to be a creator. May be if scientists finds out later on that the earth after all is actually flat and not round then I may change my idea about the creation!
The shape of the Earth is not a 'belief'.
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Old Jun 3rd 2014, 6:22 am
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by Sally Redux
The shape of the Earth is not a 'belief'.
It can be, after all gravity is only a theory
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Old Jun 3rd 2014, 7:38 am
  #84  
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by mikewot
It can be, after all gravity is only a theory
No its not. Its an observable, measurable, quantifiable, explicable, demonstrable, proven and applicable physical phenomenon.
Isaac.
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Old Jun 3rd 2014, 8:10 am
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by Bahtatboy
No its not. Its an observable, measurable, quantifiable, explicable, demonstrable, proven and applicable physical phenomenon.
Isaac.
But still 'only' a theory, as in The theory of gravity.
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Old Jun 3rd 2014, 1:08 pm
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by Norm_uk
I see.
It still requires assumptions to begin with, since it is assumed a creator exists and that creator is the one that is described in the Koran (different religions have different characteristics of deity even within monotheisms. The god of Judaism, Christianity and Islam are clearly not the same if one goes by their scriptures and ignores the claims - the nature of salvation, sin, spreading the word and the requirement for non-believers to convert or not convert all differ).
N.
You are the one who is making an illogical assumption by assuming that an existence can happen without a source. The concept of Creation is far more logical to comprehend than th assumption you are proposing and let me show you how.

In each story of creation there are always always always three players:
1- there is a supernatural creator who sets the laws and the rules.
2- there is creation,
3- and finally there is a purpose for the creation.

Our own creation is just one example of creation, I can quote you numerous other examples of creations, but just let me give one example, Micky mouse! In this example of creation there is a supernatural creator who is the cartoonist who created the stories and the scenarios in the cartoon. There is Micky mouse, the creation itself, and finally there is a purpose which is the entertainment of the American people. The world that Micky mouse exists in is the TV screen. Now if Micky mouse was an atheist he would think in exactly the same way as you think, that there is no cartoonist (creator) because he can’t see him inside the TV screen. Micky mouse is failing to understand that there is a 3 dimensional world outside his 2 dimenstional world that has different laws and rules.
Now it is your turn to quote me an example, just one example, of an existence that has no original source!!!!!!! Go on I am waiting for an answer…….

Originally Posted by Norm_uk
I am not convinced you would reject or modify your beliefs in the light of evidence because your posts show you are either ignoring many basic facts of biology, chemistry, physics, cosmology and history in favour of what one particular book says. But this is not unique for someone of clearly strong faith
N.
On the contrary, you are the one who ignored the scientific facts that I mentioned earlier about biology, astronomy, occanology, etc. that Quran made reference to and which has now proven to be true by modern theories. I don’t think you’ve actually watched the video I posted earlier.

Originally Posted by Norm_uk
Were you born and raised in Islam or did you convert?
N.
I am actually not a convert but I took the Quran challenge of ‘prove me I am wrong if you can’ much earlier in my life and reached a conclusion that this book is actually the right way of life for the human race. Much like others who had taken on the same challenge and ended up submitting to it.
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Old Jun 3rd 2014, 1:10 pm
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by Vitalstatistix
Where does this supernatural creator come from ? Did it conjure itself from thin air or was it created by another creator ? And so on and so on.
You are a bit late dear, because we had already discussed those subject before. I am rather more intrigued to learn about the pineapples you grow and wonder what they test like!!!
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Old Jun 3rd 2014, 2:00 pm
  #88  
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by redShark
In each story of creation there are always always always three players:
1- there is a supernatural creator who sets the laws and the rules.
2- there is creation,
3- and finally there is a purpose for the creation.

Our own creation is just one example of creation, I can quote you numerous other examples of creations, but just let me give one example, Micky mouse!
And there you've hit the nail on the head: story. And Micky Mouse sums it up perfectly.

However, you have eventually got round to presenting an analogy that is the only one which merits serious debate (debate, not mindless adherence). Yes, there is the possibility of other dimensions, in which life and creation happens, and it is an interesting idea to consider. However, the jump from an interesting idea to consider to founding you whole life on, with absolutely no proof whatsoever that either the idea is tenable or is linked to a book written a couple of centuries ago, is astounding. The Flying Spaghetti Monster is just as likely.
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Old Jun 3rd 2014, 3:22 pm
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by Bahtatboy
No its not. Its an observable, measurable, quantifiable, explicable, demonstrable, proven and applicable physical phenomenon.
Isaac.
Hayes?
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Old Jun 3rd 2014, 4:21 pm
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Default Re: Malay Muslim groups to wage 'jihad' against Cadbury.

Originally Posted by Sally Redux
Hayes?
Chocolate Salty Balls
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