Go Back  British Expats > Usenet Groups > rec.travel.* > rec.travel.europe
Reload this Page >

Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

Old Oct 12th 2004, 8:22 am
  #16  
Hatunen
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 21:18:55 +0200, MÃ¥rten Trolin
<[email protected]> wrote:

    >Gerald Oliver Swift wrote:
    >> Montenegro, strictly speaking, is a non-Euro country - how can it be if it's
    >> not even in the EU (unlike Afghanistan which is shortly to join) - yet
    >> Monty's OFFICIAL currency is the Euro.
    >> Has the world (Europe) gone mad?
    >And Montenegro is not the only example of a non-EU country using euro as
    >the official currency. So do the Vatican, San Marino, Andorra and Monaco.

OK. So what is it? Non-EU countries or non-euro countries?

************* DAVE HATUNEN ([email protected]) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
 
Old Oct 12th 2004, 9:02 am
  #17  
Hatunen
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 21:17:15 GMT, "Frank F. Matthews"
<[email protected]> wrote:

    >Markku Grönroos wrote:
    >> "Gerald Oliver Swift" <[email protected]> kirjoitti viestissä
    >> news:[email protected]...
    >>
    >>>"Markku Grönroos" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>>news:[email protected]...
    >>>>"tile" <[email protected]> kirjoitti viestissä
    >>>>news:[email protected] t...
    >>>>>then use eur without changing them.
    >>>>>people will take them for sure..
    >>>>Vendors in non Euro countries typically do not accept euros as payment.
    >>
    >>>>In Estonia one pays by Estonian money.
    >>>Not true actally.
    >>>
    >> Yes, it actually is quite true. Flawless.

    >They are taking issue with your broad statement about all non Euro
    >countries not about Estonia.

And totally ignoring the word "typically"

************* DAVE HATUNEN ([email protected]) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
 
Old Oct 12th 2004, 9:17 am
  #18  
Frank F. Matthews
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

They are taking issue with your broad statement about all non Euro
countries not about Estonia.

Markku Grönroos wrote:

    > "Gerald Oliver Swift" <[email protected]> kirjoitti viestissä
    > news:[email protected]...
    >
    >>"Markku Grönroos" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>news:[email protected]...
    >>>"tile" <[email protected]> kirjoitti viestissä
    >>>news:[email protected] ...
    >>>>then use eur without changing them.
    >>>>people will take them for sure..
    >>>Vendors in non Euro countries typically do not accept euros as payment.
    >
    > In
    >
    >>>Estonia one pays by Estonian money.
    >>Not true actally.
    >
    > Yes, it actually is quite true. Flawless.
    >
    >
 
Old Oct 12th 2004, 9:52 am
  #19  
Hatunen
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

On 12 Oct 2004 16:17:22 -0600, [email protected] (Bill
Moore) wrote:

    >In article <[email protected]>,
    >Hatunen <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 21:17:15 GMT, "Frank F. Matthews"
    >><[email protected]> wrote:
    >>>Markku Grönroos wrote:
    >>>> "Gerald Oliver Swift" <[email protected]> kirjoitti viestissä
    >>>> news:[email protected]...
    >>>>
    >>>>>"Markku Grönroos" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>>>>news:[email protected]...
    >>>>>>"tile" <[email protected]> kirjoitti viestissä
    >>>>>>news:[email protected] .it...
    >>>>>>>then use eur without changing them.
    >>>>>>>people will take them for sure..
    >>>>>>Vendors in non Euro countries typically do not accept euros as payment.
    >>>>
    >>>>>>In Estonia one pays by Estonian money.
    >>>>>Not true actally.
    >>>>>
    >>>> Yes, it actually is quite true. Flawless.
    >>>They are taking issue with your broad statement about all non Euro
    >>>countries not about Estonia.
    >>And totally ignoring the word "typically"
    >Non-euro countries that previously used currencies of countries
    >that now use the Euro, one might suspect, are now using the Euro.
    >For example, Montenegro previously used the German mark. Now it
    >uses the Euro.
    >http://europa.eu.int/comm/economy_fi...world_4_en.htm
    >Tiny countries like the Vatican and Monaco also use the Euro.

It's the "euro", not the "Euro"

************* DAVE HATUNEN ([email protected]) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
 
Old Oct 12th 2004, 10:17 am
  #20  
Bill Moore
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

In article <[email protected]>,
Hatunen <[email protected]> wrote:
    >On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 21:17:15 GMT, "Frank F. Matthews"
    ><[email protected]> wrote:
    >>Markku Grönroos wrote:
    >>> "Gerald Oliver Swift" <[email protected]> kirjoitti viestissä
    >>> news:[email protected]...
    >>>
    >>>>"Markku Grönroos" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>>>news:[email protected]...
    >>>>>"tile" <[email protected]> kirjoitti viestissä
    >>>>>news:[email protected]. it...
    >>>>>>then use eur without changing them.
    >>>>>>people will take them for sure..
    >>>>>Vendors in non Euro countries typically do not accept euros as payment.
    >>>
    >>>>>In Estonia one pays by Estonian money.
    >>>>Not true actally.
    >>>>
    >>> Yes, it actually is quite true. Flawless.
    >>They are taking issue with your broad statement about all non Euro
    >>countries not about Estonia.
    >And totally ignoring the word "typically"

Non-euro countries that previously used currencies of countries
that now use the Euro, one might suspect, are now using the Euro.

For example, Montenegro previously used the German mark. Now it
uses the Euro.

http://europa.eu.int/comm/economy_fi...world_4_en.htm

Tiny countries like the Vatican and Monaco also use the Euro.
 
Old Oct 12th 2004, 10:56 am
  #21  
Bill Moore
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

In article <[email protected]>,
Hatunen <[email protected]> wrote:
    >On 12 Oct 2004 16:17:22 -0600, [email protected] (Bill
    >Moore) wrote:
    >>In article <[email protected]>,
    >>Hatunen <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>>On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 21:17:15 GMT, "Frank F. Matthews"
    >>><[email protected]> wrote:
    >>>>Markku Grönroos wrote:
    >>>>> "Gerald Oliver Swift" <[email protected]> kirjoitti viestissä
    >>>>> news:[email protected]...
    >>>>>
    >>>>>>"Markku Grönroos" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>>>>>news:[email protected]...
    >>>>>>>"tile" <[email protected]> kirjoitti viestissä
    >>>>>>>news:[email protected] o.it...
    >>>>>>>>then use eur without changing them.
    >>>>>>>>people will take them for sure..
    >>>>>>>Vendors in non Euro countries typically do not accept euros as payment.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>>>In Estonia one pays by Estonian money.
    >>>>>>Not true actally.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>> Yes, it actually is quite true. Flawless.
    >>>>They are taking issue with your broad statement about all non Euro
    >>>>countries not about Estonia.
    >>>And totally ignoring the word "typically"
    >>Non-euro countries that previously used currencies of countries
    >>that now use the Euro, one might suspect, are now using the Euro.
    >>For example, Montenegro previously used the German mark. Now it
    >>uses the Euro.
    >>http://europa.eu.int/comm/economy_fi...world_4_en.htm
    >>Tiny countries like the Vatican and Monaco also use the Euro.
    >It's the "euro", not the "Euro"

It was an intentional typo ;-)
 
Old Oct 12th 2004, 6:10 pm
  #22  
Tile
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

Vatican and san marino have their own euro coins.
monaco made two issues. but now no more yearly coins issue.
Vatican and San marino are not in the EU and not in the Euro zone.
still they have preferential agreemnts with Italy
whereby they can have their own coins and stamps.
"Bill Moore" <[email protected]> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:[email protected]...
    > In article <[email protected]>,
    > Hatunen <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 21:17:15 GMT, "Frank F. Matthews"
    > ><[email protected]> wrote:
    > >
    > >>
    > >>Markku Grönroos wrote:
    > >>
    > >>> "Gerald Oliver Swift" <[email protected]> kirjoitti viestissä
    > >>> news:[email protected]...
    > >>>
    > >>>>"Markku Grönroos" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > >>>>news:[email protected]...
    > >>>>
    > >>>>>"tile" <[email protected]> kirjoitti viestissä
    > >>>>>news:[email protected]. it...
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>>>then use eur without changing them.
    > >>>>>>people will take them for sure..
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>>Vendors in non Euro countries typically do not accept euros as
payment.
    > >>>
    > >>>>>In Estonia one pays by Estonian money.
    > >>>>>
    > >>>>Not true actally.
    > >>>>
    > >>> Yes, it actually is quite true. Flawless.
    > >
    > >>They are taking issue with your broad statement about all non Euro
    > >>countries not about Estonia.
    > >
    > >And totally ignoring the word "typically"
    > Non-euro countries that previously used currencies of countries
    > that now use the Euro, one might suspect, are now using the Euro.
    > For example, Montenegro previously used the German mark. Now it
    > uses the Euro.
    > http://europa.eu.int/comm/economy_fi...world_4_en.htm
    > Tiny countries like the Vatican and Monaco also use the Euro.
 
Old Oct 12th 2004, 6:35 pm
  #23  
Gerald Oliver Swift
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

"Hatunen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

    >>> Vendors in non Euro countries typically do not accept euros as payment.
    >>> In Estonia one pays by Estonian money.

I agree partly with your second point but not with your first.
It is my personal experience that many establishments in Estonia (and also
in several other non-euro countries such as Hungary, Czech Rep, Slovenia,
Croatia, etc.) will also accept payment in euros - albeit, usually, at a
slightly less favourable exchange rate.

    >And isn't Montenegro in fact, then, not a non-euro country?

The point I was trying to make about Montenegro was simply that:- many of
the 25 EU countries do not use the euro but in Montenegro you have an
example of a non-EU country which does use the euro. So where does that
leave the EU / euro debate?

Regards
Gerry
 
Old Oct 13th 2004, 3:34 am
  #24  
Hatunen
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 07:35:00 +0100, "Gerald Oliver Swift"
<[email protected]> wrote:

    >"Hatunen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected].. .
    >>>> Vendors in non Euro countries typically do not accept euros as payment.
    >>>> In Estonia one pays by Estonian money.
    >I agree partly with your second point but not with your first.

They weren't my points.

    >It is my personal experience that many establishments in Estonia (and also
    >in several other non-euro countries such as Hungary, Czech Rep, Slovenia,
    >Croatia, etc.) will also accept payment in euros - albeit, usually, at a
    >slightly less favourable exchange rate.

How slightly? Less favorable than what, since there's no exchange
rate on using kroon?

    >>And isn't Montenegro in fact, then, not a non-euro country?
    >The point I was trying to make about Montenegro was simply that:- many of
    >the 25 EU countries do not use the euro but in Montenegro you have an
    >example of a non-EU country which does use the euro. So where does that
    >leave the EU / euro debate?

I don't believe it was a EU/euro debate. I took the phrase
"non-Euro country -how can it be if it's not even in the EU ...?"
to mean that a non-Euro country was one not using the euro as its
monetary unit, which is why I tried to distinguish between "euro"
and "Euro" for the montetary unit; the phrase would have been
less ambiguous if it hsd said "non-euro coutnry".

In any case, there are quite a few countries that use another's
currency as their own. Ecuador, for instance, uses the US dollar
as its currency.

Not to be confused, of course, by examples such as Panama where
the currency is the balboa, but it is defined as equal to a US
dollar so the dollar ciruculates freely.

************* DAVE HATUNEN ([email protected]) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
 
Old Oct 13th 2004, 7:03 am
  #25  
Hatunen
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 20:28:26 +0100, "Gerald Oliver Swift"
<[email protected]> wrote:

    >"Hatunen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >news:[email protected].. .
    >> They weren't my points.
    >Well, whatever.
    >>>It is my personal experience that many establishments in Estonia (and also
    >>>in several other non-euro countries such as Hungary, Czech Rep, Slovenia,
    >>>Croatia, etc.) will also accept payment in euros - albeit, usually, at a
    >>>slightly less favourable exchange rate.
    >> How slightly? Less favorable than what, since there's no exchange
    >> rate on using kroon?
    >Oh yes there is, bubi:-
    >27 June 2004 - Estonian kroon included in the Exchange Rate Mechanism II
    >(ERM II)
    >At the request of the Estonian authorities, the ministers of the euro area
    >Member States of the European Union, the President of the European Central
    >Bank and the ministers and the central bank governors of Denmark and Estonia
    >have decided, by mutual agreement, following a common procedure involving
    >the European Commission and after consultation of the Economic and Financial
    >Committee, to include the Estonian kroon in the Exchange Rate Mechanism II
    >(ERM II).
    >The central rate of the Estonian kroon is set at 1 euro = 15.6466 kroon.

uh, there is no exchange rate when using kroon in Estonia. There
is an exchange rate when using euros in Estonia.

I think we have several different questions being confounded here
and we are losing sight of the original source of my comments:
"In Estonia one pays by Estonian money."

[...]

    >> Not to be confused, of course, by examples such as Panama where
    >> the currency is the balboa, but it is defined as equal to a US
    >> dollar so the dollar ciruculates freely.
    >You ever seen a balboa, bubi? Nobody in Panama has - not for a long time.


The balboa is still the official currency.


************* DAVE HATUNEN ([email protected]) *************
* Tucson Arizona, out where the cacti grow *
* My typos & mispellings are intentional copyright traps *
 
Old Oct 13th 2004, 7:28 am
  #26  
Gerald Oliver Swift
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

"Hatunen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

    > They weren't my points.

Well, whatever.

    >>It is my personal experience that many establishments in Estonia (and also
    >>in several other non-euro countries such as Hungary, Czech Rep, Slovenia,
    >>Croatia, etc.) will also accept payment in euros - albeit, usually, at a
    >>slightly less favourable exchange rate.
    > How slightly? Less favorable than what, since there's no exchange
    > rate on using kroon?

Oh yes there is, bubi:-
27 June 2004 - Estonian kroon included in the Exchange Rate Mechanism II
(ERM II)
At the request of the Estonian authorities, the ministers of the euro area
Member States of the European Union, the President of the European Central
Bank and the ministers and the central bank governors of Denmark and Estonia
have decided, by mutual agreement, following a common procedure involving
the European Commission and after consultation of the Economic and Financial
Committee, to include the Estonian kroon in the Exchange Rate Mechanism II
(ERM II).

The central rate of the Estonian kroon is set at 1 euro = 15.6466 kroon.


    >>>And isn't Montenegro in fact, then, not a non-euro country?


    >>The point I was trying to make about Montenegro was simply that:- many
    >>of
    >>the 25 EU countries do not use the euro but in Montenegro you have an
    >>example of a non-EU country which does use the euro. So where does that
    >>leave the EU / euro debate?


    > In any case, there are quite a few countries that use another's
    > currency as their own. Ecuador, for instance, uses the US dollar
    > as its currency.


Hey bubi, I was in Ecuador when 100 sucres bought you 5 daiquiris.
So now they trade their bananas in dollars. Big deal.


    > Not to be confused, of course, by examples such as Panama where
    > the currency is the balboa, but it is defined as equal to a US
    > dollar so the dollar ciruculates freely.

You ever seen a balboa, bubi? Nobody in Panama has - not for a long time.

Gerry
 
Old Oct 13th 2004, 8:43 am
  #27  
Gerald Oliver Swift
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

"Hatunen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

    >>> Not to be confused, of course, by examples such as Panama where
    >>> the currency is the balboa, but it is defined as equal to a US
    >>> dollar so the dollar ciruculates freely.
    >>You ever seen a balboa, bubi? Nobody in Panama has - not for a long
    >>time.
    > The balboa is still the official currency.

Sure, like the metical is the official currency in Mozambique - except the
government stopped printing them about 20 years ago.

Get out of your books, bubi and get into the real world.
 
Old Oct 13th 2004, 5:39 pm
  #28  
Tile
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Baltic States: Tour or Independent?

I have seen a silver coin Balboa at least 30 years ago.
a friend from panama told me you cannot ind them anymore.
they use dollars there.
"Gerald Oliver Swift" <[email protected]> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:[email protected]...
    > "Hatunen" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > >>> Not to be confused, of course, by examples such as Panama where
    > >>> the currency is the balboa, but it is defined as equal to a US
    > >>> dollar so the dollar ciruculates freely.
    > >>
    > >>You ever seen a balboa, bubi? Nobody in Panama has - not for a long
    > >>time.
    > >
    > > The balboa is still the official currency.
    > Sure, like the metical is the official currency in Mozambique - except the
    > government stopped printing them about 20 years ago.
    > Get out of your books, bubi and get into the real world.
 

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Contact Us - Manage Preferences Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Your Privacy Choices -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.