Why Amsterdam is so cool
Aug 26th 2005, 7:45 pm
#46
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
On 8/28/05 12:28 AM, in article [email protected],
"[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> DFM don't be so narrow minded as to think all americans are the way
> you describe. some are many are not. many non-americans are just as
> unware and less traveled. if you know your history as well and fully
> as you like to infer you would know both the u.s.a. and the
> netherlands were started by so called non-elites.
No offense, but did you see anything -outside- of the center of Amsterdam
or even something outside Amsterdam itself? Like Hoorn, or Fryslan, or
Maastricht? There are coffeeshops and hookers all over the country.
ej
"[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> DFM don't be so narrow minded as to think all americans are the way
> you describe. some are many are not. many non-americans are just as
> unware and less traveled. if you know your history as well and fully
> as you like to infer you would know both the u.s.a. and the
> netherlands were started by so called non-elites.
No offense, but did you see anything -outside- of the center of Amsterdam
or even something outside Amsterdam itself? Like Hoorn, or Fryslan, or
Maastricht? There are coffeeshops and hookers all over the country.
ej
Aug 26th 2005, 8:02 pm
#47
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
On 8/26/05 6:23 PM, in article
[email protected] om, "[email protected]"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> I just visited Amsterdam and I am trying to figure out why it is such a
> cool place.
At the moment it isn't so cool.
It is filled with groups all of who distrust one another because of the
murder of Theo van Gogh, a one-man 9/11 of there ever was one.
>It is so cool because it fits in with our current modern
> western european socio-political beliefs.
It does? Like legal cannabis and prostitution?
>It has an non-elitist roots -
You really do need to read about the history of the city and the way it is
currently run.
It is absolutely bursting with elitism of all sorts.
Because you as a non-dutch speaking tourist cannot place your finger on the
pulse of the city, I am sure you are not even close in your analysis.
For example, about a year ago or maybe 2, one of the city fathers had to
give up his seat on the council because he frequented prostitutes in the
tipplezone (area set aside for prostitutes, usually illegal under aged or
heroin addicts).
Further, pole dancing has been forbidden within a certain distance around
the Leidseplein.
The police have new power to preventatively search you for drugs and
weapons.
> no great monolithic spires and castles of princes and kings.
You have never seen a spire in Amsterdam? Have you been here? They are all
over the place.
> It has a
> very "protestant work ethic" based city built by merchants and traders.
No, it doesn't. Some people do work very hard. A large number of others try
not to work at all. This is only changing as now, as the current government
has ordered a visit to all welfare and unemployment recipients to see what
their circumstances -actually- are, not what the claim or what is assumed to
be the case. Further, the doors are always closed at 17:59:58, so you better
get there well before 6 if you want to conduct any business.
> Much like the people we admire in modern cultures.
Hmmmmmm.
>It has a liberal
> attitude which we currently believe in.
Actually it is becoming more and more conservative by the day, week, month,
and year. It is referred to here as the "vertrutting van de stad," which
means the bitch-ification of the city.
> So I think we like Amsterdam
> because that's what we are now and that's what we want to be.
Who is this we you keep speaking of? Are you a queen? If so, we already have
1 and several waiting in line.
> It is
> like liking ourselves for better or worse.
OK....
ej
>
[email protected] om, "[email protected]"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> I just visited Amsterdam and I am trying to figure out why it is such a
> cool place.
At the moment it isn't so cool.
It is filled with groups all of who distrust one another because of the
murder of Theo van Gogh, a one-man 9/11 of there ever was one.
>It is so cool because it fits in with our current modern
> western european socio-political beliefs.
It does? Like legal cannabis and prostitution?
>It has an non-elitist roots -
You really do need to read about the history of the city and the way it is
currently run.
It is absolutely bursting with elitism of all sorts.
Because you as a non-dutch speaking tourist cannot place your finger on the
pulse of the city, I am sure you are not even close in your analysis.
For example, about a year ago or maybe 2, one of the city fathers had to
give up his seat on the council because he frequented prostitutes in the
tipplezone (area set aside for prostitutes, usually illegal under aged or
heroin addicts).
Further, pole dancing has been forbidden within a certain distance around
the Leidseplein.
The police have new power to preventatively search you for drugs and
weapons.
> no great monolithic spires and castles of princes and kings.
You have never seen a spire in Amsterdam? Have you been here? They are all
over the place.
> It has a
> very "protestant work ethic" based city built by merchants and traders.
No, it doesn't. Some people do work very hard. A large number of others try
not to work at all. This is only changing as now, as the current government
has ordered a visit to all welfare and unemployment recipients to see what
their circumstances -actually- are, not what the claim or what is assumed to
be the case. Further, the doors are always closed at 17:59:58, so you better
get there well before 6 if you want to conduct any business.
> Much like the people we admire in modern cultures.
Hmmmmmm.
>It has a liberal
> attitude which we currently believe in.
Actually it is becoming more and more conservative by the day, week, month,
and year. It is referred to here as the "vertrutting van de stad," which
means the bitch-ification of the city.
> So I think we like Amsterdam
> because that's what we are now and that's what we want to be.
Who is this we you keep speaking of? Are you a queen? If so, we already have
1 and several waiting in line.
> It is
> like liking ourselves for better or worse.
OK....
ej
>
Aug 26th 2005, 9:11 pm
#48
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 17:16:19 -0400, S Viemeister
<[email protected]> wrote:
>DDT Filled Mormons wrote:
>>
>> On 26 Aug 2005 09:40:46 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >No. It has nothing to do with the drugs and hookers...
>>
>> Yes it does. The availability of sex and drugs is Amsterdam's
>> strongest selling point. Who goes there just for the canals?
>>
>Me. And for the museums.
Us too :-)
--
Martin
<[email protected]> wrote:
>DDT Filled Mormons wrote:
>>
>> On 26 Aug 2005 09:40:46 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >No. It has nothing to do with the drugs and hookers...
>>
>> Yes it does. The availability of sex and drugs is Amsterdam's
>> strongest selling point. Who goes there just for the canals?
>>
>Me. And for the museums.
Us too :-)
--
Martin
Aug 26th 2005, 9:12 pm
#49
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 +0100, [email protected]
(chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn and prestwich tesco 24h
offy) wrote:
>S Viemeister <[email protected]> wrote:
>> DDT Filled Mormons wrote:
>> >
>> > On 26 Aug 2005 09:40:46 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
>> >
>> > >
>> > >No. It has nothing to do with the drugs and hookers...
>> >
>> > Yes it does. The availability of sex and drugs is Amsterdam's
>> > strongest selling point. Who goes there just for the canals?
>> >
>> Me. And for the museums.
>The Vermeers! Better than any drug IMO.
and in the Mauritshuis in the Hague.
--
Martin
(chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn and prestwich tesco 24h
offy) wrote:
>S Viemeister <[email protected]> wrote:
>> DDT Filled Mormons wrote:
>> >
>> > On 26 Aug 2005 09:40:46 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
>> >
>> > >
>> > >No. It has nothing to do with the drugs and hookers...
>> >
>> > Yes it does. The availability of sex and drugs is Amsterdam's
>> > strongest selling point. Who goes there just for the canals?
>> >
>> Me. And for the museums.
>The Vermeers! Better than any drug IMO.
and in the Mauritshuis in the Hague.
--
Martin
Aug 26th 2005, 9:15 pm
#50
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 +0100, [email protected]
(chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn and prestwich tesco 24h
offy) wrote:
>Iceman <[email protected]> wrote:
>[]
>> However, if it didn't have open prostitution and legal drugs, it would
>> probably get about as many visitors as Brussels. 90% of Amsterdam's
>> visitors are either there to take advantage of the legal pot and hash
>> and hookers, or to gawk at the whole sex/drug scene, not to view the
>> Rembrandts.
>Have you got evidence for that? I find it really hard to believe!
It's the impression I get. If my son says in UK that he is born in
Holland, the assumption seems to be that he is either a drug salesman
or a pimp.
--
Martin
(chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn and prestwich tesco 24h
offy) wrote:
>Iceman <[email protected]> wrote:
>[]
>> However, if it didn't have open prostitution and legal drugs, it would
>> probably get about as many visitors as Brussels. 90% of Amsterdam's
>> visitors are either there to take advantage of the legal pot and hash
>> and hookers, or to gawk at the whole sex/drug scene, not to view the
>> Rembrandts.
>Have you got evidence for that? I find it really hard to believe!
It's the impression I get. If my son says in UK that he is born in
Holland, the assumption seems to be that he is either a drug salesman
or a pimp.
--
Martin
Aug 26th 2005, 9:19 pm
#51
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 21:58:56 GMT, "Timothy Kroesen"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Van Gogh holds no attraction??? I still remember the feeling looking
>into the self portraits and at 'the wheat fields'... along with the
>taste of pom frittes with satay saus in the evening...<g>
>OP is right; A'Dam is cool!
>I also remember sitting at a table outside a small coffee shop one of
>the first nights I spent there last year contemplating a spliff of
>Bubblegum... Looked left...Looked right... took a sly toke... Round the
>corner stroll two of the most beautiful Police Women I'd ever seen...
>Choked Royal! Damn did we all have a good laugh!!!
>Where else but...<g>
I once saw the most beautiful m/cycle cop in the world in Rome. Black
leathers, long flowing blonde hair, ...
--
Martin
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Van Gogh holds no attraction??? I still remember the feeling looking
>into the self portraits and at 'the wheat fields'... along with the
>taste of pom frittes with satay saus in the evening...<g>
>OP is right; A'Dam is cool!
>I also remember sitting at a table outside a small coffee shop one of
>the first nights I spent there last year contemplating a spliff of
>Bubblegum... Looked left...Looked right... took a sly toke... Round the
>corner stroll two of the most beautiful Police Women I'd ever seen...
>Choked Royal! Damn did we all have a good laugh!!!
>Where else but...<g>
I once saw the most beautiful m/cycle cop in the world in Rome. Black
leathers, long flowing blonde hair, ...
--
Martin
Aug 26th 2005, 9:22 pm
#52
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
Martin <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 +0100, [email protected]
> (chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn and prestwich tesco 24h
> offy) wrote:
>
> >Iceman <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >[]
> >> However, if it didn't have open prostitution and legal drugs, it would
> >> probably get about as many visitors as Brussels. 90% of Amsterdam's
> >> visitors are either there to take advantage of the legal pot and hash
> >> and hookers, or to gawk at the whole sex/drug scene, not to view the
> >> Rembrandts.
> >
> >Have you got evidence for that? I find it really hard to believe!
>
> It's the impression I get. If my son says in UK that he is born in
> Holland, the assumption seems to be that he is either a drug salesman
> or a pimp.
Well, it's not mine!
--
David Horne- http://www.davidhorne.net
usenet (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk
photos at http://homepage.mac.com/davidhornecomposer
> On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 +0100, [email protected]
> (chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn and prestwich tesco 24h
> offy) wrote:
>
> >Iceman <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >[]
> >> However, if it didn't have open prostitution and legal drugs, it would
> >> probably get about as many visitors as Brussels. 90% of Amsterdam's
> >> visitors are either there to take advantage of the legal pot and hash
> >> and hookers, or to gawk at the whole sex/drug scene, not to view the
> >> Rembrandts.
> >
> >Have you got evidence for that? I find it really hard to believe!
>
> It's the impression I get. If my son says in UK that he is born in
> Holland, the assumption seems to be that he is either a drug salesman
> or a pimp.
Well, it's not mine!
--
David Horne- http://www.davidhorne.net
usenet (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk
photos at http://homepage.mac.com/davidhornecomposer
Aug 26th 2005, 9:53 pm
#53
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
On Sat, 27 Aug 2005 10:22:18 +0100, [email protected]
(chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn and prestwich tesco 24h
offy) wrote:
>Martin <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 +0100, [email protected]
>> (chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn and prestwich tesco 24h
>> offy) wrote:
>>
>> >Iceman <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >
>> >[]
>> >> However, if it didn't have open prostitution and legal drugs, it would
>> >> probably get about as many visitors as Brussels. 90% of Amsterdam's
>> >> visitors are either there to take advantage of the legal pot and hash
>> >> and hookers, or to gawk at the whole sex/drug scene, not to view the
>> >> Rembrandts.
>> >
>> >Have you got evidence for that? I find it really hard to believe!
>>
>> It's the impression I get. If my son says in UK that he was born in
>> Holland, the assumption seems to be that he is either a drug salesman
>> or a pimp.
>Well, it's not mine!
You aren't 90% of the hypothetical tourists. :-)
If most tourists.visitors didn't lurk around the red light area and
Volendam, think how overcrowded the rest of A'dam would be.
--
Martin
(chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn and prestwich tesco 24h
offy) wrote:
>Martin <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 22:27:48 +0100, [email protected]
>> (chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn and prestwich tesco 24h
>> offy) wrote:
>>
>> >Iceman <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >
>> >[]
>> >> However, if it didn't have open prostitution and legal drugs, it would
>> >> probably get about as many visitors as Brussels. 90% of Amsterdam's
>> >> visitors are either there to take advantage of the legal pot and hash
>> >> and hookers, or to gawk at the whole sex/drug scene, not to view the
>> >> Rembrandts.
>> >
>> >Have you got evidence for that? I find it really hard to believe!
>>
>> It's the impression I get. If my son says in UK that he was born in
>> Holland, the assumption seems to be that he is either a drug salesman
>> or a pimp.
>Well, it's not mine!
You aren't 90% of the hypothetical tourists. :-)
If most tourists.visitors didn't lurk around the red light area and
Volendam, think how overcrowded the rest of A'dam would be.
--
Martin
Aug 26th 2005, 11:02 pm
#54
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
On Sat, 27 Aug 2005 13:13:10 +0100, DDT Filled Mormons
<deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote:
>On Sat, 27 Aug 2005 10:02:44 +0200, Eric Johnson <[email protected]>
>wrote:
>>On 8/26/05 6:23 PM, in article
>>[email protected] .com, "[email protected]"
>><[email protected]> wrote:
>>>It is so cool because it fits in with our current modern
>>> western european socio-political beliefs.
>>It does? Like legal cannabis and prostitution?
>Note that cannabis is not actually legal in the Netherlands, it's just
>widely tolerated.
Growing it definitely isn't.
--
Martin
<deepfreudmoors@eITmISaACTUALLYiREAL!l.nu> wrote:
>On Sat, 27 Aug 2005 10:02:44 +0200, Eric Johnson <[email protected]>
>wrote:
>>On 8/26/05 6:23 PM, in article
>>[email protected] .com, "[email protected]"
>><[email protected]> wrote:
>>>It is so cool because it fits in with our current modern
>>> western european socio-political beliefs.
>>It does? Like legal cannabis and prostitution?
>Note that cannabis is not actually legal in the Netherlands, it's just
>widely tolerated.
Growing it definitely isn't.
--
Martin
Aug 26th 2005, 11:35 pm
#55
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
DDT Filled Mormons wrote:
> On 26 Aug 2005 09:40:46 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
>
>
>>No. It has nothing to do with the drugs and hookers...
>
>
> Yes it does. The availability of sex and drugs is Amsterdam's
> strongest selling point. Who goes there just for the canals?
I do, and the cafes, museums and jazz clubs.
> On 26 Aug 2005 09:40:46 -0700, [email protected] wrote:
>
>
>>No. It has nothing to do with the drugs and hookers...
>
>
> Yes it does. The availability of sex and drugs is Amsterdam's
> strongest selling point. Who goes there just for the canals?
I do, and the cafes, museums and jazz clubs.
Aug 26th 2005, 11:37 pm
#56
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
Keith Anderson wrote:
>
>>The Vermeers! Better than any drug IMO.
>
> Psssst - meester - wanna quick view of Delft? For you ees very cheap,
> my friend............
That's the worst German accent I ever heard!
>
>>The Vermeers! Better than any drug IMO.
>
> Psssst - meester - wanna quick view of Delft? For you ees very cheap,
> my friend............
That's the worst German accent I ever heard!
Aug 26th 2005, 11:39 pm
#57
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
Iceman wrote:
>>>However, if it didn't have open prostitution and legal drugs, it would
>>>probably get about as many visitors as Brussels. 90% of Amsterdam's
>>>visitors are either there to take advantage of the legal pot and hash
>>>and hookers, or to gawk at the whole sex/drug scene, not to view the
>>>Rembrandts.
>
>
>>Have you got evidence for that? I find it really hard to believe!
>
>
> How many backpackers do you see in the Rijksmuseum? How many do you
> see in the hash bars?!
>
Don't know, maybe they leave the packs in the hotel. I just observe that
museums are full to bursting with visitors, all year.
>>>However, if it didn't have open prostitution and legal drugs, it would
>>>probably get about as many visitors as Brussels. 90% of Amsterdam's
>>>visitors are either there to take advantage of the legal pot and hash
>>>and hookers, or to gawk at the whole sex/drug scene, not to view the
>>>Rembrandts.
>
>
>>Have you got evidence for that? I find it really hard to believe!
>
>
> How many backpackers do you see in the Rijksmuseum? How many do you
> see in the hash bars?!
>
Don't know, maybe they leave the packs in the hotel. I just observe that
museums are full to bursting with visitors, all year.
Aug 26th 2005, 11:41 pm
#58
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
Iceman wrote:
> I've spent lots of time in Amsterdam, and the vast majority of younger
> travellers I met there were there for the drugs. You also see lots of
> stag parties, some sketchy-looking middle-aged men going in and out of
> sex shows and brothels, and then you see tour groups of older Americans
> and Germans walking around the Red Light District looking shocked.
>
> If it's not the drugs and sex, then why don't you explain why Amsterdam
> gets so many more visitors than say, Brussels?
>
Can you quote statistics to prove this? Brussells had been thronged with
tourists when I've been there.
> I've spent lots of time in Amsterdam, and the vast majority of younger
> travellers I met there were there for the drugs. You also see lots of
> stag parties, some sketchy-looking middle-aged men going in and out of
> sex shows and brothels, and then you see tour groups of older Americans
> and Germans walking around the Red Light District looking shocked.
>
> If it's not the drugs and sex, then why don't you explain why Amsterdam
> gets so many more visitors than say, Brussels?
>
Can you quote statistics to prove this? Brussells had been thronged with
tourists when I've been there.
Aug 26th 2005, 11:46 pm
#59
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
There are coffeeshops and hookers all over the country.
A bit like San Francisco then....
A bit like San Francisco then....
Aug 27th 2005, 12:01 am
#60
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Why Amsterdam is so cool
On Sat, 27 Aug 2005 00:27:59 +0000 (UTC), BB
<[email protected]> wrote:
>On Sat, 27 Aug 2005 17:28:54 -0500, [email protected] wrote:
>> DFM don't be so narrow minded as to think all americans are the way
>> you describe. some are many are not. many non-americans are just as
>> unware and less traveled. if you know your history as well and fully
>> as you like to infer you would know both the u.s.a. and the
>> netherlands were started by so called non-elites.
>Yes, but that was 200 years ago. Now we're all dumb, fat, defensive,
>humorless, and arrogant, and he's not the only one in this newsgroup
>convinced of that.
Except I have never said anything remotely like that.
>I'd killfill him, but he sometimes has interesting and occasionally
>insightful things to say.
I'll try to nuture my prejudices to meet your killfile criteria. :o)
--
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--
<[email protected]> wrote:
>On Sat, 27 Aug 2005 17:28:54 -0500, [email protected] wrote:
>> DFM don't be so narrow minded as to think all americans are the way
>> you describe. some are many are not. many non-americans are just as
>> unware and less traveled. if you know your history as well and fully
>> as you like to infer you would know both the u.s.a. and the
>> netherlands were started by so called non-elites.
>Yes, but that was 200 years ago. Now we're all dumb, fat, defensive,
>humorless, and arrogant, and he's not the only one in this newsgroup
>convinced of that.
Except I have never said anything remotely like that.
>I'd killfill him, but he sometimes has interesting and occasionally
>insightful things to say.
I'll try to nuture my prejudices to meet your killfile criteria. :o)
--
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--
