Back in the Day

Old Oct 9th 2022, 6:49 am
  #121  
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Default Re: Back in the Day

Originally Posted by Gordon Barlow
Gosh, this thread is beginning to look like an autobiography! It's attracted a thousand visitors in the past two weeks, which is pretty good; but no posts besides mine. Never mind, I suppose; it's open to all...

Back in the day, thirty years ago, I became a financial consultant to a local supermarket, and sat in on the weekly Directors' meetings. I was brought on board to criticise what others might hesitate to criticise; The boss was a nice fellow, but didn't suffer fools gladly. On one occasion I tore into the sales chart. "This can't be right", I grumbled. "You say your sales are going up every week, but the chart is all over the place. It's up and down like Father's pants!" A lovely expression, which I'd learned as a child in Australia. It was new to the locals, and the boss thought it was hugely funny. I could get away with pretty much anything after that.

These many years later, the next generation is running what is now a supermarket chain. I still sit in on the meetings, and any up-and-down chart still gets the same criticism as it did then, from all of them. "As Gordon would say..."
For some reason your post reminds me of a conversation I had recently about presentations such as you describe. When I did my Bachelor degree in International Business Administration, it was a requirement to take a course in Statistics. The class was boring.Yet over time I came to appreciate it. Later in business I noticed how often statistics presented at meetings were not clearly understood by younger managers.

Then spreadsheet software such as Visicalc and Lotus123 became common. and my favourite LotusSymphony. Excell eventually dominated the market, though I still think Lotus Symphony a far superior product. I found understanding of the relationship of numbers enhanced by my course in statistics.Now with how Math s taught, many young people struggle with doing calculations in their head.
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Old Oct 13th 2022, 10:40 pm
  #122  
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Default Re: Back in the Day

BE members of a certain age will remember Stan Freberg, as the first public figure (to the best of my knowledge) to protest against the WOKE culture, back in the 1950s. His version of "Old Man River" was corrected by a censor in the booth who insisted that "old" was demeaning and must be changed to "elderly". And it went downhill from there. Wikipedia tells me that there were other songs before, but that's the first one I recall. His "Day-O" (a big Harry Belafonte hit of the time), gave our household several catch-phrases that were kept alive by Linda and me, in our time - and Ross and I use them too today. The hippie piano-player who objected to the Day-O cry as "Too piercing, man!" and who stopped playing altogether when reference was made to a spider because "Like, I don't dig spiders, man." And that same spider was part of our menagerie. In our house we never encountered a spider of any size that wasn't "a highly deadly black tarantula", just like the song said.

Oh dear, it's hard to stop with the samples. Ah well... Who else has left his or her mark on the lives of BE members, that they would like to tell us about?
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Old Oct 14th 2022, 5:10 pm
  #123  
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Default Re: Back in the Day

STAN FREBERG - ELDERLY MAN RIVER LYRICS
For those who might want to know how Freberg's final version of Elderly Man River went. It was reckoned to be funny, back then. Today we would say it's much too true to be funny. Sigh...
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Old Oct 14th 2022, 6:31 pm
  #124  
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Default Re: Back in the Day

Originally Posted by Gordon Barlow
BE members of a certain age will remember Stan Freberg, as the first public figure (to the best of my knowledge) to protest against the WOKE culture, back in the 1950s. His version of "Old Man River" was corrected by a censor in the booth who insisted that "old" was demeaning and must be changed to "elderly". And it went downhill from there. Wikipedia tells me that there were other songs before, but that's the first one I recall. His "Day-O" (a big Harry Belafonte hit of the time), gave our household several catch-phrases that were kept alive by Linda and me, in our time - and Ross and I use them too today. The hippie piano-player who objected to the Day-O cry as "Too piercing, man!" and who stopped playing altogether when reference was made to a spider because "Like, I don't dig spiders, man." And that same spider was part of our menagerie. In our house we never encountered a spider of any size that wasn't "a highly deadly black tarantula", just like the song said.

Oh dear, it's hard to stop with the samples. Ah well... Who else has left his or her mark on the lives of BE members, that they would like to tell us about?
Old Man River sung by Paul Robeson one of my father's favourite songs.

Back in the 60's unlike today bad language could cause a song not to be played. One band the MC5 began one song with a loud shout of bad language, record company had them change the words - but not before the album had been sold a few thousand copies. Naturally the original album became the most sought after !
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Old Oct 21st 2022, 9:57 pm
  #125  
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Default Re: Back in the Day

A post on my Australian "Barbie" thread posed the question of the difference between expat and immigrant. I have been both, in my time, and for me it's all about intention. Expats intend to move on, immigrants don't.

Back in the day - between 1963 and 1981 - Linda and I were expats, in England, Canada, Bahamas, Australia (!), New Hebrides and Cayman. In 1981, we switched our state of mind. We owned a flat here in Cayman, Linda had a great job, I retired and became a house-father to our six-year-old son. Legally we were still expats, reliant on annual Work Permits - but it was just a matter of time before we would become Caymanians. Well, that's the way it was supposed to be. I got a job that required my employer (the local Chamber of Commerce) to oppose the local politicians who wanted to introduce a tax on local incomes (a first for Cayman). I had to fight for the next 30 years to avoid being deported. Ach, it's a long story, which I might tell some other time. I only mention it now to illustrate that expat and immigrant aren't always entirely separate - in this case, in a British colony, but no doubt in other places too.

Does anybody have any comment to offer on this interesting distinction?
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Old Oct 21st 2022, 11:33 pm
  #126  
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Default Re: Back in the Day

Originally Posted by Gordon Barlow
A post on my Australian "Barbie" thread posed the question of the difference between expat and immigrant. I have been both, in my time, and for me it's all about intention. Expats intend to move on, immigrants don't.

Back in the day - between 1963 and 1981 - Linda and I were expats, in England, Canada, Bahamas, Australia (!), New Hebrides and Cayman. In 1981, we switched our state of mind. We owned a flat here in Cayman, Linda had a great job, I retired and became a house-father to our six-year-old son. Legally we were still expats, reliant on annual Work Permits - but it was just a matter of time before we would become Caymanians. Well, that's the way it was supposed to be. I got a job that required my employer (the local Chamber of Commerce) to oppose the local politicians who wanted to introduce a tax on local incomes (a first for Cayman). I had to fight for the next 30 years to avoid being deported. Ach, it's a long story, which I might tell some other time. I only mention it now to illustrate that expat and immigrant aren't always entirely separate - in this case, in a British colony, but no doubt in other places too.

Does anybody have any comment to offer on this interesting distinction?
I think that is a particular exception your experience.

In my case I have family in Britain, America and Australia, and previously in Rhodesia, and I have l lived in Britain, America and Australia- I guess I have never considered whether I was an Expat or immigrant in any of these countries, yet other countries I have lived in I have never been anything other than an Expat.Yet I have known Expats who have lived decades in a country, never intending to be an 'immigrant' but ended up being de facto so. There is also the somewhat arcane issue of whether one becomes a citizen of 'convenience' or a citizen from belief. While living in America quite often I ran into people with Green Cards who had no intention of becoming citizens, and in their back of their mind felt upon retirement they would or might return to their real home'.
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Old Oct 23rd 2022, 9:37 am
  #127  
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Default Re: Back in the Day

It’s an interesting distinction. I’ve never outwardly considered myself as an expat, I switched from emigrant to immigrant.

That said, I am frequently homesick for Ireland. However my daughter is Australian and in her mind this is home. I watched Brick Lane recently and identified with the mother’s self-same dilemma. She put her energies into the place her daughters called home, and it’s what I do too. Bloom where you are planted, whether for a day, a year or a lifetime.

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Old Oct 29th 2022, 5:14 pm
  #128  
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Further to my post #117 above... A few days ago I carried the theme (cuss-words and asterisks) onto the Maple Leaf forum of the Canada section. So anyone visiting here, might like to check the response I got there.

The BE masters have a "Banned" list, apparently - available to them but not to us - and any naughty words in posts will be automatically changed to asterisks. What a ***-show, eh? Anyway, that's just FYI. I'm keeping it on this Rest of the World forum if I can, because it's part of the "Back in the Day" theme.
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Old Oct 30th 2022, 5:44 am
  #129  
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Default Re: Back in the Day

Originally Posted by Gordon Barlow
Further to my post #117 above... A few days ago I carried the theme (cuss-words and asterisks) onto the Maple Leaf forum of the Canada section. So anyone visiting here, might like to check the response I got there.

The BE masters have a "Banned" list, apparently - available to them but not to us - and any naughty words in posts will be automatically changed to asterisks. What a ***-show, eh? Anyway, that's just FYI. I'm keeping it on this Rest of the World forum if I can, because it's part of the "Back in the Day" theme.
It is not quite like that but then again it is quite like that.

There is the ability to filter out certain words & phrases by adding them to a filter list. When the word is typed by a poster the word will automatically appear as asterisks as you have discovered.

It isn't just 'naughty' words that are on the filter. There are some truly dreadful words and phrases, which posters have attempted to use on BE, and which have needed to be blocked. I know this, as it is the BE Admin that maintains and monitors the list and that used to be my job. It is an evolving list. Somethings might be added and some removed. Admin can see the whole list. Not the mods.

Sometimes the phrases are not naughty as such . They are spam phrases & adjusting them to a series of asterisks denies the spammer the visual they are after and so they lose interest in the site.

Might pay to remember that BE used to have a childrens section. It has always been - or at least used to be - peddled as family friendly It also is about the look of BE overall. No-one much would wish to ask immigration or other advice of a site peppered with swearing; porn words ; offensive phrases. All that might be fine on some Reddit places etc but not for BE . Same really with the TIO area. That shouldn't be the front activity on BE that new eyes first see.

If you want people looking to emigrate or who have other overseas issues to use BE and then to join in , then it needs to feel open , friendly and welcoming . Somewhere you might have faith in a quality response.
Not somewhere you need to navigate the crude , the ugly, the trollish before you can find your way to something better --- if you can be bothered by then that is.

Hence the filter.








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Old Oct 30th 2022, 9:46 pm
  #130  
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Default Re: Back in the Day

Okay. Thanks for clarifying, BEVS. As I'm sure you understand, I'm not in favour of rude words in any BE post. But I'm also not in favour of asterisks. I think they're a cowardly cop-out - a half-measure. After all, if some member says someone else is a silly c***, we - all of us; every one of us - knows what the asterisks "hide". We know the victim isn't being called a silly cook, or a silly cabinet-maker! (Which would require more asterisks than three, I know. Never mind.) One of our members signs every post with the words "Same ****, different bucket". Again, we know what letters are missing. so what's the point of the stars? They don't achieve anything. Indeed, they simply confuse the issue by pretending to achieve something. Back in the day... writers were encouraged to substitute "... better words, now they only use four-letter words", like the song says.

BE's executives could lead the way in banning cuss-words of all kind, whether spelt out in all their glory or "disguised" with asterisks. So that's my point. Either go The Full Monty, or insist on substitutions. "Same garbage, different bucket" conveys the same sentiment as "same ****", so why not require that substitution? Effing and blinding has become much more common in public utterances since I was a boy, and it's not a change for the better. What used to be dismissed as low-class, is now mainstream. WTF, eh?

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Old Oct 30th 2022, 10:01 pm
  #131  
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Default Re: Back in the Day

I’m with you to an extent Gordon.

I think swearing properly is becoming rarer, the shotgun approach of peppering your language with f’ing bloo.. etc etc etc (here in the Caribbean motherc… seems popular), is just lazy imho.

Save the swearing for when it matters then use it sparingly, but creatively. The use of expletives is by no means actually necessary.

The Arabs are creative, the famous ‘may the fleas if 1000 camels infest your armpits’ is well known.

Disraeli - If Gladstone fell into the Thames, that would be a misfortune, and if anybody pulled him out, that, I suppose, would be a calamity.”

David Lloyd George - “
He can’t see a belt without hitting below it.”

Churchill on Attlee: “
An empty taxi arrived at 10 Downing Street, and when the door was opened, Attlee got out.” Not forgetting the classic “he is a modest man with much to be modest about.”“A semi-trained polecat.”

Michael Foot, a future Labour leader, gave his verdict on Tory MP Norman Tebbit

Dennis Heaney on Jeffrey Howell - Being attacked by Geoffrey Howe was like being savaged by a dead sheep.”

Ken Livingstone - “
I’ve met serial killers and assassins but nobody scared me as much as Mrs Thatcher.




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Old Oct 30th 2022, 10:14 pm
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Originally Posted by Gordon Barlow
Okay. Thanks for clarifying, BEVS. As I'm sure you understand, I'm not in favour of rude words in any BE post. But I'm also not in favour of asterisks. I think they're a cowardly cop-out - a half-measure. After all, if some member says someone else is a silly c***, we - all of us; every one of us - knows what the asterisks "hide". We know the victim isn't being called a silly cook, or a silly cabinet-maker! (Which would require more asterisks than three, I know. Never mind.) One of our members signs every post with the words "Same ****, different bucket". Again, we know what letters are missing. so what's the point of the stars? They don't achieve anything. Indeed, they simply confuse the issue by pretending to achieve something. Back in the day... writers were encouraged to substitute "... better words, now they only use four-letter words", like the song says.

BE's executives could lead the way in banning cuss-words of all kind, whether spelt out in all their glory or "disguised" with asterisks. So that's my point. Either go The Full Monty, or insist on substitutions. "Same garbage, different bucket" conveys the same sentiment as "same ****", so why not require that substitution? Effing and blinding has become much more common in public utterances since I was a boy, and it's not a change for the better. What used to be dismissed as low-class, is now mainstream. WTF, eh?
The asterisks are about the VBulletin software. Part of the programming. It is not a choice.
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Old Oct 30th 2022, 10:17 pm
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Default Re: Back in the Day

Originally Posted by Gordon Barlow
Okay. Thanks for clarifying, BEVS. As I'm sure you understand, I'm not in favour of rude words in any BE post. But I'm also not in favour of asterisks. I think they're a cowardly cop-out - a half-measure. After all, if some member says someone else is a silly c***, we - all of us; every one of us - knows what the asterisks "hide". We know the victim isn't being called a silly cook, or a silly cabinet-maker! (Which would require more asterisks than three, I know. Never mind.) One of our members signs every post with the words "Same ****, different bucket". Again, we know what letters are missing. so what's the point of the stars? They don't achieve anything. Indeed, they simply confuse the issue by pretending to achieve something. Back in the day... writers were encouraged to substitute "... better words, now they only use four-letter words", like the song says.

BE's executives could lead the way in banning cuss-words of all kind, whether spelt out in all their glory or "disguised" with asterisks. So that's my point. Either go The Full Monty, or insist on substitutions. "Same garbage, different bucket" conveys the same sentiment as "same ****", so why not require that substitution? Effing and blinding has become much more common in public utterances since I was a boy, and it's not a change for the better. What used to be dismissed as low-class, is now mainstream. WTF, eh?
The asterisks are about the VBulletin software. Part of the programming. It is not a choice.

I suppose the vbulletin IT programmers could think to alter the * thing for something else but I doubt they have the time or the inclination. The ** was likely chosen as those sorts of symbols have long been used to blank out swear words. It is historical.
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Old Nov 1st 2022, 3:13 am
  #134  
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Originally Posted by BEVS
The asterisks are about the VBulletin software. Part of the programming. It is not a choice.
I suppose the vbulletin IT programmers could think to alter the * thing for something else but I doubt they have the time or the inclination. The ** was likely chosen as those sorts of symbols have long been used to blank out swear words. It is historical.
I understand your point, BEVS. But it does grieve me that the BE bosses go along with the virtue-signalling that the asterisks condone. I'd never heard of "vbulletin software", and have no idea why the BE people think it's so great.

It is a choice for the bosses, though. If you are telling me - and I think you are - that the choice for the site is between full-monty cuss-words and virtue-signalling pretend-censored cuss-words, with no third option, then they are in an uncomfortable quandary. Because the asterisks don't effectively hide the words, all BE's readers are exposed to them anyway. I'm tempted to suggest that the bosses might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb! But I won't go that far. It's their site, after all, not its readers'. I don't suppose many of us are learning any new rude words anyway!
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Old Nov 7th 2022, 3:14 am
  #135  
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Default Re: Back in the Day

Continuing the taboo-words theme for another quick minute - this time, naughty words that are not cuss-words. Ethnic and national identities, for instance. I know of three nationalities that could be abbreviated back in the day, but can't be today. Those are Japanese, Pakistani, and (Australian) aborigine. Back in the day, okay; now, not. Are there any more? Today, too, a Chinese person must always be called a Chinese person. When I was a young cricketer, a Chinaman was an off-break bowled by a left-hander. Can somebody please tell me if that's still the case? (The origin of the term was rather less than elegant, according to the history of cricket, but all the same... It's not as though there are many Chinese persons playing cricket at all, never mind left-handed ones bowling off-breaks. Still, you never know.)
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