Smoke-free cruising
 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/main.jhtml;jsessionid²KXR24P3PVG5QFIQMFSFFWAVCB Q0IV0?xml=/travel/2007/08/14/et-smoking-cruises.xml

Smoke-free cruising

Last Updated: 12:01am BST 14/08/2007

Ex-smoker Jane Archer applauds the cruise companies which are banning
smoking on ships.

Have your say Read comments

I was delighted to hear last month that Royal Caribbean International
is changing its on-board smoking policy to stop passengers lighting up
in cabins.

Smoker watches cruise ship, smoke-free cruising
The fact is that smoking in a cabin can be dangerous

Now, before I go any further, I have to hold my hands up and admit I
used to be a smoker - a 20-a-day one.

But that is not the reason why I welcome Royal Caribbean's news. I
like to think I am a laissez-faire ex-smoker - happy to let those who
want to continue to kill themselves with cigarettes do so.

I support the July 1 smoking ban if it helps people stop, but have
never felt the need for government protection from smokers. If someone
lights up near me, I move away. Before July 1, if a restaurant didn't
have any no-smoking tables, I went to another.

But even in my hardened smoker days I would have drawn the line at
smoking in a cabin. It's not so much the odour cigarettes leave,
although I once had the misfortune to land a cabin smelling of stale
smoke on a ship operated by the now-defunct Festival Cruises.

It smelt so bad that I asked to be moved, but there were no empty
cabins. They sent the cabin steward to clean it, but his efforts were
so ineffectual that my daughter and I resorted to spraying it with my
perfume (luckily not an expensive brand) every time we went in. It
took three days to clear.

But the fact is that smoking in a cabin can be dangerous. Remember the
fire on Star Princess in 2006 in which one man died? It started on a
balcony, the work of a discarded cigarette butt.

If that can happen outside, how much faster can fire take hold inside,
where there are sheets, carpets, duvets and other flammable materials
waiting to go up in smoke?

There are notices in cabins alerting smokers to the dangers of
lighting up in bed but how can bed-smokers be monitored? (Royal
Caribbean, by the way, hopes the threat of extra cleaning charges will
enforce its no-smoking-in-cabins policy).

And anyway, you don't need to be in bed in a cabin for hot ash to land
on material and start to smoulder.

Given that the Star Princess fire started on a balcony, I was
surprised that Royal Caribbean's new smoking policy stopped short of
banning smoking on the balconies - dangers aside, smoke drifting from
one to another is a regular source of complaints.

I wasn't thrilled on a recent cruise to be in a cabin next to a smoker
who seemed to live on the balcony next to mine and spend the time when
he wasn't smoking coughing his guts up.

So congratulations to luxury operator Regent Seven Seas Cruises for
being much bolder. At the risk of losing business, from the end of the
year it is outlawing smoking in all cabins and balconies. Guests who
break the ban will be turfed off.

Fred Olsen Cruise Lines already has a ban on smoking on balconies;
Italian company MSC Cruises bans it in cabins.

>From March 2008, German river cruise operator Peter Deilmann's nine
river cruise ships will be smoke-free, although passengers will be
able to light up on the open decks.

Coincidentally, in 2008 Germany will be introducing a smoking ban. So
although Deilmann's move is to be welcomed, it probably has no choice
as the ships sail close to land and will likely come under the German
law.

The UK will soon be experiencing similar; the Merchant Shipping Act is
being amended to enforce a smoking ban on ships entering UK waters.

The Act is expected to come into play at the start of 2008 and will
probably be policed by the Maritime and Coastguard Agency (although
it's hard to see how). Crucially, it will mean that smoking will be
banned in public areas on all ships within 12 miles of a UK arrival or
departure point. Whether that includes cabins or not remains to be
seen.

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

Not again, another posting about smoking, when will it ever stop. Take a
closer look at the Star Princess incident, never proved it was a cigarette
only 'likekly to have been a cigarette'. What was on the balcony to make it
take hold so fast. How many passengers on ships over the last 10 yrs, how
many fires caused by cigs'?
What about alcohol, how many passengers have suffered injury or deaths
caused by themselves or others consuming alcohol.
I don't smoke but I don't rant and rave about smokers or drinkers.
The effects of smoke on non smokers (in most cases) appears to be over the
top, colourful and selective.
Don't believe all the tripe spouted about effects of smoke, never been
proved.
I wonder how long this subject/replies will continue before it dies.
Non smoker.
"Have a Safe & Gorgeous trip" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected] ps.com...
> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/ma...ng-cruises.xml
>
> Smoke-free cruising
>
> Last Updated: 12:01am BST 14/08/2007
>
> Ex-smoker Jane Archer applauds the cruise companies which are banning
> smoking on ships.
>
> Have your say Read comments
>
> I was delighted to hear last month that Royal Caribbean International
> is changing its on-board smoking policy to stop passengers lighting up
> in cabins.
>
> Smoker watches cruise ship, smoke-free cruising
> The fact is that smoking in a cabin can be dangerous
>
> Now, before I go any further, I have to hold my hands up and admit I
> used to be a smoker - a 20-a-day one.
>
> But that is not the reason why I welcome Royal Caribbean's news. I
> like to think I am a laissez-faire ex-smoker - happy to let those who
> want to continue to kill themselves with cigarettes do so.
>
> I support the July 1 smoking ban if it helps people stop, but have
> never felt the need for government protection from smokers. If someone
> lights up near me, I move away. Before July 1, if a restaurant didn't
> have any no-smoking tables, I went to another.
>
> But even in my hardened smoker days I would have drawn the line at
> smoking in a cabin. It's not so much the odour cigarettes leave,
> although I once had the misfortune to land a cabin smelling of stale
> smoke on a ship operated by the now-defunct Festival Cruises.
>
> It smelt so bad that I asked to be moved, but there were no empty
> cabins. They sent the cabin steward to clean it, but his efforts were
> so ineffectual that my daughter and I resorted to spraying it with my
> perfume (luckily not an expensive brand) every time we went in. It
> took three days to clear.
>
> But the fact is that smoking in a cabin can be dangerous. Remember the
> fire on Star Princess in 2006 in which one man died? It started on a
> balcony, the work of a discarded cigarette butt.
>
> If that can happen outside, how much faster can fire take hold inside,
> where there are sheets, carpets, duvets and other flammable materials
> waiting to go up in smoke?
>
> There are notices in cabins alerting smokers to the dangers of
> lighting up in bed but how can bed-smokers be monitored? (Royal
> Caribbean, by the way, hopes the threat of extra cleaning charges will
> enforce its no-smoking-in-cabins policy).
>
> And anyway, you don't need to be in bed in a cabin for hot ash to land
> on material and start to smoulder.
>
> Given that the Star Princess fire started on a balcony, I was
> surprised that Royal Caribbean's new smoking policy stopped short of
> banning smoking on the balconies - dangers aside, smoke drifting from
> one to another is a regular source of complaints.
>
> I wasn't thrilled on a recent cruise to be in a cabin next to a smoker
> who seemed to live on the balcony next to mine and spend the time when
> he wasn't smoking coughing his guts up.
>
> So congratulations to luxury operator Regent Seven Seas Cruises for
> being much bolder. At the risk of losing business, from the end of the
> year it is outlawing smoking in all cabins and balconies. Guests who
> break the ban will be turfed off.
>
> Fred Olsen Cruise Lines already has a ban on smoking on balconies;
> Italian company MSC Cruises bans it in cabins.
>
>>From March 2008, German river cruise operator Peter Deilmann's nine
> river cruise ships will be smoke-free, although passengers will be
> able to light up on the open decks.
>
> Coincidentally, in 2008 Germany will be introducing a smoking ban. So
> although Deilmann's move is to be welcomed, it probably has no choice
> as the ships sail close to land and will likely come under the German
> law.
>
> The UK will soon be experiencing similar; the Merchant Shipping Act is
> being amended to enforce a smoking ban on ships entering UK waters.
>
> The Act is expected to come into play at the start of 2008 and will
> probably be policed by the Maritime and Coastguard Agency (although
> it's hard to see how). Crucially, it will mean that smoking will be
> banned in public areas on all ships within 12 miles of a UK arrival or
> departure point. Whether that includes cabins or not remains to be
> seen.
>

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

"Have a Safe & Gorgeous trip" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected] ps.com...
> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/ma...ng-cruises.xml
>
> Smoke-free cruising
>
It appears that Princess, where the most serious problem first occurred, are
the one line that hasn't changed their smoking policy yet. I would have
thought they would be the first line to restrict the smoking areas,
especially in cabins.

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

On Wed, 15 Aug 2007 07:03:34 -0400, "Boomer" <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Have a Safe & Gorgeous trip" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected] ups.com...
>> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/ma...ng-cruises.xml
>>
>> Smoke-free cruising
>>
>It appears that Princess, where the most serious problem first occurred, are
>the one line that hasn't changed their smoking policy yet. I would have
>thought they would be the first line to restrict the smoking areas,
>especially in cabins.
>

Isn't smoking in cabins banned for safety reasons like it is on ferries?
--

Martin

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

On Wed, 15 Aug 2007 10:10:31 +0100, "Robert"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Not again, another posting about smoking, when will it ever stop. Take a
>closer look at the Star Princess incident, never proved it was a cigarette
>only 'likekly to have been a cigarette'. What was on the balcony to make it
>take hold so fast. [?]

It took 20 minutes to take hold. Not fast in fire terms.

Have you actually read the report?
http://www.maib.gov.uk/cms_resources...Synopsis%2Epdf

The answer to your question is there. There is no other suggestion as to what
might have started the fire.
--

Martin

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

"Martin" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Isn't smoking in cabins banned for safety reasons like it is on ferries?
> --
>
> Martin
>
Not on Princess - yet.

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

"Boomer" <[email protected]> wrote
> It appears that Princess, where the most serious problem first occurred,
> are the one line that hasn't changed their smoking policy yet. I would
> have thought they would be the first line to restrict the smoking areas,
> especially in cabins.

Princess is in the process of testing "non-smoking casino nights" on a
number of ships. I think you are going to see them tighten their smoking
restrictions sooner rather than later.


--
George Leppla http://www.CruiseMaster.com

January 20, 2008 - GGC2008 - http://cruisemaster.com/adventure.htm
June 5, 2008 9 nt from NJ - http://www.cruisemaster.com/explorer.htm
October 26, 2008 Sleazy 5 http://www.cruisemaster.com/sleazy5.htm

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

On 15 Aug, 11:10, "Robert"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> Not again, another posting about smoking, when will it ever stop. Take a
> closer look at the Star Princess incident, never proved it was a cigarette
> only 'likekly to have been a cigarette'. What was on the balcony to make it
> take hold so fast. How many passengers on ships over the last 10 yrs, how
> many fires caused by cigs'?
> What about alcohol, how many passengers have suffered injury or deaths
> caused by themselves or others consuming alcohol.
> I don't smoke but I don't rant and rave about smokers or drinkers.
> The effects of smoke on non smokers (in most cases) appears to be over the
> top, colourful and selective.
> Don't believe all the tripe spouted about effects of smoke, never been
> proved.
> I wonder how long this subject/replies will continue before it dies.
> Non smoker.
> "Have a Safe & Gorgeous trip" <[email protected]> wrote in messagenews:[email protected] glegroups.com...
>
> >http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/ma...�²KXR24P3PVG5...
>
> > Smoke-free cruising
>
> > Last Updated: 12:01am BST 14/08/2007
>
> > Ex-smoker Jane Archer applauds the cruise companies which are banning
> > smoking on ships.
>
> > Have your say Read comments
>
> > I was delighted to hear last month that Royal Caribbean International
> > is changing its on-board smoking policy to stop passengers lighting up
> > in cabins.
>
> > Smoker watches cruise ship, smoke-free cruising
> > The fact is that smoking in a cabin can be dangerous
>
> > Now, before I go any further, I have to hold my hands up and admit I
> > used to be a smoker - a 20-a-day one.
>
> > But that is not the reason why I welcome Royal Caribbean's news. I
> > like to think I am a laissez-faire ex-smoker - happy to let those who
> > want to continue to kill themselves with cigarettes do so.
>
> > I support the July 1 smoking ban if it helps people stop, but have
> > never felt the need for government protection from smokers. If someone
> > lights up near me, I move away. Before July 1, if a restaurant didn't
> > have any no-smoking tables, I went to another.
>
> > But even in my hardened smoker days I would have drawn the line at
> > smoking in a cabin. It's not so much the odour cigarettes leave,
> > although I once had the misfortune to land a cabin smelling of stale
> > smoke on a ship operated by the now-defunct Festival Cruises.
>
> > It smelt so bad that I asked to be moved, but there were no empty
> > cabins. They sent the cabin steward to clean it, but his efforts were
> > so ineffectual that my daughter and I resorted to spraying it with my
> > perfume (luckily not an expensive brand) every time we went in. It
> > took three days to clear.
>
> > But the fact is that smoking in a cabin can be dangerous. Remember the
> > fire on Star Princess in 2006 in which one man died? It started on a
> > balcony, the work of a discarded cigarette butt.
>
> > If that can happen outside, how much faster can fire take hold inside,
> > where there are sheets, carpets, duvets and other flammable materials
> > waiting to go up in smoke?
>
> > There are notices in cabins alerting smokers to the dangers of
> > lighting up in bed but how can bed-smokers be monitored? (Royal
> > Caribbean, by the way, hopes the threat of extra cleaning charges will
> > enforce its no-smoking-in-cabins policy).
>
> > And anyway, you don't need to be in bed in a cabin for hot ash to land
> > on material and start to smoulder.
>
> > Given that the Star Princess fire started on a balcony, I was
> > surprised that Royal Caribbean's new smoking policy stopped short of
> > banning smoking on the balconies - dangers aside, smoke drifting from
> > one to another is a regular source of complaints.
>
> > I wasn't thrilled on a recent cruise to be in a cabin next to a smoker
> > who seemed to live on the balcony next to mine and spend the time when
> > he wasn't smoking coughing his guts up.
>
> > So congratulations to luxury operator Regent Seven Seas Cruises for
> > being much bolder. At the risk of losing business, from the end of the
> > year it is outlawing smoking in all cabins and balconies. Guests who
> > break the ban will be turfed off.
>
> > Fred Olsen Cruise Lines already has a ban on smoking on balconies;
> > Italian company MSC Cruises bans it in cabins.
>
> >>From March 2008, German river cruise operator Peter Deilmann's nine
> > river cruise ships will be smoke-free, although passengers will be
> > able to light up on the open decks.
>
> > Coincidentally, in 2008 Germany will be introducing a smoking ban. So
> > although Deilmann's move is to be welcomed, it probably has no choice
> > as the ships sail close to land and will likely come under the German
> > law.
>
> > The UK will soon be experiencing similar; the Merchant Shipping Act is
> > being amended to enforce a smoking ban on ships entering UK waters.
>
> > The Act is expected to come into play at the start of 2008 and will
> > probably be policed by the Maritime and Coastguard Agency (although
> > it's hard to see how). Crucially, it will mean that smoking will be
> > banned in public areas on all ships within 12 miles of a UK arrival or
> > departure point. Whether that includes cabins or not remains to be
> > seen.

One person died in that incident.
Thats enough to ban smoking, isnt it ?

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

>One person died in that incident.
> Thats enough to ban smoking, isnt it ?


Using your argument;-
Seeing that people have sadly died on cruise ships in relation to them or
others consuming alcohol.
Thats enough to ban alcohol, isnt it?

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

On Wed, 15 Aug 2007 15:35:08 +0100, "Robert"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>>One person died in that incident.
>> Thats enough to ban smoking, isnt it ?
>
>
>Using your argument;-
>Seeing that people have sadly died on cruise ships in relation to them or
>others consuming alcohol.
>Thats enough to ban alcohol, isnt it?
>

Go ahead.
--

Martin

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

On 15 Aug, 16:35, "Robert"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> >One person died in that incident.
> > Thats enough to ban smoking, isnt it ?
>
> Using your argument;-
> Seeing that people have sadly died on cruise ships in relation to them or
> others consuming alcohol.
> Thats enough to ban alcohol, isnt it?

Alcohol damage is internal, fire is external.
I don't mind people killing themselves.

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

In article <[email protected] .com>,
Have a Safe & Gorgeous trip <[email protected]> wrote:

> On 15 Aug, 16:35, "Robert"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
> > >One person died in that incident.
> > > Thats enough to ban smoking, isnt it ?
> >
> > Using your argument;-
> > Seeing that people have sadly died on cruise ships in relation to them or
> > others consuming alcohol.
> > Thats enough to ban alcohol, isnt it?
>
> Alcohol damage is internal, fire is external.
> I don't mind people killing themselves.

Interestingly, most cigarette fires where people fall asleep and set
the place on fire are related to alcohol. Alcohol can enable you to do
really stupid things that also impact others. Fights on board. Falling
overboard and screwing the intinerary up for the rest of us while they
go back to look for the idiot, etc.

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

On 15 Aug, 17:37, Kurt Ullman <[email protected]> wrote:
> In article <[email protected] .com>,
> Have a Safe & Gorgeous trip <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > On 15 Aug, 16:35, "Robert"
> > <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > >One person died in that incident.
> > > > Thats enough to ban smoking, isnt it ?
>
> > > Using your argument;-
> > > Seeing that people have sadly died on cruise ships in relation to them or
> > > others consuming alcohol.
> > > Thats enough to ban alcohol, isnt it?
>
> > Alcohol damage is internal, fire is external.
> > I don't mind people killing themselves.
>
> Interestingly, most cigarette fires where people fall asleep and set
> the place on fire are related to alcohol. Alcohol can enable you to do
> really stupid things that also impact others. Fights on board. Falling
> overboard and screwing the intinerary up for the rest of us while they
> go back to look for the idiot, etc.

Yet, if they didnt smoke, none of those fires would get started.

I have not fallen overboard or started fights onboard, but then I
drink in moderation.

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

In article <[email protected]. com>,
Have a Safe & Gorgeous trip <[email protected]> wrote:


> Yet, if they didnt smoke, none of those fires would get started.
Yeah they'd just have to leave stuff on the stove, fire up the grill,
etc. After almost 10 years investigating fires, I can tell you that
alcohol leads to many fires even w/o the aid of cigs.

>
> I have not fallen overboard or started fights onboard, but then I
> drink in moderation.

Yet..(g)

Re: Smoke-free cruising
 

On Aug 15, 2:10 am, "Robert"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> Not again, another posting about smoking, when will it ever stop. Take a
> closer look at the Star Princess incident, never proved it was a cigarette
> only 'likekly to have been a cigarette'. What was on the balcony to make it
> take hold so fast. How many passengers on ships over the last 10 yrs, how
> many fires caused by cigs'?
> What about alcohol, how many passengers have suffered injury or deaths
> caused by themselves or others consuming alcohol.
> I don't smoke but I don't rant and rave about smokers or drinkers.
> The effects of smoke on non smokers (in most cases) appears to be over the
>

Smoking can cause a fire that could destroy many cabins and kill lots
of people on a very expensive ship. One person drinking and falling
overboard could cause his/her death and/or an inconvenience for the
rest of the passengers and crew; however nothing (or almost nothing)
will be destroyed. If you owned a cruise ship would you risk letting a
single person who smokes burning your investment to ruin and
subjecting you to millions of losses in law suites not to mention the
potential of the loss many lives of innocent people. Let's face it
smoking is dangerous....check out:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0807064005.htm

Study Shows Smoking Is A Leading Cause Of Fire Disaster And Death
Worldwide, Costing Over $27 Billion Yearly