Blue Cat

and that is fine by me

Grace O Malley

When i was little, i used to love tourists coming to our town in the summer,the place would be buzzing. Now it drives me mad, nowhere to park, all restaurants full, huge queues in supervalue, disaster.

Blue Cat

tourists here used to be great, in latter years however there have been to many of them!!

Ethos83

There's nothing untrue in the article.

But it is very one sided. And why do the journalists always only interview Brits when they are semi-drunk in hotel bars?

But to dump on the article is also missing some of the point: Dubai is very sordid, more so than most cities back home because of the deliberate exploitation of the masses of cheap labour from the Indian subcontinent and the Philippines. Every single one of us compromises some of the values we, in theory, grew up with in the West when we decided to settle down in Dubai.

And god forbid if something should ever happen to you in Dubai. You could easily be the next Western victim sacrificed by the powers that be to make a point, lest some labourer decides to commit suicide by jumping in front of your car, or your illegal maid is discovered, or whatever excuse they come up with. As expats we have absolutely no rights in this country, and the legal system is hardly transparent and fair. The Emiratis don't like us, we don't like the Emiratis, we both take advantage of our Philippino maids and we both turn a blind eye to the labourers. Tis makes up for a very weird, weird and weird city.

The Economist article is more interesting, IMHO. The Makhtoums borrowed their country's future to sustain a fantastic spending spree (which isn't just fancy buildings but also lavish salaries in the public sectors, where most Emiratis work). Now that the party is over, if the Makhtoums can't sustain the quality of life the Emiratis have very quickly become accustomed to, it could spell trouble of some sort down the road.

Bonny Boy

....and who makes all the 'stuff' people buy in the shops back home?

Here it is just more visible.

klaus3974

Quite right! You slave people through trade in goods! But you know... we western are full of double standards. It is good that we create channels for rivers all around Europe, that the Dutch have created thousand of artificial islands... but the Palm Jumeirah is a horrific experiment.

Blue Cat

the Emiratis used to like us, their shift change in attitude happened when the country 'exploded' and Emaar started selling properties. I think up to that point they felt they had a reasonable amount of control of their own country. Now they deliberately 'punish' expats to make their point, that this is their Country. Do you not think that for years and years people have been having illegal sex, drink driving, buying alcohol and getting caught? cause they did but in those days the Emiratis weren't bothered or upset by those who got caught and they were very rarely fined. We have always known the rules and yes it is hard to sometimes turn a blind eye to what is going on but we have made our choices and have to live with them. Personally I feel if you treat people as you would like to be treat then you will have no problems with any cultures here.

Weird old place aint it!

Ethos83

Oh, puhleeze.

We can bitch about the origins of cheap shlock made in China and environmental issues, but that's entirely missing the point.

In the West, we have a thing called a legal system, which is generally applicable to every resident of the said western country regardless of their economic or social status.

In the West, our governments don't sanction the import millions of labour to pay them pennies a hour without benefits, and when we're finished with them, kick them out of the country.

In the West, we don't jail women for giving birth outside marriage, or committing adultery, or god forbid, for being in the same room with a man.

Bonny Boy

I think you miss the point!


The point I'm making is that in the West the lives of those who contribute to the standard of living there are hidden.

In the UAE they are in full view.

Hence you are no less 'moral' and have not compromised on 'values' by living in Dubai anymore than people living back home.

Blue Cat

[QUOTE=Ethos83;7767747]Oh, puhleeze.

We can bitch about the origins of cheap shlock made in China and environmental issues, but that's entirely missing the point.

In the West, we have a thing called a legal system, which is generally applicable to every resident of the said western country regardless of their economic or social status.

In the West, our governments don't sanction the import millions of labour to pay them pennies a hour without benefits, and when we're finished with them, kick them out of the country.

In the West, we don't jail women for giving birth outside marriage, or committing adultery, or god forbid, for being in the same room with a man.[/QUOTE]

it is this that I find hardest to understand. We all know an understand the basis of Islam etc, it has been discussed enough on here. But you would think that in this day and age the beheading of women who have an affair really would have been phased out. Apparently the poor woman who is in jail now with her new born would have rather have gone to jail here than return to her home country. Why - because they would have both been killed. It is wrong and it has got to stop. As long as Dubai keep imprisoning women for being a woman then the rest of the world won't have any respect for them. They can't keep hiding behind the Islam flag.

Roadking

[QUOTE=Blue Cat;7767831] Don't quote me but it worn't me...

klaus3974

As Bonny Boy said... you are totally missing the point. There are two different things we are talking here. I do agree with you in what you said but does not make what I (or Bonny Boy) said less true.

Hey... I am also western, white and tall... so I love all the values you mention and find horrible a lot of the things here. I just try to be careful with the culture and traditions of the place (in my first day here, I got in an elevator with 5 Emirati women and everybody looked at me amazed... will not do it again).

Ethos83

Nae.

I get what you and bonny boy say, but it's still ludicrous to make the justification. Thinking back to university days and all the loony lefties protesting for fair trade and sustainably farmed coffee from Peru, but such a thing cannot happen out here. People in the West are aware. People attempt to make changes. We don't hide from our ills or problems the way the Emiratis do. The government here won't allow publication of their problems in fear of causing a black stain on Dubai's image.

There's a reason why it's Dubai and not the UK that's getting called on for human rights violations.

klaus3974

C'mon... stop been unrealistic and going around the argument. Two bads do not do a good. One thing is what we feel, think and said is right and the other thing is what we actually DO. We keep buying goods made by cheap labour (and when I said cheap, think that they are made by people who made one third of what labourers make here. Hard to believe, eh?). While we all believe in a better world, our government, companies, and consumers are not willing to sacrifice part of their consumption and life style to improve the lives of those in developing countries. The current productivity levels in Europe and the States are not high enough to mantain a middle class of the size we actually have. For every protest trying to save coffee small holders producers in Peru, there is a big supermarket or corporation controling the coffee value chain, paying peanuts to producers. So, yes, we are really out spoken, and yes it is great that we can do that in the West while is not possible here. But in the aggregate we have not been very sucessful in improving the living standards of those we like to say we care about.

Meow

Same old, same old. Shame of Rod Little for seemingly having made up his mind before he came here. Heavens knows it is far from perfect, not that anywhere is, but to tar us all with the same brush is lazy. It anoys me to hear the 'all Westerners are awful' line, yet again.

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