Gastronomic Decadence revisited
#16
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The Reids <[email protected]> wrote:
> Following up to Ellie C
>
> >So my take on it all is that if you live in an affluent, cosmopolitan
> >area anywhere in the world you will have wonderful choices in
> >restaurants - it sort of goes with the definition, no? If you live in a
> >less affluent area, your best meals may well be the ones you cook at home.
>
> Choice of ethnic restaurant is one thing. Decent cooking is
> another. In Spain there is little non Spanish food anywhere,
> although in city areas you will get favoured non local regional
> cooking. But you get a convivial good meal with a bottle of wine
> and conversation late into the evening anywhere.
I did find it trivially easy to get good food in Spain, but the
accompaniments to meals often lacked imagination, at least at the
simpler restaurants. Specifically, we went to several otherwise
excellent fish restaurants where the only side order you could get with
it was french fries and a garlic laden tomato salad. Perfectly OK, but
we got a bit tired of it. It was also interesting that places that
boasted about their paella couldn't furnish you with a side dish of
plain boiled rice. This was in andalucia- on a recent trip to Barcelona
and environs, this was less of a problem.
David
--
David Horne- www.davidhorne.net
usenet (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk
> Following up to Ellie C
>
> >So my take on it all is that if you live in an affluent, cosmopolitan
> >area anywhere in the world you will have wonderful choices in
> >restaurants - it sort of goes with the definition, no? If you live in a
> >less affluent area, your best meals may well be the ones you cook at home.
>
> Choice of ethnic restaurant is one thing. Decent cooking is
> another. In Spain there is little non Spanish food anywhere,
> although in city areas you will get favoured non local regional
> cooking. But you get a convivial good meal with a bottle of wine
> and conversation late into the evening anywhere.
I did find it trivially easy to get good food in Spain, but the
accompaniments to meals often lacked imagination, at least at the
simpler restaurants. Specifically, we went to several otherwise
excellent fish restaurants where the only side order you could get with
it was french fries and a garlic laden tomato salad. Perfectly OK, but
we got a bit tired of it. It was also interesting that places that
boasted about their paella couldn't furnish you with a side dish of
plain boiled rice. This was in andalucia- on a recent trip to Barcelona
and environs, this was less of a problem.
David
--
David Horne- www.davidhorne.net
usenet (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk
#17
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Ellie C wrote:
> So my take on it all is that if you live in an affluent,
> cosmopolitan area anywhere in the world you will have wonderful
> choices in restaurants - it sort of goes with the definition, no?
> If you live in a less affluent area, your best meals may well be
> the ones you cook at home.
"Affluence" has absolutely nothing to do with being able to cook
and/or serve decent meals.
Nor does cosmopolitanism. That just increases the variety of choices.
__________________________________________________ ____________
A San Francisco glutton who says: "You serve it, I'll eat it!"
http://geocities.com/dancefest/ http://geocities.com/iconoc/
ICQ: http://wwp.mirabilis.com/19098103 IClast at SFbay Net
> So my take on it all is that if you live in an affluent,
> cosmopolitan area anywhere in the world you will have wonderful
> choices in restaurants - it sort of goes with the definition, no?
> If you live in a less affluent area, your best meals may well be
> the ones you cook at home.
"Affluence" has absolutely nothing to do with being able to cook
and/or serve decent meals.
Nor does cosmopolitanism. That just increases the variety of choices.
__________________________________________________ ____________
A San Francisco glutton who says: "You serve it, I'll eat it!"
http://geocities.com/dancefest/ http://geocities.com/iconoc/
ICQ: http://wwp.mirabilis.com/19098103 IClast at SFbay Net
#18
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Following up to chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn
>> I'm even more confused about american restaurants.
>It probably depends where you go. Earl's report simply doesn't conform
>with my own experience, but that wasn't in Arizona (though I'm sure
>there are plenty of fine restaurants there) I admit.
Just been to lunch with friend back from living in Texas, we had
a bit of a laugh discussing all this. We had a demo of US knife
and fork technique, weird! + confirmation that there are good
restaurants in Anchorage (I know that's not Texas).
One thing not mentioned here, which came as a shock, was that his
county of Texas only just stopped being dry, so you can now get a
glass of wine with a meal!!!!!! He also reports cheese very bland
and many fat people, but also many thin people. Also how much
Americans spend on excessive dentistry and resulting scary smiles
unlike good old euro crooked yellow teeth.
--
Mike Reid
Wasdale-Thames path-London-photos "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
Eat-walk-Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap
>> I'm even more confused about american restaurants.
>It probably depends where you go. Earl's report simply doesn't conform
>with my own experience, but that wasn't in Arizona (though I'm sure
>there are plenty of fine restaurants there) I admit.
Just been to lunch with friend back from living in Texas, we had
a bit of a laugh discussing all this. We had a demo of US knife
and fork technique, weird! + confirmation that there are good
restaurants in Anchorage (I know that's not Texas).
One thing not mentioned here, which came as a shock, was that his
county of Texas only just stopped being dry, so you can now get a
glass of wine with a meal!!!!!! He also reports cheese very bland
and many fat people, but also many thin people. Also how much
Americans spend on excessive dentistry and resulting scary smiles
unlike good old euro crooked yellow teeth.
--
Mike Reid
Wasdale-Thames path-London-photos "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
Eat-walk-Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap
#19
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On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 15:23:57 +0000, in rec.travel.europe, The Reids
<[email protected]> arranged some electrons, so they looked like this :
... Following up to chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn
...
... >> I'm even more confused about american restaurants.
... >
... >It probably depends where you go. Earl's report simply doesn't conform
... >with my own experience, but that wasn't in Arizona (though I'm sure
... >there are plenty of fine restaurants there) I admit.
...
... Just been to lunch with friend back from living in Texas, we had
... a bit of a laugh discussing all this. We had a demo of US knife
... and fork technique, weird! + confirmation that there are good
... restaurants in Anchorage (I know that's not Texas).
... One thing not mentioned here, which came as a shock, was that his
... county of Texas only just stopped being dry, so you can now get a
... glass of wine with a meal!!!!!! He also reports cheese very bland
... and many fat people, but also many thin people. Also how much
... Americans spend on excessive dentistry and resulting scary smiles
... unlike good old euro crooked yellow teeth.
The colour is *ivory*, my dear ! Egg shell if you like, but never ghostly white.
<[email protected]> arranged some electrons, so they looked like this :
... Following up to chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn
...
... >> I'm even more confused about american restaurants.
... >
... >It probably depends where you go. Earl's report simply doesn't conform
... >with my own experience, but that wasn't in Arizona (though I'm sure
... >there are plenty of fine restaurants there) I admit.
...
... Just been to lunch with friend back from living in Texas, we had
... a bit of a laugh discussing all this. We had a demo of US knife
... and fork technique, weird! + confirmation that there are good
... restaurants in Anchorage (I know that's not Texas).
... One thing not mentioned here, which came as a shock, was that his
... county of Texas only just stopped being dry, so you can now get a
... glass of wine with a meal!!!!!! He also reports cheese very bland
... and many fat people, but also many thin people. Also how much
... Americans spend on excessive dentistry and resulting scary smiles
... unlike good old euro crooked yellow teeth.
The colour is *ivory*, my dear ! Egg shell if you like, but never ghostly white.
#20
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"The Reids" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> One thing not mentioned here, which came as a shock, was that his
> county of Texas only just stopped being dry, so you can now get a
> glass of wine with a meal!!!!!!
It was only around 1980 that we went to one of the new towns in the
Hertfordshire area.
The bar service in the hotel was appalling - very slow, wrong drinks being
served, etc. We mentioned this and were told 'they're still learning'.
Apparently the town - Harlow or similar? - had been developed by one of the
chocolate quaker families who had built in many goodies for the incoming
population, but had kept out the pubs!
That year was the first year in which alcohol had been served!
Surreyman
news:[email protected]...
> One thing not mentioned here, which came as a shock, was that his
> county of Texas only just stopped being dry, so you can now get a
> glass of wine with a meal!!!!!!
It was only around 1980 that we went to one of the new towns in the
Hertfordshire area.
The bar service in the hotel was appalling - very slow, wrong drinks being
served, etc. We mentioned this and were told 'they're still learning'.
Apparently the town - Harlow or similar? - had been developed by one of the
chocolate quaker families who had built in many goodies for the incoming
population, but had kept out the pubs!
That year was the first year in which alcohol had been served!
Surreyman
#21
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On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 15:23:57 +0000, The Reids
<[email protected]> wrote:
> ... Also how much
>Americans spend on excessive dentistry and resulting scary smiles
>unlike good old euro crooked yellow teeth.
I've found that most Italians who can afford it are willing to spend
large amounts on their teeth. Maybe they don't straighten them as much
as Americans do (they're close, though!), but they certainly get
crowns and bridges and dental implants, at least as much as Americans
do.
--
Barbara Vaughan
My email address is my first initial followed by my surname at libero dot it
I answer travel questions only in the newsgroup
<[email protected]> wrote:
> ... Also how much
>Americans spend on excessive dentistry and resulting scary smiles
>unlike good old euro crooked yellow teeth.
I've found that most Italians who can afford it are willing to spend
large amounts on their teeth. Maybe they don't straighten them as much
as Americans do (they're close, though!), but they certainly get
crowns and bridges and dental implants, at least as much as Americans
do.
--
Barbara Vaughan
My email address is my first initial followed by my surname at libero dot it
I answer travel questions only in the newsgroup
#22
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"a.spencer3" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "The Reids" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > One thing not mentioned here, which came as a shock, was that his
> > county of Texas only just stopped being dry, so you can now get a
> > glass of wine with a meal!!!!!!
> It was only around 1980 that we went to one of the new towns in the
> Hertfordshire area.
> The bar service in the hotel was appalling - very slow, wrong drinks being
> served, etc. We mentioned this and were told 'they're still learning'.
> Apparently the town - Harlow or similar? - had been developed by one of
the
> chocolate quaker families who had built in many goodies for the incoming
> population, but had kept out the pubs!
> That year was the first year in which alcohol had been served!
And, of course, I can well remember the Sunday walk across the border from
Wales into the English pubs!
Surreyman
news:[email protected]...
> "The Reids" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > One thing not mentioned here, which came as a shock, was that his
> > county of Texas only just stopped being dry, so you can now get a
> > glass of wine with a meal!!!!!!
> It was only around 1980 that we went to one of the new towns in the
> Hertfordshire area.
> The bar service in the hotel was appalling - very slow, wrong drinks being
> served, etc. We mentioned this and were told 'they're still learning'.
> Apparently the town - Harlow or similar? - had been developed by one of
the
> chocolate quaker families who had built in many goodies for the incoming
> population, but had kept out the pubs!
> That year was the first year in which alcohol had been served!
And, of course, I can well remember the Sunday walk across the border from
Wales into the English pubs!
Surreyman
#23
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a.spencer3 <[email protected]> wrote:
[]
> And, of course, I can well remember the Sunday walk across the border from
> Wales into the English pubs!
Tough if you lived in, say, Llandudno though!
David
--
David Horne- www.davidhorne.net
usenet (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk
[]
> And, of course, I can well remember the Sunday walk across the border from
> Wales into the English pubs!
Tough if you lived in, say, Llandudno though!
David
--
David Horne- www.davidhorne.net
usenet (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk
#24
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On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 16:20:19 GMT, a.spencer3 wrote:
>> chocolate quaker families who had built in many goodies for the incoming
>> population, but had kept out the pubs!
>> That year was the first year in which alcohol had been served!
>
> And, of course, I can well remember the Sunday walk across the border from
> Wales into the English pubs!
I remember getting the bus from Swansea to Llanelli on a Sunday for a
drink. Back in 1978.
--
Tim C.
>> chocolate quaker families who had built in many goodies for the incoming
>> population, but had kept out the pubs!
>> That year was the first year in which alcohol had been served!
>
> And, of course, I can well remember the Sunday walk across the border from
> Wales into the English pubs!
I remember getting the bus from Swansea to Llanelli on a Sunday for a
drink. Back in 1978.
--
Tim C.
#25
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chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn wrote:
> The Reids <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>Following up to Ellie C
>>>So my take on it all is that if you live in an affluent, cosmopolitan
>>>area anywhere in the world you will have wonderful choices in
>>>restaurants - it sort of goes with the definition, no? If you live in a
>>>less affluent area, your best meals may well be the ones you cook at home.
>>Choice of ethnic restaurant is one thing. Decent cooking is
>>another. In Spain there is little non Spanish food anywhere,
>>although in city areas you will get favoured non local regional
>>cooking. But you get a convivial good meal with a bottle of wine
>>and conversation late into the evening anywhere.
>
>
> I did find it trivially easy to get good food in Spain, but the
> accompaniments to meals often lacked imagination, at least at the
> simpler restaurants. Specifically, we went to several otherwise
> excellent fish restaurants where the only side order you could get with
> it was french fries and a garlic laden tomato salad. Perfectly OK, but
> we got a bit tired of it. It was also interesting that places that
> boasted about their paella couldn't furnish you with a side dish of
> plain boiled rice. This was in andalucia- on a recent trip to Barcelona
> and environs, this was less of a problem.
>
> David
>
If you happen to find yourself near Ronda try a place called
Tragabuches. It was great as well as imaginative. Mostly derivative od
Spanish food but done with a good bit of creativity.
> The Reids <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>Following up to Ellie C
>>>So my take on it all is that if you live in an affluent, cosmopolitan
>>>area anywhere in the world you will have wonderful choices in
>>>restaurants - it sort of goes with the definition, no? If you live in a
>>>less affluent area, your best meals may well be the ones you cook at home.
>>Choice of ethnic restaurant is one thing. Decent cooking is
>>another. In Spain there is little non Spanish food anywhere,
>>although in city areas you will get favoured non local regional
>>cooking. But you get a convivial good meal with a bottle of wine
>>and conversation late into the evening anywhere.
>
>
> I did find it trivially easy to get good food in Spain, but the
> accompaniments to meals often lacked imagination, at least at the
> simpler restaurants. Specifically, we went to several otherwise
> excellent fish restaurants where the only side order you could get with
> it was french fries and a garlic laden tomato salad. Perfectly OK, but
> we got a bit tired of it. It was also interesting that places that
> boasted about their paella couldn't furnish you with a side dish of
> plain boiled rice. This was in andalucia- on a recent trip to Barcelona
> and environs, this was less of a problem.
>
> David
>
If you happen to find yourself near Ronda try a place called
Tragabuches. It was great as well as imaginative. Mostly derivative od
Spanish food but done with a good bit of creativity.
#26
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Frank F. Matthews <[email protected]> wrote:
[]
> If you happen to find yourself near Ronda try a place called
> Tragabuches. It was great as well as imaginative. Mostly derivative od
> Spanish food but done with a good bit of creativity.
Did it have sides other than fries? :)
David
--
David Horne- www.davidhorne.net
usenet (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk
[]
> If you happen to find yourself near Ronda try a place called
> Tragabuches. It was great as well as imaginative. Mostly derivative od
> Spanish food but done with a good bit of creativity.
Did it have sides other than fries? :)
David
--
David Horne- www.davidhorne.net
usenet (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk
#27
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"chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn"
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:1gncqve.zfh09k385tp0N%this_address_is_for_spa [email protected]...
> a.spencer3 <[email protected]> wrote:
> []
> > And, of course, I can well remember the Sunday walk across the border
from
> > Wales into the English pubs!
> Tough if you lived in, say, Llandudno though!
My relatives were in Pengam - split in two by the border. Over the bridge
and off you went!
Surreyman
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:1gncqve.zfh09k385tp0N%this_address_is_for_spa [email protected]...
> a.spencer3 <[email protected]> wrote:
> []
> > And, of course, I can well remember the Sunday walk across the border
from
> > Wales into the English pubs!
> Tough if you lived in, say, Llandudno though!
My relatives were in Pengam - split in two by the border. Over the bridge
and off you went!
Surreyman
#28
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"Frank F. Matthews" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:a%[email protected]...
> chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn wrote:
> > The Reids <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Following up to Ellie C
> >>
> >>
> >>>So my take on it all is that if you live in an affluent, cosmopolitan
> >>>area anywhere in the world you will have wonderful choices in
> >>>restaurants - it sort of goes with the definition, no? If you live in a
> >>>less affluent area, your best meals may well be the ones you cook at
home.
> >>
> >>Choice of ethnic restaurant is one thing. Decent cooking is
> >>another. In Spain there is little non Spanish food anywhere,
> >>although in city areas you will get favoured non local regional
> >>cooking. But you get a convivial good meal with a bottle of wine
> >>and conversation late into the evening anywhere.
> >
> >
> > I did find it trivially easy to get good food in Spain, but the
> > accompaniments to meals often lacked imagination, at least at the
> > simpler restaurants. Specifically, we went to several otherwise
> > excellent fish restaurants where the only side order you could get with
> > it was french fries and a garlic laden tomato salad. Perfectly OK, but
> > we got a bit tired of it. It was also interesting that places that
> > boasted about their paella couldn't furnish you with a side dish of
> > plain boiled rice. This was in andalucia- on a recent trip to Barcelona
> > and environs, this was less of a problem.
> >
> > David
> >
> If you happen to find yourself near Ronda try a place called
> Tragabuches. It was great as well as imaginative. Mostly derivative od
> Spanish food but done with a good bit of creativity.
D'you mean Rhondda? :-))
Surreyman
news:a%[email protected]...
> chancellor of the duchy of besses o' th' barn wrote:
> > The Reids <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Following up to Ellie C
> >>
> >>
> >>>So my take on it all is that if you live in an affluent, cosmopolitan
> >>>area anywhere in the world you will have wonderful choices in
> >>>restaurants - it sort of goes with the definition, no? If you live in a
> >>>less affluent area, your best meals may well be the ones you cook at
home.
> >>
> >>Choice of ethnic restaurant is one thing. Decent cooking is
> >>another. In Spain there is little non Spanish food anywhere,
> >>although in city areas you will get favoured non local regional
> >>cooking. But you get a convivial good meal with a bottle of wine
> >>and conversation late into the evening anywhere.
> >
> >
> > I did find it trivially easy to get good food in Spain, but the
> > accompaniments to meals often lacked imagination, at least at the
> > simpler restaurants. Specifically, we went to several otherwise
> > excellent fish restaurants where the only side order you could get with
> > it was french fries and a garlic laden tomato salad. Perfectly OK, but
> > we got a bit tired of it. It was also interesting that places that
> > boasted about their paella couldn't furnish you with a side dish of
> > plain boiled rice. This was in andalucia- on a recent trip to Barcelona
> > and environs, this was less of a problem.
> >
> > David
> >
> If you happen to find yourself near Ronda try a place called
> Tragabuches. It was great as well as imaginative. Mostly derivative od
> Spanish food but done with a good bit of creativity.
D'you mean Rhondda? :-))
Surreyman
#29
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In article <1gnb7t3.qz35541h5sb9cN%this_address_is_for_spam@y ahoo.com>,
[email protected] (chancellor of the duchy of besses o'
th' barn) wrote:
> The Reids <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Following up to Earl Evleth
> >
> > >Finally, drinks? Since many medium price restaurants will not have
> > wine, or
> > >even beer, one is forced to drink other stuff.
> >
> > >Basically, when it comes to eating, visiting America is a sort of
> > ordeal.
> >
> > I'm even more confused about american restaurants.
>
> It probably depends where you go.
I think it does. From my experience of the US (which in terms of numbers
of restaurants dined in is pretty much evenly spread around the
continental 48), and leaving out the fact that the best -- in the sense of
the most perfect, impossible-to-fault -- meal I /ever/ had was in
Charleston, I would say that if we could give percentage marks to
restaurants:
You find more under-50%s in Europe.
You find about the same number of 50-75%s on both sides of the Atlantic.
You find a few more 75-90%s in Europe.
You find about the same number of 90-100%s on both sides of the Atlantic.
[email protected] (chancellor of the duchy of besses o'
th' barn) wrote:
> The Reids <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Following up to Earl Evleth
> >
> > >Finally, drinks? Since many medium price restaurants will not have
> > wine, or
> > >even beer, one is forced to drink other stuff.
> >
> > >Basically, when it comes to eating, visiting America is a sort of
> > ordeal.
> >
> > I'm even more confused about american restaurants.
>
> It probably depends where you go.
I think it does. From my experience of the US (which in terms of numbers
of restaurants dined in is pretty much evenly spread around the
continental 48), and leaving out the fact that the best -- in the sense of
the most perfect, impossible-to-fault -- meal I /ever/ had was in
Charleston, I would say that if we could give percentage marks to
restaurants:
You find more under-50%s in Europe.
You find about the same number of 50-75%s on both sides of the Atlantic.
You find a few more 75-90%s in Europe.
You find about the same number of 90-100%s on both sides of the Atlantic.
#30
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<[email protected]> wrote:
> In article <1gnb7t3.qz35541h5sb9cN%this_address_is_for_spam@y ahoo.com>,
> [email protected] (chancellor of the duchy of besses o'
> th' barn) wrote:
>
> > The Reids <[email protected]> wrote:
[]
> > > I'm even more confused about american restaurants.
> >
> > It probably depends where you go.
>
> I think it does. From my experience of the US (which in terms of numbers
> of restaurants dined in is pretty much evenly spread around the
> continental 48), and leaving out the fact that the best -- in the sense of
> the most perfect, impossible-to-fault -- meal I /ever/ had was in
> Charleston, I would say that if we could give percentage marks to
> restaurants:
>
> You find more under-50%s in Europe.
> You find about the same number of 50-75%s on both sides of the Atlantic.
> You find a few more 75-90%s in Europe.
> You find about the same number of 90-100%s on both sides of the Atlantic.
While it's difficult to be scientific, I pretty much agree with that.
--
David Horne- www.davidhorne.net
usenet (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk
> In article <1gnb7t3.qz35541h5sb9cN%this_address_is_for_spam@y ahoo.com>,
> [email protected] (chancellor of the duchy of besses o'
> th' barn) wrote:
>
> > The Reids <[email protected]> wrote:
[]
> > > I'm even more confused about american restaurants.
> >
> > It probably depends where you go.
>
> I think it does. From my experience of the US (which in terms of numbers
> of restaurants dined in is pretty much evenly spread around the
> continental 48), and leaving out the fact that the best -- in the sense of
> the most perfect, impossible-to-fault -- meal I /ever/ had was in
> Charleston, I would say that if we could give percentage marks to
> restaurants:
>
> You find more under-50%s in Europe.
> You find about the same number of 50-75%s on both sides of the Atlantic.
> You find a few more 75-90%s in Europe.
> You find about the same number of 90-100%s on both sides of the Atlantic.
While it's difficult to be scientific, I pretty much agree with that.
--
David Horne- www.davidhorne.net
usenet (at) davidhorne (dot) co (dot) uk