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Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Old Aug 20th 2021, 2:26 pm
  #76  
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Originally Posted by StillSearching View Post
and if it crashes like it was in 2008?
The average annual yield from 1.1.2007 ~ 31.21.2020 is 8.77%. Which is very close to the mentioned 10% target. All you have to do is to put your money in SPY (an ETF with very low cost) and hold it. Nothing fancy, and no complicated options strategies involved.
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Old Aug 20th 2021, 2:53 pm
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

I hope that with new Malaysian leadership, there will be some further adjustments to MM2H. I have some Singaporean friends who became part of the program, and I suspect this might either hurt relations between the two countries or keep Singapore retirees in Singapore full time. The Singapore gov't would like that.

As Still Searching said, you reach a point in your life when you become more sedentary, and so if you liked being a "perpetual traveler" like I did, you begin to reassess that. After returning from Malaysia/Singapore in 2014, I settled in a town in Washington state where I can literally walk to Canada in about 5 minutes. I don't though, but drive instead. I can be at a restaurant, called Ipoh, in downtown Vancouver in 30 minutes. The food is great, and I sometimes forget I'm not in Singapore or Malaysia anymore. I guess this lifestyle has made me more sedentary. I do like Still Searching's idea of having two places, and have even looked into Panama, which has a pretty straightforward retirement visa and has never changed. It even allows you to be a "permanent resident" and later a citizen. However, Covid has put a damper on all that planning.

RA mentioned Medicare, and while I appreciate his criticism of US healthcare, I just don't have that feeling. I pay maybe about $300 a month to be completely covered. I can have same day doctor's visits if necessary, and after a hip replacement surgery and melanoma surgery, I can only point to positive feelings about the health care. My best friend in Vancouver pays about half of his income in taxes to fund the "free" health care. If it is elective surgery, like a hip replacement, you need to wait a number of months. There are positives and negatives in both health care schemes. I know of no one in Washington state that does not have health care. I just wish what is true in Washington state was true everywhere in the US.




Originally Posted by RedApe View Post
Regarding Medicare re. Americans. I'm admittedly in a rather odd circumstance but one which there are likely hndreds of thousands are in if they really dug deep into their insurance plans. I worked for State of California (as a university professor). They have a Blue Cross plan option, When I retired I kept that as I was "living abroad- ineligible for Medicare services" and they had a travel plan good for 3 months, but also a side benefit for those that lived abroad. It covers 90% of my Health Care services (over the deductible), from surgeries, pharma, treatments, ad even some exotic therapies (acupuncture), and about 3 months of home care (which I think can be extended further if that is halftime and below their cap). It's as good, if not better, than Medicare because there is minimal amount paid on the premium (monthly premium on Medicare is now about US$150/month) WHICH I COULD PAY TO REMAIN ENROLLED IF I EVER RETURN TO THE US. But I can't get any coverage with Medicare abroad (unless I fly to Guam). I'd be better off using that premium money getting local insurance (@ max of US$500/year) or creating a Healthcare security fund for paying over the table. So I elected to deny Medicare coverage. I will have to pay a stupid penalty each year (for lost premium payments for years that I could NOT use at all) if I return to the US. If I do go it'll only be when I'm "in extremis" and the likelihood is that I'll only pay one year of penalty for very expensive end-of-life treatment. It's all insane and only helps the Corporate Health Care system in the USA.

What's incredible is that with the cost of Medical care in the US that Medicare doesn't encourage Medical Tourism. Example Cost of Knee Replacement Surgery in US is $60K, in Thailand $6K. Medicare will cover 80% of that US Cost (you pay $12K) but only at a point when it is so excruciating that it is no longer regarded as elective surgery. You'll pay deductibles, and visitation fees at higher percentages before that point. So it's cheaper in a specialist clinic in Thailand and recuperation and post-surgery orthopedic coverage is included. As the US population ages, and as seniors are more athletically active, there's well over 2 million hip and knee replacement surgeries a year. That's $120 billion dollars a year. No wonder Medicare is going bankrupt. Throw in heart surgeries, urinary tract, GI, cancer, etc etc. But if they could get a good chunk of those people to use health tourism....subsidize them at 80% of the cost of the treatment plus free airfare and you'd still cut the cost by an order of magnitude (if everyone did it, which they won't).

Most Americans don't realize that Medicare is not free after 67 and that they will continue to pay through the nose. And they have this sense of "I already paid all my working life for this benefit- I'm not giving it up" even when it would be cheaper to pay for the treatment abroad at walk-up prices.
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Old Aug 21st 2021, 2:00 am
  #78  
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Originally Posted by SushiFan View Post
The average annual yield from 1.1.2007 ~ 31.21.2020 is 8.77%. Which is very close to the mentioned 10% target. All you have to do is to put your money in SPY (an ETF with very low cost) and hold it. Nothing fancy, and no complicated options strategies involved.
SPY had two recent crashes: Dec. 2018, March 2020.
If you are a retiree living off your savings, you don't want to gamble. At least dividends pay monthly. Just you need to pick a good dividend aristocrats. Even they may cut their dividends...
What else is left? Real gold?
Properties prices may crash too and if it is an investment property you are left with higher mortgage payments than your income from rental.
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Old Aug 21st 2021, 3:18 am
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Originally Posted by RobSg View Post
RA mentioned Medicare... I pay maybe about $300 a month to be completely covered. I can have same day doctor's visits if necessary, and after a hip replacement surgery and melanoma surgery, I can only point to positive feelings about the health care. My best friend in Vancouver pays about half of his income in taxes to fund the "free" health care. If it is elective surgery, like a hip replacement, you need to wait a number of months. There are positives and negatives in both health care schemes. I know of no one in Washington state that does not have health care. I just wish what is true in Washington state was true everywhere in the US.
By The World Health Organization's ranking of the world's health systems the US is #37 from the top:
https://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html

In order to understand why the US healthcare sucks and will be worse for patients, there is a great book written by a doctor Elisabeth Rosenthal "An American Sickness". Easy read, astonishing facts, also available in audio.

You pay $300/month for yourself and it will go up with the age. But is this all?
Here are some numbers and I can see how one can get bankrupt by Medicare:
https://www.medicare.gov/your-medica...ts-at-a-glance

Do Canadians get bankrupt by medical bills?

Also, Medicare Supplement Insurance Plan premiums in 2020 are from $185 to $300/month depending on age.
Medigap is from $143 to $235/month. Many doctors are reluctant to see a patient without a supplemental plan.

Our international insurance with AXA is only $4K/year for both and it doesn't have a limit in age after you are accepted.
A couple on medicare would pay $(150 for plan B + 185 for supplemental) x2 x12= $8,040/year at the age of 65 and $10,800/year at the age of 85.
A patient also pays 20% of a bill for a "free" plan A.
But pay big money if you are at a hospital for more than 61 days. And this is in doctors power to keep you in a hospital longer. You know, complications may happen... An American patient is a sucker of the healthcare conglomerate.
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Old Aug 21st 2021, 3:44 am
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

My impression is that the new MM2H is less interested in attracting retirees concerned with slow and steady yields but with the "slam-bam-thank-you-ma'am" Nomad Capitalists (there's a blog by this name that is praising the new program as "just what they asked for"). These sound more like the ones that would prefer a good roll of the dice in Monaco or Macao. But both retirees and these Trust Fund kids would want some liquidity. Yeah, there are ways to withdraw from the MM2H decade long Fixed Account for certain things...but some of these are unlikely to attract the type that simply wants a "bolthole" for tax (or capital flight) purposes.

True Retirees (not some guy still on the Board of Directors at age 70) are unlikely to have kids needing tuition for local schools (unless the males have married a sweet young thing). They might stay longer, though and want to buy a property or a car. But the liquid assets and amounts required are unlikely to attract many. But yes you could use the FD to buy a property. So in a sense the requirement is now an FD of 600K (400K of it can be used for property) and buying a property of > RM600K and a salary/pension of RM40K.

A short term resident is unlikely to want to buy a property or a car if they are doing a short term visit (and the provision for 3 months residence seems prohibitive for them. in any case). Rather lease an even better place or vehicle. And they are unlikely to withdraw for the medical benefits, both because of their age and the
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Old Aug 21st 2021, 4:21 am
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Originally Posted by RedApe View Post
My impression is that the new MM2H is less interested in attracting retirees concerned with slow and steady yields but with the "slam-bam-thank-you-ma'am" Nomad Capitalists (there's a blog by this name that is praising the new program as "just what they asked for"). These sound more like the ones that would prefer a good roll of the dice in Monaco or Macao.
I don't see that the new requirements can benefit anyone even Malaysia.
We'll just stay here until we can and get out...
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Old Aug 21st 2021, 9:01 pm
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Originally Posted by StillSearching View Post
Government in West Malaysia knew all of these and they pushed their new regulations anyway in order to erode trust. This is an anti-foreigners strike. Sarawak is still part of Malaysia and it is a risk that they will not grandfather the contract one day as well.
Here is an article highlighting the mood in the government which resulted in these new restrictions.
"Clash of Cultural Values in the Crux in the MM2H Revision"
Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions
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Old Aug 22nd 2021, 12:58 am
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Originally Posted by StillSearching View Post
Here is an article highlighting the mood in the government which resulted in these new restrictions.
"Clash of Cultural Values in the Crux in the MM2H Revision"
Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions
I think something went wrong with your link - it just goes back to this thread.
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Old Aug 22nd 2021, 1:36 am
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Originally Posted by Epicurious View Post
I think something went wrong with your link - it just goes back to this thread.
I think this is the op-ed piece StillSearching is referring to:

"Clash of Cultural Values is the Crux of MM2H Revision"
http://www.imidaily.com/asia-pacific...mm2h-revision/

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Old Aug 22nd 2021, 1:57 am
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Originally Posted by invisimind View Post
I think this is the op-ed piece StillSearching is referring to:

"Clash of Cultural Values is the Crux of MM2H Revision"
http://www.imidaily.com/asia-pacific...mm2h-revision/
Thanks for the link. This gentleman's portrayal of the MM2H community is not one I recognise. I wonder if he has ever lived in Malaysia and mixed socially with all three cultures? If so, I think he would know that there are many grey areas where modern day morals intersect with traditional values.
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Old Aug 22nd 2021, 5:39 am
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Originally Posted by Epicurious View Post
Thanks for the link. This gentleman's portrayal of the MM2H community is not one I recognise. I wonder if he has ever lived in Malaysia and mixed socially with all three cultures? If so, I think he would know that there are many grey areas where modern day morals intersect with traditional values.
I think he was just paid by someone, possibly by the gov officials, to write what they told him... Cases he is describing look like about some tourists, most likely not MM2Hers. Are they planning to ban some tourists too? Can't rich guys do all these what he described?

But it is helpful to understand where they stand. Time to go...
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Old Aug 22nd 2021, 7:54 am
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Originally Posted by invisimind View Post
I think this is the op-ed piece StillSearching is referring to:

"Clash of Cultural Values is the Crux of MM2H Revision"
http://www.imidaily.com/asia-pacific...mm2h-revision/
What a weird article (opinion piece). I wonder whether the author has even been in Malaysia. More likely he simply did a Google search and lined up a few newspaper article headlines to make a story.
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Old Aug 22nd 2021, 8:10 am
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Originally Posted by SushiFan View Post
What a weird article (opinion piece). I wonder whether the author has even been in Malaysia. More likely he simply did a Google search and lined up a few newspaper article headlines to make a story.
The author, not listed as staff or even a "Global Contributor" to IMI Daily, is plugging his Caribbean CBI service on this website:
https://iglobal.net/welcome-to-iglobal/
If you look at the Contact page you can see that the registered address of his company is in Singapore and his WhatsApp number is Malaysian, so he must have been here.
Perhaps he wants to deal only with the purest of the pure, which according to him equals stinking rich, and would rather they live in the Caribbean after having contributed to his profit margin rather than in the neo-colonialised fleshpots of SE Asia. /s
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Old Aug 22nd 2021, 1:30 pm
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Yeah had to notice his plug about the good behaviour of Caribbeans vs. those immoral British Colonials. Of the cases he mentioned only one, ASFAIK related to MM2H (the spousal abuse/murder incident). But by his logic if the perpetrators of the Sepang Formula 1 nudity incident were tourist they should shut down the race as an attractive nuisance and ban tourists in general. I think what the article does demonstrate is xenophobia and racism - or perhaps its just wealth snobbism, is not confined to those associated with emptying the nations coffers.

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Old Aug 22nd 2021, 4:46 pm
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Default Re: Peninsular MM2H reactivated from October, new conditions

Two of the examples he gave had nothing to do with MM2H. The first were Australian tourists - not MM2H visa holders. So is he calling for a ban of the Sepang Grand Prix because it might attract unsavoury characters...or shut down tourism entirely? The sad incident with the Dutch (not on MM2H) model was with a character who very much sounds like the type of high-wealth investor that the author calls a "quality applicant" for MM2H. American stockbroker millionaire, bitcoin entrepreneur, very expensive condo. He was actively working in Malaysia, though, so it doesn't sound as if he was a MM2H visa holder. It actually goes against his argument. Wealthy people can easily be vulgar, drinking, drug users.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...d-vanilla.html

The last incident is more complex than he suggested, involving domestic violence incidents which the local police refused to deal with. She has been convicted of culpable homicide. She received no special privilege under Malaysian law. The prosecution did not appeal or complain.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-...ution-22459616



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