Sandboy

you've used the UK's entire EU quota of the word literally in that post

Meow

Amazing how someone with such blinkers can see to type.

Not agreeing with some Tory policy does not make someone an automatic "leftie". A sensible person considers policies and action not just party politics. You need to put down that Daily Mail and take a real look around and at UK political history.

During the last Labour government the UK got the minimum wage, increased maternity pay, peace in NI, civil partnerships (and I give kudos for Cameron's government in taking the next step of introducing equal marriage), shorter NHS waiting lists (according to the Patients Association) and more. Blair took the UK into a ridiculous and illegal war but there is no such thing a a political party that is all good.. Never has been, never will be. Labour also hugely complicated the UK tax and pension system although the Tories are ****ing around with the latter again.

Those 18 years of Tory government from 1979 to 1997 left the UK in such a good state. Oh!

scrubbedexpat141

So what we're saying is, to a certain extent;

Same shit, different toilet AND same flowers, different bouquet?

Millhouse

What I like most is in the 1975 EU referendum the torys backed the yes vote and the lefties backed the no vote.

Meow

Of course!

That is politics.




Although many Tories are actually evil lizards disguised as human beings, some such as Gove very badly disguised indeed.

Standanista

David Icke has been saying that for years.

Millhouse

Slugs you mean.

scrubbedexpat141

Eeyore

Well, it's always good to read a thoughtful, insightful response rather than a vaguely ad hominem knee-jerk.

Presumably you've never actually read much Tory election material, then. They reliably and consistently use fearmongering tactics. But of course, so do all the parties. None of them can claim any kind of moral high ground on that score.

There's a perfect example of the lies the Tories told in the 2010 election. And fair play, the lie served its purpose, and people like you still believe it.

Of course, the reality is that you're believing a myth. It was thoroughly debunked years ago in the cold light of day. The last Labour government did not borrow excessively and then recklessly spend it all. Just before the credit crunch, the government deficit was very small. You probably don't want to accept that, so here's a good place to start that explains it in simple terms: The Myth - Excessive government spending got us into this mess

If that's all "too long, didn't read" for you, the summary is -

"The overall picture is of a pre-recession Labour government whose borrowing and spending were sustainable and a post-recession Labour government that made more or less the right moves to stave off an even more calamitous downturn.This is not to say that Gordon Brown et al got everything right. The Labour government presided over an era of irresponsibility in UK banking. However, the numbers show that their approach to spending and borrowing was actually sound. The irony is that Labour gets a lot of criticism for a crime of which they are innocent (spending too much) and hardly any at all for one of which they are guilty (not regulating the banks)."

Half the reserve was sold off. The sale earned $3.5bn - so clearly it wasn't sold for "literally nothing", despite your assertion.

Brown did it to diversify the country's assets. As even the FT, that famously leftie paper, pointed out, it's largely pointless for governments to hold on to gold. If you convert it to money, you can earn interest, and that's what happened.

The Tory line of attack was that, 12 years later, gold hit its price peak and should have been sold then. But how many people do you know who will claim to be able to predict the price of a commodity 12 years in the future? And since gold has been on a downward trajectory since its peak in 2011, surely George Osborne is a certifiable idiot for not selling more of our gold then?

Unfortunately, I don't think you're looking at history. I think you're just regurgitating what the right-wing media wants you to believe. Your response is a litany of Daily Mail myths. There's no critical thinking going on, no evidence of genuine insight or analysis. Sadly, you're not unusual.

To return to my original point... if history is actually important to you, look at the history of the Conservative Party. The clue's in the name. The record clearly shows that it has been opposed to pretty much everything socially progressive and inclusive over the last 100 years, and the grassroots are still very much cut from that cloth.

In the event of a Leave win, Cameron will obviously have to go, and it's a racing certainty that the next Conservative PM will be deeply in hock to the vested interests who are funding the Leave campaign. Their agenda will be nothing whatsoever to do with improving life for the average British citizen.

Lightandbitter

The issue is not that they sold the gold, the issue is that they announced they were going to sell it well in advance. This drove the market down as it anticipated being flooded and ended up with the UK getting a much lower price than the gold deserved.

This is such a schoolboy error that has led to many to speculate that it was actually purposeful, to what end is debatable, but the fact remains, the prior announcement that we were going to sell 400 tonnes of gold sent the spot price down to 20 year lows at which we sold

Meow

Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

Millhouse

Oh Eeyore. Can we talk about PPP/PFI?

The Tories may have invented it, but Brown went and overdosed on it when he realized it was off-balance sheet lending. Not saying the Tories would have done it differently but Labour are not white when it comes to over-borrowing.

I remember advising the DoT on HST procurement where I was told... it doesn't really matter the cost, but it has to stay off balance sheet - this is an instruction from the top.

Eeyore

PPP and PFI are a separate issue. The point I was making is that the idea, heavily promulgated by the Tories at the 2010 election and repeated frequently since in order to justify austerity, that Labour spent the UK into a colossal mess, is nothing more than a myth.

A myth that served its purpose, of course. Even today, there are intelligent people who still believe it. Just goes to show the effectiveness of the Big Lie, doesn't it?

scrubbedexpat141

You should be a politician.

iggle

Completely relevant..

But I believe that what ever the vote (in or out) the pound will drop regardless and that would be the good time to send over your AED to England. Do you agree with my logic?