Downsizing and Up-pricing.
 

I know it has to be done, and I'm sure I'll adapt in time, but it certainly is frustrating looking at property where you get half the house at twice the price than the one you currently reside in.

Just wondering how others have coped with the transition, if they have been in a similar situation.

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Absolutely, especially if you want to live in SE England in the stockbroker belt like us. We luckily kept our house when we moved to Canada and the value now for an end terrace is £430 000. We sold for the equivalent of £250 000 in Canada, Vancouver Island. As we are retired we could live anywhere and I have often looked at houses near coast or in a small village for £250 000 and bigger! OH refuses to move again!

We had our house painted out before we moved in and on first day we were back popped in to see it. I got such a shock at size of it I burst into tears. We kept our queen beds and they just about fit in the rooms. Our study is so full of furniture that not a bit of space is left. Initially I was unhappy with just one bathroom and the tiny rooms compared to Canada but six months later I have got used to it. I now like the smaller space because even though it is small, the house is well built and extremely cosy. I cannot hear tv in lounge dowstairs if my door is closed. In Canada you could hear every noise because of walls being of drywall. Also electricity is expensive here so heating costs are lower.

My husband does not really want anyone from Canada to visit us because he says they will look down their noses at the size of house!!! I also understand now why people do not entertain as much at home or have so many people stay overnight. Space is at a premium.

We should have got rid of lots more furniture!

You do adapt though. Good luck.

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Forgot to add, the loft is full of stuff stored and the garage is so small it can only just fit our little hyundaii10 in it when we go away long term but hubby hasto remove some stuff and store in shed for duration. He uses the garage as a workshop and stores all his tools in there high up on walls. Coming from a double garage with room for a large suv it is a shock.

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Hi Bud!

Think of it this way. What with the excessive pumping up of assets due to ultra-low interest rates, particularly here in the UK where real estate has been pretty much the 'only game in town' and therefore a one-way bet that is going to go up, NOW is not the time to even consider buying IMHO.

Particularly when CRASH is a word being put about in more serious circles than previous because wages simply don't support the price levels in spite of banks doing everything they can to ease affordability.

The Bank of England is making things harder for BTL landlords in particular in terms of lending parameters. The Treasury is taxing BTL purchasers more in stamp duty. Tax deductibility is tougher for BTL landlords, so many are looking to get out.

I'm not saying that it will become a one-way bet the other way any time soon, particularly when inwards migration is still in the 300,000s per annum but something has to give.

If interest rates have to rise and they indeed could if we exit the EU, to help finance UK debt and the deficit and trade deficit and capital outflows then we will indeed see 'something else'. Actually the UK economy is in poor enough shape* that if we vote to stay in the EU we could first see a cut in interest rates and easing before future tightening.

IF there were a crash it would ripple out from London to areas where there is still some semblance of value to be had in terms of market value to incomes.

It is indeed strange that the US is a far healthier all-round economy and US incomes are higher than here in the UK but it isn't reflected in real estate values nor could it be at any reasonable exchange rate adjustment from here, with the possible exception of parity but then incomes would be even more skewed.

I'm glad that I don't need to buy right now and I'm happy to rent at a time when we are only giving a 3.5% gross return to our landlord. Comparable rent return percentages should be available throughout much of the West Country. Maybe UK asset prices will become more sensible or realistic in a decade from now, particularly if we go into Japanese mode.

There is a side to this discussion where Londoners in particular are now downshifting TO the West Country as they see fresh highs and retirement and are supporting real estate prices in this overall area but on the whole I don't perceive that prices have done much in the region outside of the big centres such as Bristol and Exeter.

In fact 'investors' are looking at holiday lets as the way to make money as other properties are now very much stuck still or even declining, as residential rents are low as there is no real prosperity in the mainly seasonal tourism and agricultural region outside of the big centres.

*Running a huge budget deficit it is hard to get down without major cuts in services that are often ring-fenced. Running a huge trade deficit. Too reliant on debt-fueled spending. Poor productivity and not enough investment, innovation, training and quality management. Too reliant on real estate prices. Education is often not meeting the needs of employers who then import the labour. Whole economy is too London-centric when London property prices make working there almost unsustainable. Percentage of net-contributors to the 'economy' is becoming smaller and smaller.

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Our house in Canada was the biggest I'd ever lived in, but only in terms of square footage. Upstairs it was a two bedroom bungalow with an open plan living room/den/study/kitchen/dining room area. Downstairs there was an enormous basement with two further bedrooms and a second bathroom.

I do miss the storage space, but not the open plan, which made the house feel much smaller than it really was, or the basement which was creepy and tended to flood. We also have a larger garden than we had in Canada.

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We will downsize to a flat from a 4 bedroom house with a large yard and pool, but to be honest, I am looking forward to it. The two of us certainly don't need all this space, we never use the pool, and the lawn is a pain to mow. Like Pete, we will rent and forgo a car. We have had enough of owning things that require maintenance, and like the idea of not being tied down. We plan on being footloose and fancy free in our old age :lol:

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feelbritish. From what I've seen on estate agents websites, I doubt if it would be worthwhile bringing back any furniture. I'm glad you are adapting, I'm sure we will in time ............ hopefully.

Pistolpete: I was really looking for peoples views on the how they coped with living in smaller accommodation and paying a premium for it. I respect your views on house prices though. We will rent for six months and decide what to do thereafter.

Editha: Re: gardens. We have a 3 acre plot with a two acre private lake. Thoughts of the good life are wearing thin, the only thing I would miss is the privacy.

Perth: Know what you mean about the pool, it's just there, and needs a lot of looking after.

Thanks for the replies.

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The price isn't just for square footage though. It's about where you want to be. Our current house in Birmingham is about half the square footage of the one we had in suburban Los Angeles but I like it much better due to construction, layout and proximity to amenities. The price differential probably isn't as noticeable as yours at around 3/4 of the selling price of the US one.

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Hi Sally :wave:

Ours is extreme.

Our English flat is 700 sq ft. and cost five times as much as our New York house (3,000 sq ft., four bedrooms, five acres of land.)

Wildlife-wise, all we have in our English flat is those giant bathroom spiders that are ubiquitous in the UK. In America we have chipmunks, mice and red squirrels in the house. We had rats for a while, but I was quite strict with them and they're gone.

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Hi Robin!

You extremist lol.

We have two friendly robins in the garden :p

How are your plans working out?

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Hi Sally! Hope all is well for you these days.

On topic: our Richmond Hill house sold last spring for a healthy 4 x what we paid for it in 1993 and we were renting in Newcastle since Sept. We've now moved into a very pleasant 1000 sq ft apartment overlooking the River Tyne (spectacular view over a marina and downriver). Cost only 28% of the proceeds from Canada. :thumb up:

We also still have our 2000 sq ft house and 5000 sq ft yard and garden in Normandie from where I'm posting at the moment so all in all no complaints.

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Hi! Doing well, thanks.

Is that the Quayside area? It all sounds great, with the best of both worlds :drinkingwine:

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A bit further east than the Ouseburn and the old Spillers Wharf. The flats on the Quayside near the Millennium Bridge are very small and quite expensive for what you get.

It sounds like you know Newcastle quite well .... you'd be welcome to visit if we're around when you're there next.

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Our robins (American style) are driving us crazy this year. They are nesting all over the garden, including a couple of pairs in the barn which makes it harder to get out the riding mower etc. I was in Norfolk all winter and enjoyed seeing the robins (English style.)

As for plans - Not bad. I'm back & forth, four months in Norfolk, two months or so in New York. My wife absolutely can't leave here, what with quilt group on Saturdays and band on Fridays! I'm flying back to Heathrow in ten days time, spending the summer in England. This winter, we're hoping to visit her cousin down in Sarasota, FL. My cunning long term plan is to move our U.S. operation down to Florida, but we'll see about that...

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Aha...I do by marriage...actually we were talking about going up there for a weekend sometime soonish - so it would be canny to have a drink like :thumbup:

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Yes it's quite hard to compete with those clubs. I noticed though that crafts of various kinds seem to be really popular here - I bet she could find other quilters! Good luck anyway. Plenty of info on here about Florida :thumbup:

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2 1/2 years ago we moved from our 5,000 sq ft house with acreage into our 950 sq ft condo in Toronto. All we took with us was clothes and a few personal bits and pieces. Moving from a very small town in the US to Canada's largest city is quite a contrast. From our condo we have fabulous views across Lake Ontario, stores, mall, restaurants, bars, theatres etc are all within walking distance.

So far so good...but I do miss the space. An extra 1,000 sq ft would be nice.

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Whey, yer married to a Geordie pet? Y've gone reet t' the top of me canny list.

I think we'll be around from about the 21st of June until about the 18th of July.

Giviz a bell.

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Why aye pet, will dee that :)

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Yeah I might yank their chain on the U.S. Forum, ask them about buying a pool maintenance company or something...

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Waking up and not hearing the dock workers boots on the road cobbles so down the front stairs to get the milk off the step but rattling the letterbox to make sure there isn't a bank of snow waiting to cave in. Down the back stairs with a kettle full of hot water to melt the ice in the outside nettie and hang some more newspaper on the nail. Across the street to buy two red hot stottie cakes for breakfast stopping at downstairs corner shop for a quarter of salted Norwegian butter straight out of the cask. Two jumpers on to fight the fret off the sea because it is summer in South Shields......:(

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Wow! Are you a writer? If not you should be.

Re: Downsizing and Up-pricing.
 

You've given me the shivers mentioning the spiders. A few years ago I stayed at my brother's converted barn in Warwickshire, and one day found a spider completely covering the water in the loo. But worse, there were little spiders all over the room including in the bath, and in 2 days I killed more than 60. I had noisy possums in South Australia, and at one time had a licence to catch 12 a year and relocate them in a national park. In the end I gave up, they just kept coming.

As for downsizing, I have a 2-bedroom flat after living in a house in Oz, and after 4 years here, I still can't get used to my tiny kitchen. Walking space is only 6' 6" by 3' 3" with scant working top and 3 minuscule drawers. I had originally thought the kitchen would be adequate, but I soon found out that I was wrong.

For expats who live in bigger houses and planning to return to the UK, it is probably wise to leave furniture behind, and see what room is available when they move back. I gave all mine away in Oz, to family, new immigrants with nothing, and charity shops. It was sad to see my life disappearing like this, but once gone, very little was missed.

Nevertheless, adapting to expensive Lilliput/UK isn't easy!

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Our house in Devon has one of the smallest kitchens I've ever had. We considered building an extension, but eventually settled for moving the boiler to create more space. The new external oil-fired boiler is being installed right now. Then we are having the kitchen gutted and refitted from scratch. It is the most expensive house-renovation project I've ever paid for; just thinking about the cost brings on a mild panic attack. Yet, when the work is done I'll still have a small kitchen, only one with granite worktops and Neff appliances.

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Go north young man.

(South Shields has a brand new rather impressive library now, probably them evil bureaucrats in Brussels' doing).

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Ha ha my memories of growing up in Alice Street ;) Sneaking big North sea crabs up our jumpers to get past the pier master, shouting abuse at the fishing boats at North Shields coming back loaded with cod and collecting the herring in newspapers that the fishermen threw at us to get grandma to make roll mop. Going along to Marsden Grotto when the sea and sand were both frozen. Buying 6d of winkles in the market with pin and asking the fish and chip shop for free scraps (batter).........split pea soup in a billy can.....bag of crab claws....;)

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Hmmm. Perhaps you've been away too long. Marsden Grotto is no more. I used to pop in there now and again in my youth, but it no longer serves booze and the funicular thingy is derelict.

Oi vey.

As to the rest of your reminiscences ... get over it. Tempus fugit. Except that the North Shields fishmongers are still doing OK.

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I'm north and although we have the same number of rooms 3bed/2bath and a garage, we really miss the massive garage we had. I was an extra deep one so bigger than a normal two car garage and here we have a single, wide enough to get the car in, but not wide enough to get a car door open to get out. Dh has enough room for all his tool chests and stuff, but only has a walkway around the centre tool bench not much room to do/make anything.
We talked about downsizing, from a 2 story here to a bungalow, but they seem to build them with minuscule rooms, neither I nor my furniture has shrunk (all furniture is from UK and not oversized), why do they make them so small you can't move around, with no room for more than one slim person in the kitchen and a bathroom so small I bump bum on the wall if I bend over to pick anything up. :eek:

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Muah'Dib will know.

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Personally, I had no issue down sizing.

In Canada we lived in a 5,500 sq ft house which I loved at first, then started to resent.
We hardly used our huge rec room in the basement, along with a spare bedroom and large storage room. The kids got the most use out of the basement when they had friends over.

Our living space on the first floor was great and we had a real fire in the lounge. But our bedroom was the whole of the 2nd floor. Who needs that? :eek: we had no furniture to fill the space it was so huge!

The maintenance on the house was ongoing. We weren't financially well off in Canada (Nova Scotia) so were unable to keep up with everything and the house fell into disaray. This is why I started to resent it really. The house was wood and we had to paint the outside to keep it weather resistant. The roof tiles started coming off. Roofs had to be replaced every 20 years or so. The real wood floors in the lounge/diner were totally wrecked when we got our puppy. All the windows needed replacing. I hated the bathrooms and the bath was too short to relax in so never had one.
Just the day to day cleaning of a house that large was horrendous.

Anyway, I love my little detatched 4 bed with manageable garden now. It's cozy and I am a lot happier, even though it cost quadruple what our Canada house did! :ohmy:
We are a lot more financially well off here with hubby working IT in London. We have already done a lot more to this house than we ever did in Canada and have more free money for nights out and holidays. Very happy :)

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Yes he will:p

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Our return experience was to move back into the 3 bed house on an estate left 18 years before. It was quite distressing to have a lot of work done to get it back into shape on the heels of difficult tenants. I felt closed in by the relatively small internal spaces and by the nearness of neighbour houses. It took a long long while but 6 years later I have become used again to the house size and by strategic planting have somewhat disguised the view of adjacent properties. The small garden is nice again but the sound of adjacent hard accelerating and speeding vehicles drives me nuts. Despite that, the garden supports wild bird nests in bushes and boxes and plenty bees etc.. My wife is quite happy to be back in this smaller house for reason of less housework and being adjacent to a well served bus route.
Somehow though we not entirely happy here, can't really identify the reason, have often consider other housing options near and far. June has intent to move into a city centre flat at some distant point and I am getting used to the idea - but where? We like nearby Norwich but then again we like to spend time in countryside which we have very close to where we are now. We just had a few leisure days in Sheffield (first ever visit), enjoyed the city and people and saw some lovely, new, and reasonably priced city centre flats there, Choices eh. In US our first rental was a lovely apartment in a nice complex and later we moved into a nice big house in an spacious subdivision with trees everywhere. Move that plot to the UK, put this smaller house on it, set up a regular bus service and we would be be getting closer.
Or would we?
Or is it just the restless nature of an ex-mariner and ex-expat?
I must remember to enjoy the best, ignore the worst, of wherever we happen to be.
Best wishes to all, I don't visit here so much now. John

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I wish you would visit more often John, I've found your posts to be some of the more balanced of those who have returned.
I think I would adapt quite quickly to a smaller living space, and definitely to a smaller garden to look after. The closeness of neighbouring properties, well that's a totally different matter. :(

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Thanks Bud, that is nice of you to say. I tend not to visit here in the interests of looking forward, rather than back, in my rehab journey. The less balanced reports were something I could do without.