OVER 50's+ MOVING BACK TO THE UK - Part II
Feb 14th 2011, 3:53 pm
#3136
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Re: OVER 50's & 60's MOVING BACK TO THE UK - Part II
Mallory, I'm not counting on state pension no matter where I live. I don't think at my age I can assume it will still be there.
I can't really answer for the whole of the US because costs vary wildly across this country. I'm in New York, which is nuts cost-wise. The major savings for us would be:
- Property taxes versus council tax (roughly 2/3 lower in the UK),
- Health insurance would go from $14,000 per year to nothing (sorry can't ignore this. It's major)
- Utilities - Half the amount we currently pay and that's being conservative (partly NY prices and partly the house we live in).
- Non-covered medial expenses (prescription co-pays, doctors visits, deductible etc) cost another $1,000 per year.
Some things are a wash. House prices here just outside Manhattan are a little lower than house prices in the north of England but we plan to downsize. The price variances in clothes and food seem minimal. We will save on our self-employment tax, but have greater sales tax (aka VAT) there.
Appliances and computers seem more expensive there. And obviously petrol costs a lot more, but since we work from home that's luckily not too much of a worry for us.
You said to ignore health insurance because we might go private. a) we wouldn't and b) private insurance in the UK doesn't cover the same things it does here and is therefore not as expensive.
But as I said, there is no such thing as a US-wide cost of living. If we moved to the middle of rural Alabama, our property taxes would be more in line with the UK, our healthcare costs would probably be halved and our utilities bills would be much lower too. Of course, we'd also save on everything else because I'd have hung myself
- Property taxes versus council tax (roughly 2/3 lower in the UK),
- Health insurance would go from $14,000 per year to nothing (sorry can't ignore this. It's major)
- Utilities - Half the amount we currently pay and that's being conservative (partly NY prices and partly the house we live in).
- Non-covered medial expenses (prescription co-pays, doctors visits, deductible etc) cost another $1,000 per year.
Some things are a wash. House prices here just outside Manhattan are a little lower than house prices in the north of England but we plan to downsize. The price variances in clothes and food seem minimal. We will save on our self-employment tax, but have greater sales tax (aka VAT) there.
Appliances and computers seem more expensive there. And obviously petrol costs a lot more, but since we work from home that's luckily not too much of a worry for us.
You said to ignore health insurance because we might go private. a) we wouldn't and b) private insurance in the UK doesn't cover the same things it does here and is therefore not as expensive.
But as I said, there is no such thing as a US-wide cost of living. If we moved to the middle of rural Alabama, our property taxes would be more in line with the UK, our healthcare costs would probably be halved and our utilities bills would be much lower too. Of course, we'd also save on everything else because I'd have hung myself
Feb 14th 2011, 4:54 pm
#3137
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Re: OVER 50's & 60's MOVING BACK TO THE UK - Part II
I just had a bit of an epiphany. I've been thinking that before we could move, we would need to sell our house. But actually we pay so damn much for health benefits that we could simply take that money and use it to afford a rental in the UK. Because we'll just keep running our business from the UK, our income shouldn't change, so we wouldn't actually be any worse off. (If you need any bigger indication of how ludicrous our health system is for small business owners, I could actually afford to rent a house with the money I'll save!)
Then we could empty the house here, have it all redecorated and cleaned, and put it on the market when we're gone. That leaves the cats as the only complicating factor. If I can get over the idea that moving them is cruel (and get my husband over the same thing) we might be able to go sooner than I thought.
Fish n' Chips, have you thought of doing this? I know you don't have to pay as much as me for health care, but I think I remember that you pay quite a lot.
Then we could empty the house here, have it all redecorated and cleaned, and put it on the market when we're gone. That leaves the cats as the only complicating factor. If I can get over the idea that moving them is cruel (and get my husband over the same thing) we might be able to go sooner than I thought.
Fish n' Chips, have you thought of doing this? I know you don't have to pay as much as me for health care, but I think I remember that you pay quite a lot.
Hello Sally,
I see the point, its creative and I can see it may makes sense in your financial situation, ($1400 a month) if so you should do it...
In fact I thought of something along these lines a while back, but since then my father has passed away and my circumstances have changed, Unfortunately I don't think it would work for me mentally or otherwise.
I would be over there starting my biz over from scratch, so I may not have the money to make my house payments here, it took a good year or two to get on stable ground when starting this business, I need all of my house money to move, restart my business and have some money to tie me over, plus I have two homes here to sell, Mine and my parents and I'm making payments on both homes...
I'm a bit of a worrier and I like everything to be of little risk and even more so these days, My plans to go back haven't worked out at all so far, infact are in reverse as my savings are falling thru my fingers, I expected to be gone last year and still nothing good has happened, I'm danglin on a string and things are extremely slow with work, I'm trying to figure out what to add to my business to make more money, once my savings are gone I'm not sure what we will do... We've been living frugal since 911 and the only thing I can think to cut is my healthcare insurance, and I'm sure that will increase in price next month when my birthday comes around... Huhhhhh
Thanks for the creative suggestion, I really do appreciate it...
Some days I'd like to just get on a plane and say bye to this place forever, money or no money, but I don't give up that easy, I think everyone of us is taking a gamble, the gamble that we wont get sick and go broke before we leave.
Feb 14th 2011, 4:56 pm
#3138
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Re: OVER 50's & 60's MOVING BACK TO THE UK - Part II
I can see there are pluses and minuses. What is important to me though is that the US social security pension is much greater than the British pension. The British pension is the lowest in Europe, which makes a big difference at the end of the day. If you can afford a good private pension, then you should come out okay.
The US State pension is all based on how much or how little you have earned in your lifetime, and also if you decide to take S/S early at 62 or wait till 65 and get no reduction,
I know people in the States that are getting over $1700 per month as a single 65 year old, and I also know others who get less then half of that at the same age and also single,
Feb 14th 2011, 5:06 pm
#3139
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Re: OVER 50's & 60's MOVING BACK TO THE UK - Part II
Well Sally yes that is a great Idea of yours and could well be the solution to a lot of expats problems,
When I was still working in the US at my last Job, I remember a few months ago talking to one of my colleges who I remember was a married man in his 50,s and we were talking about Obamas health care reform, and he the guy at work being a big lifetime republican was dead against it, so I asked him do you have health insurance? he said yes I have it with my wifes company where she works and we have a great deal too, we can see any Doctor we like and the prescription plan covers most drugs but not all, and everytime we go to the Docs office we only pay $30 co-pay and just $50 for a specialist and guess what he said I have to go and have a MRI shortly and my co-pay is only $400, and my eye glasses only cost me $189 with my insurance,
This man was so pleased that he and wife had such a remarkable deal on there employers health care plan
So of course I knew whatever I said at this point would do nothing to bursting his bubble, so I just asked him how much he pays for his and wifes health care? and he said thats the best part, $750 per month thats all that is deducted from her pay check, 
--- can you imagine? his entire wages for the month were about that much take home, but the insurance was on his wifes company and she made a lot more then him at her Job,
All I could think of was OMG $750 per month was what I was paying for my one bedroom apartment in Vegas,
When I was still working in the US at my last Job, I remember a few months ago talking to one of my colleges who I remember was a married man in his 50,s and we were talking about Obamas health care reform, and he the guy at work being a big lifetime republican was dead against it, so I asked him do you have health insurance? he said yes I have it with my wifes company where she works and we have a great deal too, we can see any Doctor we like and the prescription plan covers most drugs but not all, and everytime we go to the Docs office we only pay $30 co-pay and just $50 for a specialist and guess what he said I have to go and have a MRI shortly and my co-pay is only $400, and my eye glasses only cost me $189 with my insurance,
This man was so pleased that he and wife had such a remarkable deal on there employers health care plan
So of course I knew whatever I said at this point would do nothing to bursting his bubble, so I just asked him how much he pays for his and wifes health care? and he said thats the best part, $750 per month thats all that is deducted from her pay check, --- can you imagine? his entire wages for the month were about that much take home, but the insurance was on his wifes company and she made a lot more then him at her Job,All I could think of was OMG $750 per month was what I was paying for my one bedroom apartment in Vegas,
I'm paying $750 a month right now for crappy 70% coverage... Last year I spent 25-30% of my income on healthcare, with meds, tests, and co pays...
Feb 14th 2011, 6:23 pm
#3140
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Feb 14th 2011, 6:32 pm
#3142
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Re: OVER 50's & 60's MOVING BACK TO THE UK - Part II
Hi Mallory,
The US State pension is all based on how much or how little you have earned in your lifetime, and also if you decide to take S/S early at 62 or wait till 65 and get no reduction,
I know people in the States that are getting over $1700 per month as a single 65 year old, and I also know others who get less then half of that at the same age and also single,
The US State pension is all based on how much or how little you have earned in your lifetime, and also if you decide to take S/S early at 62 or wait till 65 and get no reduction,
I know people in the States that are getting over $1700 per month as a single 65 year old, and I also know others who get less then half of that at the same age and also single,
Feb 14th 2011, 6:48 pm
#3143
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 6,848
Re: OVER 50's & 60's MOVING BACK TO THE UK - Part II
Mallory,-
If we moved to the middle of rural Alabama, our property taxes would be more in line with the UK, our healthcare costs would probably be halved and our utilities bills would be much lower too. Of course, we'd also save on everything else because I'd have hung myself
If we moved to the middle of rural Alabama, our property taxes would be more in line with the UK, our healthcare costs would probably be halved and our utilities bills would be much lower too. Of course, we'd also save on everything else because I'd have hung myself
OMG you're so funny! I've just thought of something else: car insurance will be much cheaper for you in the UK too! And decent bread....
Feb 14th 2011, 6:58 pm
#3144
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Re: OVER 50's & 60's MOVING BACK TO THE UK - Part II
Someone on £20k a year who paid in for 30 years
Someone on £80k a year who paid in for 30 years
Someone on £20k a year who paid in for 40 years
Someone on £80k a year who paid in for 40 years
... anyone who paid in for fewer than 30 years would get a lower UK pension.
In the US, the previously described people would get a different amount for their pension, affected by number of years and how much was paid in yearly... I think.
Last edited by dunroving; Feb 14th 2011 at 7:01 pm.
Feb 14th 2011, 7:02 pm
#3145
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Re: OVER 50's & 60's MOVING BACK TO THE UK - Part II
I think that the difference is that UK NI is primarily affected by how many years you paid in - the following people would get the same UK pension:
Someone on £20k a year who paid in for 30 years
Someone on £80k a year who paid in for 30 years
Someone on £20k a year who paid in for 40 years
Someone on £80k a year who paid in for 40 years
... anyone who paid in for fewer than 30 years would get a lower UK pension.
In the US, the previously described people would get a different amount for their pension, affected by number of years and how much was paid in yearly... I think.
Someone on £20k a year who paid in for 30 years
Someone on £80k a year who paid in for 30 years
Someone on £20k a year who paid in for 40 years
Someone on £80k a year who paid in for 40 years
... anyone who paid in for fewer than 30 years would get a lower UK pension.
In the US, the previously described people would get a different amount for their pension, affected by number of years and how much was paid in yearly... I think.
Feb 14th 2011, 7:07 pm
#3147
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Re: OVER 50's & 60's MOVING BACK TO THE UK - Part II
With the US system as you know one man can be working for 50 years and get $800 per month from S/S and another man can work the same 50 years and he is getting $1800 month from S/S cause he made larger salaries for the majority of his life.
Feb 14th 2011, 7:11 pm
#3148
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Re: OVER 50's & 60's MOVING BACK TO THE UK - Part II
Well yes in a way both are simular, but with the British state pension its a base scale for everyone if they have there 30 years in they get the full pension but me well I only got 10 years in so I only get a small amount, roughly a third of the full British pension,
With the US system as you know one man can be working for 50 years and get $800 per month from S/S and another man can work the same 50 years and he is getting $1800 month from S/S cause he made larger salaries for the majority of his life.
With the US system as you know one man can be working for 50 years and get $800 per month from S/S and another man can work the same 50 years and he is getting $1800 month from S/S cause he made larger salaries for the majority of his life.
Feb 14th 2011, 7:18 pm
#3149
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Re: OVER 50's & 60's MOVING BACK TO THE UK - Part II
I think that the difference is that UK NI is primarily affected by how many years you paid in, with an upper limit of 30 years, beyond which payments have no effect on pension - the following people would therefore get the same UK pension:
Someone on £20k a year who paid in for 30 years
Someone on £80k a year who paid in for 30 years
Someone on £20k a year who paid in for 40 years
Someone on £80k a year who paid in for 40 years
... anyone who paid in for fewer than 30 years would get a lower UK pension.
In the US, the previously described people would get a different amount for their pension, affected by number of years and how much was paid in yearly... I think.
Someone on £20k a year who paid in for 30 years
Someone on £80k a year who paid in for 30 years
Someone on £20k a year who paid in for 40 years
Someone on £80k a year who paid in for 40 years
... anyone who paid in for fewer than 30 years would get a lower UK pension.
In the US, the previously described people would get a different amount for their pension, affected by number of years and how much was paid in yearly... I think.
Last edited by jasper123; Feb 14th 2011 at 7:25 pm.
Feb 14th 2011, 7:41 pm
#3150
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Re: OVER 50's & 60's MOVING BACK TO THE UK - Part II
today was a nice sunny day --- well until noon
and me and mum were out front of house trimming/cutting the bushes and a lady passed by walking her dog and said hello and what a lovely day it is, My mum knew her from up the street about 20 houses up the street,