64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
Jul 27th 2011, 4:56 am
#1
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Thread Starter
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64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
UP TO 64,000 Scots could be forced off benefits after more than 40 per cent of those claiming incapacity benefit were found to be fit for work.
http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/news...fit.6808226.jp
Now there is a surprise...
http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/news...fit.6808226.jp
Now there is a surprise...
Jul 27th 2011, 5:13 am
#2
Not an evil hypnotist
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,975
Re: 64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
Bigger surprise...
That's from the Guardian but the report itself is here. I'd particularly recommend paragraph 36 on.
The government accepts that its drive to retest sickness benefits claimants has been a "flawed" process, a critical report by MPs into welfare reform concludes on Tuesday.
The introduction of new medical assessments to decide whether claimants are eligible for sickness benefits has prompted "fear and anxiety among vulnerable people", the committee of MPs concludes, partly because the tests have resulted in large numbers of seriously unwell claimants being refused support.
The report states: "It is widely accepted that the Work Capability Assessment [WCA], as introduced in 2008, was flawed. This has been borne out by the high number of appeals and the high success rate of appellants. It was also reflected in the amount of evidence from individuals which expressed grievances with the way they were treated during the process and the accuracy of the outcome." The MPs estimate the cost to the taxpayer of these appeals at around £50m a year.
The employment minister, Chris Grayling, has accepted that the WCA was initially "flawed" but stressed that significant changes have been introduced. The government acknowledges that "further refinements to the test" are still needed, says the report.
Government officials have failed to highlight the positive goals of helping more people back into work, the report adds, allowing the retesting process to be cast by parts of the media as a mission to weed out the "workshy", "scroungers" and "benefit cheats".
The introduction of new medical assessments to decide whether claimants are eligible for sickness benefits has prompted "fear and anxiety among vulnerable people", the committee of MPs concludes, partly because the tests have resulted in large numbers of seriously unwell claimants being refused support.
The report states: "It is widely accepted that the Work Capability Assessment [WCA], as introduced in 2008, was flawed. This has been borne out by the high number of appeals and the high success rate of appellants. It was also reflected in the amount of evidence from individuals which expressed grievances with the way they were treated during the process and the accuracy of the outcome." The MPs estimate the cost to the taxpayer of these appeals at around £50m a year.
The employment minister, Chris Grayling, has accepted that the WCA was initially "flawed" but stressed that significant changes have been introduced. The government acknowledges that "further refinements to the test" are still needed, says the report.
Government officials have failed to highlight the positive goals of helping more people back into work, the report adds, allowing the retesting process to be cast by parts of the media as a mission to weed out the "workshy", "scroungers" and "benefit cheats".
Jul 27th 2011, 8:41 am
#3
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Joined: Jan 2009
Location: Up on the Ranches not down on the Springs
Posts: 2,109
Re: 64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
Please just keep giving them benefits (paid for from Scotlands taxes please). Otherwise there may be a migration south of the border with all the downsides that will bring such as:
1. In every pub there will be a sh*tfaced jock gobbing off causing mayhem
2. Pubs will start selling Bucky to appease 1 above
3. Scottish history will be recalled by every member of item 1 in its entirity of rewritten-nonsense so Culloden will be erased and the British empire was really the Scottish empire etc etc
4. You will have to tread over 1 above on leaving the pub after he has collapsed and pished himself in the door way still mumbling flower of Scotland etc
5. No.1 above will be fired from whatever employement he finds and will then spend all his English dole money in pub as in 2 above.
6. No1 above may find some retard trailer trash alcholic and breed with it thus perpetuating the degenerate gene pool
So please just give them their cash to buy their bucky North of the border and lets accept that they are a nation with a high concentration of lazy pish heads who deserve and are welcome to their independence and their tartan covered tins of shortbread at motorway service stations. I think they have the same gene deficiency as Abo's when it comes to handling booze but I have not finished my CSE on genetics yet so I may be wrong.
1. In every pub there will be a sh*tfaced jock gobbing off causing mayhem
2. Pubs will start selling Bucky to appease 1 above
3. Scottish history will be recalled by every member of item 1 in its entirity of rewritten-nonsense so Culloden will be erased and the British empire was really the Scottish empire etc etc
4. You will have to tread over 1 above on leaving the pub after he has collapsed and pished himself in the door way still mumbling flower of Scotland etc
5. No.1 above will be fired from whatever employement he finds and will then spend all his English dole money in pub as in 2 above.
6. No1 above may find some retard trailer trash alcholic and breed with it thus perpetuating the degenerate gene pool
So please just give them their cash to buy their bucky North of the border and lets accept that they are a nation with a high concentration of lazy pish heads who deserve and are welcome to their independence and their tartan covered tins of shortbread at motorway service stations. I think they have the same gene deficiency as Abo's when it comes to handling booze but I have not finished my CSE on genetics yet so I may be wrong.
Jul 27th 2011, 9:43 am
#4
Bored liberal
Joined: Feb 2007
Location: Over there ----->
Posts: 13,713
Re: 64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
Shall I set out the deckchairs now and get the popcorn going? I want a ringside seat for this one.
Jul 27th 2011, 9:48 am
#5
Token Scandinavian Bloke
Joined: Jun 2009
Location: Dubai
Posts: 2,820
Re: 64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
Please just keep giving them benefits (paid for from Scotlands taxes please). Otherwise there may be a migration south of the border with all the downsides that will bring such as:
1. In every pub there will be a sh*tfaced jock gobbing off causing mayhem
2. Pubs will start selling Bucky to appease 1 above
3. Scottish history will be recalled by every member of item 1 in its entirity of rewritten-nonsense so Culloden will be erased and the British empire was really the Scottish empire etc etc
4. You will have to tread over 1 above on leaving the pub after he has collapsed and pished himself in the door way still mumbling flower of Scotland etc
5. No.1 above will be fired from whatever employement he finds and will then spend all his English dole money in pub as in 2 above.
6. No1 above may find some retard trailer trash alcholic and breed with it thus perpetuating the degenerate gene pool
So please just give them their cash to buy their bucky North of the border and lets accept that they are a nation with a high concentration of lazy pish heads who deserve and are welcome to their independence and their tartan covered tins of shortbread at motorway service stations. I think they have the same gene deficiency as Abo's when it comes to handling booze but I have not finished my CSE on genetics yet so I may be wrong.
1. In every pub there will be a sh*tfaced jock gobbing off causing mayhem
2. Pubs will start selling Bucky to appease 1 above
3. Scottish history will be recalled by every member of item 1 in its entirity of rewritten-nonsense so Culloden will be erased and the British empire was really the Scottish empire etc etc
4. You will have to tread over 1 above on leaving the pub after he has collapsed and pished himself in the door way still mumbling flower of Scotland etc
5. No.1 above will be fired from whatever employement he finds and will then spend all his English dole money in pub as in 2 above.
6. No1 above may find some retard trailer trash alcholic and breed with it thus perpetuating the degenerate gene pool
So please just give them their cash to buy their bucky North of the border and lets accept that they are a nation with a high concentration of lazy pish heads who deserve and are welcome to their independence and their tartan covered tins of shortbread at motorway service stations. I think they have the same gene deficiency as Abo's when it comes to handling booze but I have not finished my CSE on genetics yet so I may be wrong.
Jul 27th 2011, 12:10 pm
#6
Excess Baggage
Joined: Jul 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 5,479
Re: 64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
No bites by our Caledonian contingent, I see...
Anyway, guess which paper ran the story about "93% of Incapacity Claimants Fit To Work" on its front page today....
Anyway, guess which paper ran the story about "93% of Incapacity Claimants Fit To Work" on its front page today....
Jul 27th 2011, 1:13 pm
#7
ex-expat
Joined: Nov 2008
Location: in front of my computer - in sunny Sussex!
Posts: 2,162
Re: 64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
well, to be honest, what with the wonder of the Intarwebz, there really is very little excuse for not being able to do some kind of work. The training schemes are out there (often for free) to get people up to speed in IT, Maths, Literacy etc and gone are the days where you have to "put your back into it".
BUT it would mean a mental gear shift, opening up to a change of career and less of the woe is me/ victim of circumstance attitude. Still, having no money coming in is a hard incentive, but incentive it is.
Plus, of course, workplaces have to take disability into account under H&S and make the environment as comfortable and accessible as possible.
BUT it would mean a mental gear shift, opening up to a change of career and less of the woe is me/ victim of circumstance attitude. Still, having no money coming in is a hard incentive, but incentive it is.
Plus, of course, workplaces have to take disability into account under H&S and make the environment as comfortable and accessible as possible.
Jul 27th 2011, 7:20 pm
#8
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Joined: Jan 2009
Location: Up on the Ranches not down on the Springs
Posts: 2,109
Re: 64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
You can't argue with the truth but I thought a Scotsman might have given it a go all the same.
Jul 27th 2011, 7:56 pm
#9
A bubbly-jock...
Joined: Mar 2005
Location: Teneriffe
Posts: 6,262
Re: 64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
Please just keep giving them benefits (paid for from Scotlands taxes please). Otherwise there may be a migration south of the border with all the downsides that will bring such as:
1. In every pub there will be a sh*tfaced jock gobbing off causing mayhem
2. Pubs will start selling Bucky to appease 1 above
3. Scottish history will be recalled by every member of item 1 in its entirity of rewritten-nonsense so Culloden will be erased and the British empire was really the Scottish empire etc etc
4. You will have to tread over 1 above on leaving the pub after he has collapsed and pished himself in the door way still mumbling flower of Scotland etc
5. No.1 above will be fired from whatever employement he finds and will then spend all his English dole money in pub as in 2 above.
6. No1 above may find some retard trailer trash alcholic and breed with it thus perpetuating the degenerate gene pool
So please just give them their cash to buy their bucky North of the border and lets accept that they are a nation with a high concentration of lazy pish heads who deserve and are welcome to their independence and their tartan covered tins of shortbread at motorway service stations. I think they have the same gene deficiency as Abo's when it comes to handling booze but I have not finished my CSE on genetics yet so I may be wrong.
1. In every pub there will be a sh*tfaced jock gobbing off causing mayhem
2. Pubs will start selling Bucky to appease 1 above
3. Scottish history will be recalled by every member of item 1 in its entirity of rewritten-nonsense so Culloden will be erased and the British empire was really the Scottish empire etc etc
4. You will have to tread over 1 above on leaving the pub after he has collapsed and pished himself in the door way still mumbling flower of Scotland etc
5. No.1 above will be fired from whatever employement he finds and will then spend all his English dole money in pub as in 2 above.
6. No1 above may find some retard trailer trash alcholic and breed with it thus perpetuating the degenerate gene pool
So please just give them their cash to buy their bucky North of the border and lets accept that they are a nation with a high concentration of lazy pish heads who deserve and are welcome to their independence and their tartan covered tins of shortbread at motorway service stations. I think they have the same gene deficiency as Abo's when it comes to handling booze but I have not finished my CSE on genetics yet so I may be wrong.
While doing your CSE in genetics, check out to see if you have an over abundance of ethnophobic genes.
Jul 28th 2011, 3:49 am
#10
You read these things?
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,261
Re: 64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
My mum is on incapacity benefits. She hates it. She'd rather be out working, but she needs them because she suffers from severe colitis, and has done for the past 11 years.
However, it wasn't until a year ago or so that she really started showing outward symptoms (aside from the colostomy bag and catheter she's had for around 5-6 years now I think). In the last 12-18 months, she's gone blind in her right eye, and is likely to go blind in her left eye in the next 3-5 years.
Until then, there was a risk she'd have been taken off the benefit. (Despite the fact that it's not really fair on her if one of the bags splits and makes a mess because it does stink and it's incredibly embarrassing for her – not to mention painful).
Had she lived in Scotland and the blindness not presented itself, it sounds like she would have been one of those who lost the benefits, so don't be too quick to assume that everyone who's lost them deserved to. I imagine a lot did, but there will have been some collateral damage here.
And just for some further clarity about where I stand over benefits, I'm all for them, but... if you take job seekers and unemployment benefit for example.
If after six months on JSA, you still haven't found a job (or have deliberatley scuppered your chances of getting one, or got yourself fired in the first 18 months), then you end up in the employ of the government doing community service.
Imagine, 'promote' the guys who are currently cleaners in local government to trainers and supervisors (on the same wages and benefits they are now), and with the JSA'rs, give them a brush, designate them a street (or streets), give them a high vis vest/jacket that has the big letters JSA on the back, and tell them to sweep for 8 hours a day.
If you refuse, you lose all benefits (including NHS etc).
I'm all for benefits, but they are a safety net, and that's all they should be. If you think you're going to live on them, you should be made to do community service as the 'job' the government is paying you to do.
You'll soon see people scupper for those top jobs cleaning toilets in the nice indoors without those chaingain-style jackets on.
However, it wasn't until a year ago or so that she really started showing outward symptoms (aside from the colostomy bag and catheter she's had for around 5-6 years now I think). In the last 12-18 months, she's gone blind in her right eye, and is likely to go blind in her left eye in the next 3-5 years.
Until then, there was a risk she'd have been taken off the benefit. (Despite the fact that it's not really fair on her if one of the bags splits and makes a mess because it does stink and it's incredibly embarrassing for her – not to mention painful).
Had she lived in Scotland and the blindness not presented itself, it sounds like she would have been one of those who lost the benefits, so don't be too quick to assume that everyone who's lost them deserved to. I imagine a lot did, but there will have been some collateral damage here.
And just for some further clarity about where I stand over benefits, I'm all for them, but... if you take job seekers and unemployment benefit for example.
If after six months on JSA, you still haven't found a job (or have deliberatley scuppered your chances of getting one, or got yourself fired in the first 18 months), then you end up in the employ of the government doing community service.
Imagine, 'promote' the guys who are currently cleaners in local government to trainers and supervisors (on the same wages and benefits they are now), and with the JSA'rs, give them a brush, designate them a street (or streets), give them a high vis vest/jacket that has the big letters JSA on the back, and tell them to sweep for 8 hours a day.
If you refuse, you lose all benefits (including NHS etc).
I'm all for benefits, but they are a safety net, and that's all they should be. If you think you're going to live on them, you should be made to do community service as the 'job' the government is paying you to do.
You'll soon see people scupper for those top jobs cleaning toilets in the nice indoors without those chaingain-style jackets on.
Jul 28th 2011, 5:43 am
#11
MODERATOR
Joined: Dec 2004
Location: Dubai
Posts: 6,373
Re: 64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
UP TO 64,000 Scots could be forced off benefits after more than 40 per cent of those claiming incapacity benefit were found to be fit for work.
http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/news...fit.6808226.jp
Now there is a surprise...
http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/news...fit.6808226.jp
Now there is a surprise...
N.
Jul 28th 2011, 5:47 am
#12
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Thread Starter
Joined: Aug 2009
Location: Disneyland, Dubai
Posts: 15,887
Re: 64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
The road you are proposing is the one to unions and the death of industry - a far worse situation.
Jul 28th 2011, 6:04 am
#13
Account Closed
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 0
Re: 64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
Oh, Norm - I found myself agreeing you for a minute... then, I got to the second bit. No government should subsidize jobs - this creates inefficient organisations - it is better to have people out of the system than in it causing damage.
The road you are proposing is the one to unions and the death of industry - a far worse situation.
The road you are proposing is the one to unions and the death of industry - a far worse situation.
I think Job Seekers past x weeks should be made to fill in as Auzdafluff said. Get them cleaning streets / emptying bins / doing shit jobs and only give them their job seekers.
They'll either;
A - Find an actualy job and stop costing money
B - Be hung, drawn and quartered by order of Prime Minister Scamp.
Jul 28th 2011, 7:41 am
#14
Excess Baggage
Joined: Jul 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 5,479
Re: 64,000 on sickness benefit 'fit to work'
Oh, Norm - I found myself agreeing you for a minute... then, I got to the second bit. No government should subsidize jobs - this creates inefficient organisations - it is better to have people out of the system than in it causing damage.
The road you are proposing is the one to unions and the death of industry - a far worse situation.
The road you are proposing is the one to unions and the death of industry - a far worse situation.
The reason the government keep so many people unemployed ("a price worth paying", as a previous Tory PM once said), is to keep wage inflation down.
Jul 28th 2011, 8:25 am
#15
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Thread Starter
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