merlinman

Another disquieting thing is that, having legitimised the rumours to a large extent by committing them to print, a start date is not mentioned which really is just prolonging the agony. Interesting that none of the agencies, as far as I can tell, nor even the Ministry's own website, is publishing the upcoming changes. Maybe it is all a bit of a fishing exercise to gauge public reaction, or is that itself wishful thinking? No mention either of "grandfathering" provisions, apart from a half-hearted assurance by the MM2H presenter. Also (sorry, RedApe) nothing of expanding the list of permitted withdrawals from the FD to include rent (which is the preferred alternative to purchase for the majority of MM2Hers), consumer durables & other services, even if locally sourced. I think it's a forlorn hope that the BHC could be expected to make representations in this area or buy in to local policy decision-making processes.

RedApe

Odd way of doing a trial balloon. The Minister launched the trail ballon last August, in my view. This seemed more of a "heads down, incoming" sort of announcement so that the agents would not be taken too much by surprise.

And they have produced their pretty little brochure, which is probably off at the printers.

As far as trial balloons, the MM2H program and MoT were likely to only hear from folks already IN the program who were focused and privy to the reports back in August. Those people are not the ones likely to be impacted (provided they "grandfather" their original application terms into place. They wouldn't know about how the requirements would impact NEW applicants. Their numbers of applications will likely drop, or at least show descending growth. But they may go "look at the ratio of applications to successful admissions...we have a higher percentage of "quality people vs. bums". But that will simply be because they've reduced the number of applications. In fact, those most impacted those who might have applied except for the changes wouldn't know about the "tial ballon".

I myself (being on the Sarawak M2H) wouldn't bother to waste my time running my head up against the bureaucracy in Semenjantang (the Peninsula) from this side of the Straits. I might have better success with the Sarawakians, though. Only if Sarawak started "stealing" the applicants from the MM2H program (i.e. all those of "lower quality") would the Peninsular side sit up and pay attention. "Why are our numbers going precipitously downward and why are Sarawak's going upward?" Plus, by "domestic" in Sarawak I mean...Sarawak produced services or goods (Sarawak tourism, restaurants, rent, crafts, art, textiles, etc.). You are right, though, I don't thing the BHC would deal with this...

RedApe

Noticed belatedly on the MM2H Gov't website...as a pop-up announcement

"03 April 2018
Discontinuation of The Reduction Of Fixed Deposit Placement Based On Property Purchase And MM2H Approval By Government Pension

Kindly be informed that MM2H Centre has discontinued the reduction of Fixed Deposit placement based on property purchase worth RM1 million and above in Malaysia.

Also discontinued is the MM2H approval by government pension for MM2H applicants aged 50 years and above. This means all MM2H new participants must place Fixed Deposits to join this programme. This does not apply to existing MM2H participants who were approved under government pension."

Whether or not this means that more changes are pending or if they have reconsidered the increases in FD entirely is unclear. They did say back in February that they were planning on making those announcements "mid-year" so maybe more down the road yet. This does seem Part 1 of the change over (putting everyone on the FD)...plus the elimination of the RM1million property waiver. Hopefully they allow the partial FD withdrawal for property purchase benefit to continue.

stepen

Wonder what happens when applied in October and still waiting for reply...

RedApe

Do you already own a RM1 million property? Or on the issue of the pension option?

My suspicion is that people "in the queue" have applied under the terms of the old system and will be evaluated on that basis. That's sort of like the waiver given to those purchasing local cars...although they gave a time limit for that. But once they formally announce a change those submitting applications will be held to the new rule.

Fingers crossed they'll allow you in with the pension and you won't have to deal with the issues of Higher FD's. If you had an agent I'd start haranguing them, if not keep your eyes open on the website.

bakedbean

Agree with RedApe. Chase your agent.

Disappointing that they do it retrospective but not the only government to do this. Acts as a reminder that MM2Hers are just temporary visa holders.

stepen

I applied for reduction of FD based on property purchase. From the text it seems they have discontinued this already, so guess need to wait and see what will happen with my application.

RedApe

I agree that you could possibly appeal if you submitted the application prior to the announcement.

There is also unclarity as to whether this only applies to the reduction of the "base" FD for >RM1million...or if it applies to the property withdrawal element as well. It seems not so you could still perhaps benefit there. You may still benefit from having the FD reduced by RM50-150,000 (or RM250,000 if they increase the FD).

Widthdrawal Requirements - MM2H Official Portal

SushiFan

My understanding was that not all states require a minimum purchase price of 1 million RM for buying a house. Some states use a lower limit of e.g. 500 k RM. If this understanding is correct, and if I read this new text correctly, it would imply that you can still use a portion of your FD to pay for a house if the purchase price is between 500 k and 1 million RM. Only for those houses where the purchase price exceeds 1 million RM is it not allowed anymore to use a portion of the fixed deposit.

RedApe

Hi SushiFan,

I always thought that the RM1million deal was sort of a fringe benefit offered separately to those that bought property over 1 million. They'd get their FD reduced (it was never stated by how much) and ALSO be able to withdraw from it the RM150,000 for mortgage, health care, school expenses etc. Or perhaps the FD was waived entirely. In which case, the wealthy applicant ("quality not quantity") certainly got a nice perk.

I could never find anything clear about this (maybe someone can clarify who has done it).

If it was simply the reduction of the FD down to the specified level that you must keep in the FD then how was it a "special benefit". Everyone had that available regardless of whether they purchased a RM500,000 property, a RM750,000, or an over RM1 million property.

Now that it's gone (along with the locally built car incentive) their eliminating the things that a wealthy investor might view as "our perks"...in addition to raising the FD up to RM500,000. Can one find enough perks for a NEW applicant (under the proposed new rules) to actually reduce down their FD to RM250,000. Let's say the applicant prefers not to buy property and has no school-age kids...that's a heck of a lot of Medical Expenses.

There's the "stick"...where's the "carrot"?

SushiFan

RedApe,

besides the yellow pop-up window has the rest of the text at the government MM2H website not yet been modified. This is what it states about using a portion of your FD for approved expenses:
http://www.mm2h.gov.my/index.php/en/...rms-conditions (the tab "upon approval")
Thus, the maximum amount that you can withdraw from the FD has been specified. And the minimum amount which must always remain in your FD has also been specified.

IndoTom

I think that portion of the website has not been updated and does not reflect the change of the pop-up notice. Also look closely at the 50+ text. It doesn't specify the fixed deposit amount for the 50+ group. I remember it was 150,000 MYR in the past.

SushiFan

The text which I quoted is the actual situation: if you are 50+ you must place a fixed deposit of 150 k. After one year you can withdraw up to 50 k for certain approved expenses. But there must always be at least 100 k remaining in the fixed deposit.

IndoTom

I still don't see the 150,000 MYR text on the website for 50 or over. I remember it used to be there but not now.

SushiFan

It is a bit hidden, but can be found here:
Widthdrawal Requirements - MM2H Official Portal
This implies that for 50+ you must initially place a fixed deposit of 150 k RM.