Islam's war on freedom....
Feb 22nd 2009, 3:46 pm
#121
BE Enthusiast
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 353
Re: Islam's war on freedom....
[QUOTE=MacScot;7310078]O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors. They are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is one of them . . .(Surah 5:51).[/QUOTE
That refers to political alliances between states. If it meant literally on a personal level than Jews would not have lived in Medina during the time of the Prophet.
Look at the line you quoted, think of recent history where for the first time Muslim states have taken non-Muslim states as friends and protectors, eg USA and UN, has it been of any benefit? Has Palestinians turning to the UN solved anything for them? Has the 'Friendship' of the Royal families of the Gulf states with their great friend the protector the USA done anything for the Palestinians? Where did Sadams friendship with the USA get Iraq? So basically that line you quoted means don't become dependent on Non Muslims, because in serious matters they will always side with their own.
Instead of posting your concerns about Islam here, why not go to your local mosque In Dubai, Riyadh, Manama, Muscat etc and take up your concerns there? Be a killer, robber, junkie, but don't be a hypocrite for that there is no remedy
That refers to political alliances between states. If it meant literally on a personal level than Jews would not have lived in Medina during the time of the Prophet.
Look at the line you quoted, think of recent history where for the first time Muslim states have taken non-Muslim states as friends and protectors, eg USA and UN, has it been of any benefit? Has Palestinians turning to the UN solved anything for them? Has the 'Friendship' of the Royal families of the Gulf states with their great friend the protector the USA done anything for the Palestinians? Where did Sadams friendship with the USA get Iraq? So basically that line you quoted means don't become dependent on Non Muslims, because in serious matters they will always side with their own.
Instead of posting your concerns about Islam here, why not go to your local mosque In Dubai, Riyadh, Manama, Muscat etc and take up your concerns there? Be a killer, robber, junkie, but don't be a hypocrite for that there is no remedy
Last edited by Worldismine; Feb 22nd 2009 at 3:55 pm.
Feb 22nd 2009, 3:49 pm
#122
Excess Baggage
Joined: Jul 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 5,479
Re: Islam's war on freedom....
[QUOTE=Worldismine;7310758]
It's amazing how these verses from the Koran and the Bible can be interpreted in so many ways. It makes you wonder if God is actually a comedian who is just stirring things up for us mortals.
O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors. They are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is one of them . . .(Surah 5:51).[/QUOTE
That refers to political alliances between states. If it meant literally on a personal level than Jews would not have lived in Medina during the time of the Prophet.
Look at the line you quoted, think of recent history where for the first time Muslim states have taken non-Muslim states as friends and protectors, eg USA and UN, has it been of any benefit? Has Palestinians turning to the UN solved anything for them? Has the 'Friendship' of the Royal families of the Gulf states with their great friend the protector the USA done anything for the Palestinians? Where did Sadams friendship with the USA get Iraq? So basically that line you quoted means don't become dependent on Non Muslims, because in serious matters they will always side with their own.
That refers to political alliances between states. If it meant literally on a personal level than Jews would not have lived in Medina during the time of the Prophet.
Look at the line you quoted, think of recent history where for the first time Muslim states have taken non-Muslim states as friends and protectors, eg USA and UN, has it been of any benefit? Has Palestinians turning to the UN solved anything for them? Has the 'Friendship' of the Royal families of the Gulf states with their great friend the protector the USA done anything for the Palestinians? Where did Sadams friendship with the USA get Iraq? So basically that line you quoted means don't become dependent on Non Muslims, because in serious matters they will always side with their own.
Feb 22nd 2009, 4:13 pm
#123
BE Forum Addict
Joined: May 2007
Location: Utopia
Posts: 1,644
Re: Islam's war on freedom....
Look at the line you quoted, think of recent history where for the first time Muslim states have taken non-Muslim states as friends and protectors, eg USA and UN, has it been of any benefit? Has Palestinians turning to the UN solved anything for them? Has the 'Friendship' of the Royal families of the Gulf states with their great friend the protector the USA done anything for the Palestinians? Where did Sadams friendship with the USA get Iraq? So basically that line you quoted means don't become dependent on Non Muslims, because in serious matters they will always side with their own.
Instead of posting your concerns about Islam here, why not go to your local mosque In Dubai, Riyadh, Manama, Muscat etc and take up your concerns there? Be a killer, robber, junkie, but don't be a hypocrite for that there is no remedy
Feb 22nd 2009, 5:57 pm
#124
**** it we'll do it live
Joined: Oct 2004
Location: Dubai
Posts: 7,892
Re: Islam's war on freedom....
[QUOTE=Worldismine;7310758]
ok so your hypothesis is that the entire muslim world has achieved everything it currently has and is not because of the western infedel pigs but despite them !!!!!!!
now that is delusional
oh and who ar eyou to decide that macscots quote is taken in the wrong way, are you god? no, then stfu his interpretation is as valid if not more so as he is a scientist with no religious bias.
(ok he is biased, reason and logic are a real bitch of a master)
O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors. They are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is one of them . . .(Surah 5:51).[/QUOTE
That refers to political alliances between states. If it meant literally on a personal level than Jews would not have lived in Medina during the time of the Prophet.
Look at the line you quoted, think of recent history where for the first time Muslim states have taken non-Muslim states as friends and protectors, eg USA and UN, has it been of any benefit? Has Palestinians turning to the UN solved anything for them? Has the 'Friendship' of the Royal families of the Gulf states with their great friend the protector the USA done anything for the Palestinians? Where did Sadams friendship with the USA get Iraq? So basically that line you quoted means don't become dependent on Non Muslims, because in serious matters they will always side with their own.
Instead of posting your concerns about Islam here, why not go to your local mosque In Dubai, Riyadh, Manama, Muscat etc and take up your concerns there? Be a killer, robber, junkie, but don't be a hypocrite for that there is no remedy
That refers to political alliances between states. If it meant literally on a personal level than Jews would not have lived in Medina during the time of the Prophet.
Look at the line you quoted, think of recent history where for the first time Muslim states have taken non-Muslim states as friends and protectors, eg USA and UN, has it been of any benefit? Has Palestinians turning to the UN solved anything for them? Has the 'Friendship' of the Royal families of the Gulf states with their great friend the protector the USA done anything for the Palestinians? Where did Sadams friendship with the USA get Iraq? So basically that line you quoted means don't become dependent on Non Muslims, because in serious matters they will always side with their own.
Instead of posting your concerns about Islam here, why not go to your local mosque In Dubai, Riyadh, Manama, Muscat etc and take up your concerns there? Be a killer, robber, junkie, but don't be a hypocrite for that there is no remedy
ok so your hypothesis is that the entire muslim world has achieved everything it currently has and is not because of the western infedel pigs but despite them !!!!!!!
now that is delusional
oh and who ar eyou to decide that macscots quote is taken in the wrong way, are you god? no, then stfu his interpretation is as valid if not more so as he is a scientist with no religious bias.
(ok he is biased, reason and logic are a real bitch of a master)
Feb 22nd 2009, 6:18 pm
#125
BE Enthusiast
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 353
Re: Islam's war on freedom....
[QUOTE=shiva;7311020]
ok so your hypothesis is that the entire muslim world has achieved everything it currently has and is not because of the western infedel pigs but despite them !!!!!!!
now that is delusional
oh and who ar eyou to decide that macscots quote is taken in the wrong way, are you god? no, then stfu his interpretation is as valid if not more so as he is a scientist with no religious bias.
(ok he is biased, reason and logic are a real bitch of a master)
Repeat after me, woooooosaaaaa, woooosaaaaa, now gently inhale and exhale. Now inhale as you say woooo and exhale as you say saaaaa.
ok so your hypothesis is that the entire muslim world has achieved everything it currently has and is not because of the western infedel pigs but despite them !!!!!!!
now that is delusional
oh and who ar eyou to decide that macscots quote is taken in the wrong way, are you god? no, then stfu his interpretation is as valid if not more so as he is a scientist with no religious bias.
(ok he is biased, reason and logic are a real bitch of a master)
Feb 23rd 2009, 4:26 am
#126
A bubbly-jock...
Joined: Mar 2005
Location: Teneriffe
Posts: 6,262
Re: Islam's war on freedom....
[QUOTE=shiva;7311020]
Actually, I didn't interpret the quote...my original post was simply the quote from the Koran (English language version)...I didn't make any interpretation. It was Worldismine that made that interpretation, which in subsequent BE quotes (e.g.,littlejimmy) appeared that I had made an interpretation. The interpretation was solely Worldismine's.
Feb 23rd 2009, 5:53 am
#127
**** it we'll do it live
Joined: Oct 2004
Location: Dubai
Posts: 7,892
Re: Islam's war on freedom....
[QUOTE=MacScot;7312345]
Actually, I didn't interpret the quote...my original post was simply the quote from the Koran (English language version)...I didn't make any interpretation. It was Worldismine that made that interpretation, which in subsequent BE quotes (e.g.,littlejimmy) appeared that I had made an interpretation. The interpretation was solely Worldismine's.
i stand corrected and briliantly it makes my point even more valid despite my being wrong 
Actually, I didn't interpret the quote...my original post was simply the quote from the Koran (English language version)...I didn't make any interpretation. It was Worldismine that made that interpretation, which in subsequent BE quotes (e.g.,littlejimmy) appeared that I had made an interpretation. The interpretation was solely Worldismine's.
Feb 23rd 2009, 7:10 am
#128
MODERATOR
Joined: Dec 2004
Location: Dubai
Posts: 6,370
Re: Islam's war on freedom....
[QUOTE=littlejimmy;7310760]
And people wonder why I advocate non-theistic religion!
N.
N.
Feb 23rd 2009, 8:14 am
#129
A bubbly-jock...
Joined: Mar 2005
Location: Teneriffe
Posts: 6,262
Re: Islam's war on freedom....
[QUOTE=Norm_uk;7312720]
..that's an interesting point ..when you look at the list of countries in terms of atheism or percentage of people not believing in a god...Vietnam comes up top with 81% of population. Though, I assume their religion is non-theistic.
Feb 24th 2009, 2:40 am
#130
Banned
Joined: May 2008
Location: Abu Dhabi
Posts: 1,936
Re: Islam's war on freedom....
Bismillah !
Salaam & Hi to all you lovely people out here ... I have been visting this site to gain information & advice on various other topics and on different regions etc... well, this particular title '' Islam's war on freedom'' caught my attention and i did go thru all the previous posts out here...
My purpose of posting on this particular thread is just to provide some pointers to anyone who:
1. Has a clear and an open mind to listen and hear others viewpoints rather than having preconceived notions and a mental block...against anyone whoz from a different religion / social background / ethnicity etc.
2. Who has the decency of respecting others irrespective of the difference in beliefs.
I know that there are many querries & misconceptions etc. against Islam / muslims in particular worldwide and unfortunately Islam & muslims are tarnished by actions of those few people who know too little about Islam or dont know anything and are just used by people to satisfy their own personal agendas for the all the wrong reasons.
I invite people who really seek answers to their querries @ Islam and also those who have formed their opinions based upon the constant bombardment by the media world over against Islam & muslims. If you ask anyone on the street ...what does Islam & muslims mean? I am sure most of them will relate only terrorrism & fundamentalism etc. and if you ask them who are muslims ? they might only say ... Al Qaida & Taliban etc... whereas Islam only teaches love, respect and peace. It is for entire humanity.
You may find a lot of information at www.irf.net
Also, you can visit www.quranonline.net to learn and to gather factual information from the quran. (I say factual bcoz Allah has promised that he will guard the quran against being manipulated till doomsday ... unlike all the other previous holy books which were tempered & manipulated to suit individual likings & dislikings ... to name a few ... the old testament, the new testament & the bible) I mean no offence against jews, christains & others who have different beliefs & faith. I am no authority nor a very learned person about Quran (shamefully its a fact) and I am just sharing a few things which I am aware of.
I wud like to state a few things:
1. As per the Quran: Islam has been on this planet since Adam & Eve, since they were the first human beings created by God. There has been a conspiracy to spread false information intentionally that Islam came only after prophet Muhammed (pbuh). I did study science till my +2 & Darwin's Evolution Theory ... Crap! How many of you out here actually agree with the evolution theory ? Monkeys to human beings ...
2. The Meaning of muslim: Obidient (submission to the will of Allah), a muslim doesnt have his / her own free will they must live their lives according to the teachings of the Quran & Hadis. (Hadis - reference to the life of prophet Muhammed ... pbuh)
3. As a muslim, I MUST have faith in all the prophets who were sent on earth at different times and different regions and also believe that God had sent the above stated holy books. I will not remain a muslim if i do not believe in Adam & Eve or Noah or Moses or David or Jesus to name a few or if i dont believe what is stated in the Quran. Quran is the last holy book from Allah and prophet Muhammed (pbuh) was his last messanger.
4. According to the Quran: The world will end one day and EVERYONE will be held accountable on judgement day for all their doings on planet earth ...
5. We muslims firmly believe that Issa (Jesus) will be coming back and will lead life as a normal human being and than die as a human. Allah has kept him in Heaven and his return is one of the seven signs of the approaching doomsday.
The difference in belief between christains & muslims is that Jesus was not crucified rather he was taken away even before he could be caught ... the traitor who leaked his whereabouts was given the face & features of Jesus and he was the one who was crucified and hence we do not believe that Jesus died in the first place forget that he died & all our sins are forgiven, we have to answer for all our sins ourselves.
The difference in belief between jews & muslims is that jews could never accept the fact that God's messanger could be from any other tribe rather than their own, hence they still believe that a last messanger will be coming to earth and he will be from their own. Ohh by the way Jews (Bani Isreal as mentioned in the Quran) were the most loved by Allah.
Quran teaches us to respect others, immaterial of the fact that others can be non-believers of Allah (As a matter of fact we cannot call anybody a non-believer in Allah coz only Allah knows when and who will turn into a believer), secondly we will be held accountable for ourselves, our actions & deeds against our families & our society in general. For e.g we will be questioned on judegment day even if a neighbour goes to sleep empty stomach ... doesnt matter whether he/she is a muslim or a non-believer.
Islam teaches us tolerance, mutual love, patience, kindness & peaceful coexistence. I really hope & pray that people should atleast know what Islam is and then form their own opinions.
How many of you think that the thread '' Islam's war on freedom ... '' is properly termed? or should a new thread be started wherein people can actually share their view points & clarify things related to different religions ... wudnt it b gr8 to actually learn the facts rather than pass comments without any proper knowledge?
God has created the universe & every single thing in it for us humans and he has created us to worship him alone and lead our lives according to his will.
May God bless us all with wisdom, good health, peace of mind and happiness always... and most importantly lead us on the correct path to jannah ... Aameen. (Amen as sum might say)
warmest regards & love to all,
Sam
PS:
1. I apologise if I have hurt anybody, if I did than I am really sorry, it was un-intentional.
2. I wud request fellow muslims to correct me if I have quoted anything wrong.
Salaam & Hi to all you lovely people out here ... I have been visting this site to gain information & advice on various other topics and on different regions etc... well, this particular title '' Islam's war on freedom'' caught my attention and i did go thru all the previous posts out here...
My purpose of posting on this particular thread is just to provide some pointers to anyone who:
1. Has a clear and an open mind to listen and hear others viewpoints rather than having preconceived notions and a mental block...against anyone whoz from a different religion / social background / ethnicity etc.
2. Who has the decency of respecting others irrespective of the difference in beliefs.
I know that there are many querries & misconceptions etc. against Islam / muslims in particular worldwide and unfortunately Islam & muslims are tarnished by actions of those few people who know too little about Islam or dont know anything and are just used by people to satisfy their own personal agendas for the all the wrong reasons.
I invite people who really seek answers to their querries @ Islam and also those who have formed their opinions based upon the constant bombardment by the media world over against Islam & muslims. If you ask anyone on the street ...what does Islam & muslims mean? I am sure most of them will relate only terrorrism & fundamentalism etc. and if you ask them who are muslims ? they might only say ... Al Qaida & Taliban etc... whereas Islam only teaches love, respect and peace. It is for entire humanity.
You may find a lot of information at www.irf.net
Also, you can visit www.quranonline.net to learn and to gather factual information from the quran. (I say factual bcoz Allah has promised that he will guard the quran against being manipulated till doomsday ... unlike all the other previous holy books which were tempered & manipulated to suit individual likings & dislikings ... to name a few ... the old testament, the new testament & the bible) I mean no offence against jews, christains & others who have different beliefs & faith. I am no authority nor a very learned person about Quran (shamefully its a fact) and I am just sharing a few things which I am aware of.
I wud like to state a few things:
1. As per the Quran: Islam has been on this planet since Adam & Eve, since they were the first human beings created by God. There has been a conspiracy to spread false information intentionally that Islam came only after prophet Muhammed (pbuh). I did study science till my +2 & Darwin's Evolution Theory ... Crap! How many of you out here actually agree with the evolution theory ? Monkeys to human beings ...
2. The Meaning of muslim: Obidient (submission to the will of Allah), a muslim doesnt have his / her own free will they must live their lives according to the teachings of the Quran & Hadis. (Hadis - reference to the life of prophet Muhammed ... pbuh)
3. As a muslim, I MUST have faith in all the prophets who were sent on earth at different times and different regions and also believe that God had sent the above stated holy books. I will not remain a muslim if i do not believe in Adam & Eve or Noah or Moses or David or Jesus to name a few or if i dont believe what is stated in the Quran. Quran is the last holy book from Allah and prophet Muhammed (pbuh) was his last messanger.
4. According to the Quran: The world will end one day and EVERYONE will be held accountable on judgement day for all their doings on planet earth ...
5. We muslims firmly believe that Issa (Jesus) will be coming back and will lead life as a normal human being and than die as a human. Allah has kept him in Heaven and his return is one of the seven signs of the approaching doomsday.
The difference in belief between christains & muslims is that Jesus was not crucified rather he was taken away even before he could be caught ... the traitor who leaked his whereabouts was given the face & features of Jesus and he was the one who was crucified and hence we do not believe that Jesus died in the first place forget that he died & all our sins are forgiven, we have to answer for all our sins ourselves.
The difference in belief between jews & muslims is that jews could never accept the fact that God's messanger could be from any other tribe rather than their own, hence they still believe that a last messanger will be coming to earth and he will be from their own. Ohh by the way Jews (Bani Isreal as mentioned in the Quran) were the most loved by Allah.
Quran teaches us to respect others, immaterial of the fact that others can be non-believers of Allah (As a matter of fact we cannot call anybody a non-believer in Allah coz only Allah knows when and who will turn into a believer), secondly we will be held accountable for ourselves, our actions & deeds against our families & our society in general. For e.g we will be questioned on judegment day even if a neighbour goes to sleep empty stomach ... doesnt matter whether he/she is a muslim or a non-believer.
Islam teaches us tolerance, mutual love, patience, kindness & peaceful coexistence. I really hope & pray that people should atleast know what Islam is and then form their own opinions.
How many of you think that the thread '' Islam's war on freedom ... '' is properly termed? or should a new thread be started wherein people can actually share their view points & clarify things related to different religions ... wudnt it b gr8 to actually learn the facts rather than pass comments without any proper knowledge?
God has created the universe & every single thing in it for us humans and he has created us to worship him alone and lead our lives according to his will.
May God bless us all with wisdom, good health, peace of mind and happiness always... and most importantly lead us on the correct path to jannah ... Aameen. (Amen as sum might say)
warmest regards & love to all,
Sam
PS:
1. I apologise if I have hurt anybody, if I did than I am really sorry, it was un-intentional.
2. I wud request fellow muslims to correct me if I have quoted anything wrong.
wonderfull post,
but i am worried about two things only.
how did you know that there are 7 signs of the approaching doomsday? i know that there are signs (small ones and big ones and that small ones are almost finished) ... but the number 7 needs an evidence from hadith and i am not really sure if it is there (maybe there is but again i am not sure about it)
the second thing is when you said (jews were the most loved by Allah) as mentioned in quraan.
i found in quraan the following
[47] O Children of Israel! Remember My Favor which I bestowed upon you and that I preferred you to the 'Alamîn (mankind and jinn (of your time period, in the past))
and it was mentioned twice with the same words just to emphasis on this and when i went to the explanation of it, it meant that at their time in the past God sent them many prophets and made many of them as kings. so they were favored a mong people at that time.
but where do you find in Quraan that they were most loved by allah?
but in general i would love to thank you for your wonderfull post once again..
