dave.t

We are living in Australia at the moment and although I am happy here my wife is longing to live a bit nearer family ( England )

We have friends who moved to the Cork area about a year ago and love it, so we have decided to investigate Southern Ireland as a possible new settling place.

We could do with some info on the following please ....

Salary for Print finisher and newly qualified teacher,
House prices ( 4 bed in a village location ),
Cost of living, petrol,food, bills etc,
Anything else you can think of

I know the Irish are supposed to be the friendliest people on the planet but how do they take to the English moving in ?

Thanks in advance for all your help and I`m sure these questions appear on here quite often so I also thank you for your patience.

Dave

ps its summer here at the moment and bloody hot, does it rain all year round in Ireland or do you get good summers ?

andrew63

Hi Dave
Did what you aid the other way round!
Me (English) went to Ireland for 10 years then went to Australia (wife is Irish, Co. Wicklow)
Salary - not sure for that trade! Just check the local press or www.monster.ie.
House prices look at www.corkproperties.ie or http://www.hok.ie/cork/cork.html or others
Cost of living is expensive, tax is horrendous (46% basic rate) as is VAT (21%).
The summers are good as the rain is warmer!

Putting all that aside, it's a great place to live. Esp. Cork. People are great. Cork is, however, a very Irish part of Ireland and perhaps a higher percentage of true patriots may be found down there in the "true" capital of Ireland (as they call it).

Persoanally, if I had reason to go back that "way" I would not hesitate to go back to Ireland if I could earn a decent wage!

Andrew

snowqueen

I would add that another good site for houses is www.myhome.ie - a great deal of the main estate agents are aligned to that.

House prices are expensive, though if you go out into a more rural location, they will be cheaper. I personally love the whole north co co Cork/ co Waterford area - very scenic.

Jobs are meant to be plentiful these days, though as I may have said before elsewhere on the forum, most of the jobs are in the urban areas. If you can get the best of both worlds, then grab it!

As for the weather, well, maybe I'm not the best person to ask as I like the sun and warmth. I also like proper cold and snow. In Ireland we rarely get either. Some people like the 'mild' weather all year round. If you don't like extremes then in may suit you (anything over 20 degrees is usually considered a heatwave in Ireland and anything below 10 degrees "cold"!) However when it is nice, it's beautiful. Truly. Just to get you in the lingo, a damp drizzly day is affectionately known as a 'soft' day! And yes, it does rain quite a bit, which is why it's so green! However, this is worst in the west.

As Andrew said, cost of living is very high. Petrol is however, cheaper than the UK and as we are tied in to the eurozone we have VERY low interest rates which helps with the old mortgage. However, they are starting to rise, so don't go burdening yourself with debt. IMHO, Ireland is a great place to live if you can afford it. If you are stuck with riduculous mortgage and the high living costs mean you can't afford to make the most of life, then it isn't worth it.

One other important thing you might want to check out. Teachers here (primary anyway) need to be qualified to teach Irish. This is quite a stumbling block for anyone coming from outside, which is daft IMO. Not sure about secondary, but I suggest you check out the Dept of Education website and see what they say.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

Snowqueen

JAJ

On top of that, aren't most schools in the Republic of Ireland controlled by the Roman Catholic church? This could cause employment problems for those of other faiths (or none).

Northern Ireland may be an alternative worth considering - different from mainland UK and yet without many of the issues that come with trying to settle in a foreign country.

Teachers from England who have qualified through the GTP route (as opposed to the normal BEd or PCGE routes) also need to check to see if their qualification is recognised. Recognition of GTPC is apparently a problem even in some other parts of the UK, including Scotland and Northern Ireland.

All that said, the original posters should think hard before leaving Australia. Unless their reasons are very strong, they may find they regret it and yet be unable to return once their permanent residence is expired (if they are not Australian citizens).


Jeremy

snowqueen

[QUOTE=JAJ]On top of that, aren't most schools in the Republic of Ireland controlled by the Roman Catholic church? This could cause employment problems for those of other faiths (or none).

Northern Ireland may be an alternative worth considering - different from mainland UK and yet without many of the issues that come with trying to settle in a foreign country.[quote]

"controlled" might be to strong a word these days - historically they were, but it's officially the Dept of Education now - although there is obviously a strong Catholic ethos in most of them. I'm not Catholic, and my kids go to a Church of Ireland school, which has a Christian ethos (I hate the word 'protestant' - and don't feel comfortable calling myself one, although in Ireland you are a 'prod' if you're not a Catholic) However, the point is that churches do still hold influence on the schooling system so in that sense you are right. Not sure how Catholic/whatever you have to be to teach though!!

There are also however a number of "educate together" schools which are growing up around the country which are non-demoninational schools, run largely by the parents. Progressive and very good in my opinion. Teaching there might have different requirements again, though I honestly don't know too much about them.

There are many immigrants coming into Ireland of different faiths etc and the
system will have to catch up with reality some day.


Snowqueen

snowqueen

After a conversation with a colleague today who has an English friend teaching here, I can now defeinitively UPDATE you!

Apparently you can register to teach (without the Irish) and you can start teaching. They then give you seven years to learn Irish up to the required standard (about degree level). It's tough but that's what you have to do (either that, or work as a teacher for 6.5 years and then change career LOL) or hope they change the system. Substitue teachers do not have to have Irish and don't even have to be fully qualified!

Also, teaching the infant classes, the Irish is very basic (even I can follow it) so you kind of learn with them - just have to be one step ahead!

On the religion thing, there isn't apparently any particular requirement for you to be of a particular religious persuasion. However, you do have to be prepared to teach the subject(s) in the RE curriculum. Again for primary, it's pretty basic. At 8, Catholic kids do their first holy communion, so that would be a heavier year, religion wise.

Hope all that helps

Cathy

JAJ

Which must have pretty much the same effect as a formal employment bar against non-Roman Catholics.

Isn't RE also supposed to be "integrated" into the primary school curriculum in the Republic of Ireland? (ie not taught as a separate subject?) That must make it even more difficult for teachers and pupils not of a Roman Catholic persuasion.



Jeremy

dave.t

Thanks for that , some very interesting pointers.

If we do come it would be very interesting to see my wife having to learn Irish if she wants to bcome a teacher there .

Thanks again guys

Dave

Batty

Hi. You don't need Irish to teach in a Secondary school. My sister is a secondary school teacher. Funnily enough, she is a theologian and actually teaches "religions of the world'. One of my other sisters lives out in the country and her kids go to a 'country' school. As in, not in a big town. They've got kids of all denominations including their Muslim neighbours. If the schools weren't inclusive these days there would be a lot of kids without any education!

I think JAJ has a very outdated idea of Ireland as it is these days.

Blue Scotty Girl moved over this year and she can give you a better idea of what it's like to live there with kids. But, I was just reading the salient points of the budget yesterday and it's Happy Families over there at the moment. All parents are entitled to Children's Allowance. I don't know for sure, but again BSG will be able to tell you, if everyone is entitled to it from Day ONE (but I think they are). Anyway, for the first 2 kids you get €150 each per month and if you have more than that it goes up to €185 each per month. 46% rate of tax is the HIGHEST you pay and only after 28k. Up to that it's 20% and when I was leaving in June it was actually 44% so it must have gone up since then (although I don't see how that could happen without a budget).

www.unison.ie is a good source for news and local papers. Cork is brilliant. Yes, it is THE most Irish of Irish cities but it's growing all the time and Irish people will treat you the way you treat them. Good luck. BTW, it doesn't rain ALL the time, it just feels like it :-)

CPW

I know we've had this sort of discussion before, but there are plenty of non-Roman Catholic, Christian teachers who would be prepared to teach RE in a Roman Catholic school, without any view of being subversive or going against the school's requirements. Whether the school would be happy with such an arrangement would be up to the school, of course, but I know of several in London and several in Australia that obviously are happy. I don't know of any in Ireland, I have to say, but things have changed a lot in Ireland in the past decade or two and I dare say that there are.

The point for this thread is that I'm not sure that this is necessarily a bar, unless one side or the other (with perfectly good motives, probably) wants it to be.

snowqueen

Top rate of tax is actually now 42%. However, you come into that bracket awfully quickly. It's certainly not just for 'high earners'.

The payments you refer to above are child benefit, payable in repect of all kids under 18, and yes, they are reasonably generous. Childrens allowance is something else those on benefits get, as far as I know. On top of that in the budget, the minister has announced a cash payment of €1000 per year for each child under six (eligible from birth) to all parents. This is meant to help with childcare costs, but with most creches charging around €800-900 PER MONTH per child, it's not going to help a lot.

Don't forget also, when talking about 28K etc, you are talking euros. 28K euros is about 19-20K sterling. And I can tell you, a salary of 28K euro won't get you far in Ireland - in fact it's below the average industrial wage.

SQ

Batty

Hi SQ

I'm actually Irish - only left in June this year. Sorry about the 44% - I remembered afterwards that it was 42%. The Children's Allowance has always been called that - never child benefit. Maybe the 'newbies' call it that but not the natives. Yes, the average industrial wage is 30k but you do get a tax free allowance and people on lower wages pay very little, if any, tax. I know it changed a couple of years ago but don't know the details. One of the reasons I was glad to leave was the high cost of living - we had a very small mortgage but had to commute 5 hours a day to work because we couldn't afford to buy a house closer to Dublin. You're right, it's a great place to live if you have money (like the rest of the World I suppose) but being poor over there isn't pretty. I remember a classic one liner from an 'Inner city' Dublin woman once when there was a discussion about the Celtic Tiger - "Celtic Tiger? We're not even a stripe on its arse!" LOL

snowqueen

Yeah, that's one thing I WILL miss is the Dub humour!

Didn't mean to 'correct' you on the child benefit thing I was just regurgitating what I'd read about the budget. It's called child benefit in all the newspapers and on the form when I get it (!) so forgive me if it's colloquially/traditionally called something else! Also I realise there is no other childrens allowance for those on benefits as I suggested before, (I was getting confused with lone parent allowance/ carers allowance etc), so mea culpa on that one.

So what was it that made you leave Ireland, Batty, and are you planning on coming back? 5 hours commute sounds horrendous, so hopefully you have a better QOL where you are now. We were lucky to buy our house back in 1993, so we have a serious amount of equity in it now, which is one of the reasons we are planning to move to Canada. (we are in Monksotwn/Dun Laoghaire). For us, it will not only mean mortgage free living, but a decent lifestyle and financial security, kids college fees etc to boot! All out of a 3 bed semi! Not bad huh? People keep trying to put the frighteners on us by saying that we'll never get back into the market etc, but...

I've often wondered amidst all this talk of how well we are doing and all the immigration into Ireland etc, how many people like yourself have actually slipped quiety out of the country. Would be interesting to know.

Anyhow, hope you don't regret making the move - would be interested to hear your story.

Snowqueen

Batty

Lucky, lucky you - we rented in Blackrock for a while and I loved it out there. That was back in 2000 and even then we wouldn't have had a hope of buying there. I'm married to a New Zealander so that's basically the reason I left - this time LOL The first time I left was in '87 (London), came back in '90 for three years and then left again (Holland), from there went to London again and back to Ireland in '99. We wouldn't have gone back at all except for family reasons. My son is 24 now, graduated this year and is going to work for 2 years then go back to college to do his Masters and once that's out of the way he's off! He speaks Italian, German and French (degree in Business and Italian) and wants to work for a football club so will probably head back to Italy. Or, as his girlfriend is South American, he might end up there. He's going to Chile for a few weeks after Christmas so I'm waiting to see what he thinks. So, it begins again - the brain drain. When young people can't afford to buy a house nor run a car (it cost him 2.5k for insurance alone - madness!) they look elsewhere.

I was never going to stay in Ireland - if I hadn't met my husband I would probably have stayed in Holland, I loved it there. NZ is costly with some things too but you get a lot more house for the same mortgage - Lord, our house would probably cost 700-800k in Dublin (we're in Auckland so I'm comparing apples with apples). I know of a few families who've come over here from various parts of the country in the last year, mostly looking for what Ireland used to be. Gas isn't it? We thought as a country we'd never get rich but now nobody's happy. On paper, when you see all these handouts given to people, it looks like everyone must be loaded but my mother with twice the pension of my mother in law is no better off financially. And how anyone pays for childcare I really don't know - they must be working for the satisfaction and not what they have left over at the end of the month. I can't see the point in getting up in the early hours 5 days a week to do that. All very sad really. But, hey, I'm not there and you're leaving so "I'm all right" and "Jack" springs to mind LOL. Got to go - must work. good luck.

BlueScottyGirl

Am running in late with this one (story of my life these days). Just to clarify, yes, everyone gets Childrens Allowance but they WILL establish that you plan to remain here. Be sure and bring with you a full birth certificate for each child to send with your application, it won't be returned.

You are eligible from the month following your arrival in Ireland. So if you arrive any time in May for example, you will be paid from 1st June. Be warned though, it is currently taking six months to process applications and pay out, but they DO give you back payments. You'll have an expensive start with school though what with uniforms, books, equipment and voluntary contributions (the last might be waived depending on when you arrive).

Anything else, I'm happy to help. I think most other questions were answered elsewhere.

BGS