Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
Oct 3rd 2004, 3:02 pm
#1
Guest
Posts: n/a
Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
I was looking at
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't English
news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do the
same same thing?
It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs Wien,
Munich vs Munchen...
dennis
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't English
news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do the
same same thing?
It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs Wien,
Munich vs Munchen...
dennis
Oct 3rd 2004, 4:11 pm
#2
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
"Dennis G. Rears" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]. ..
> I was looking at
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
> as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
> mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
> those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't
English
> news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do the
> same same thing?
> It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs Wien,
> Munich vs Munchen...
Whales vs Cymru ....
news:[email protected]. ..
> I was looking at
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
> as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
> mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
> those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't
English
> news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do the
> same same thing?
> It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs Wien,
> Munich vs Munchen...
Whales vs Cymru ....
Oct 3rd 2004, 4:20 pm
#3
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
"Miss L. Toe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Dennis G. Rears" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]. ..
> > I was looking at
> >
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
> > as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
> > mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
> > those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't
> English
> > news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do
the
> > same same thing?
> > It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs
Wien,
> > Munich vs Munchen...
> >
> Whales vs Cymru ....
I don't speak Irish/Gaelic/Scottish?...
news:[email protected]...
> "Dennis G. Rears" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]. ..
> > I was looking at
> >
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
> > as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
> > mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
> > those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't
> English
> > news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do
the
> > same same thing?
> > It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs
Wien,
> > Munich vs Munchen...
> >
> Whales vs Cymru ....
I don't speak Irish/Gaelic/Scottish?...
Oct 3rd 2004, 9:54 pm
#4
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
Dennis G. Rears wrote:
> I was looking at
> http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
> as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
> mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
> those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein.
There most definitely is a Dam Square. It's where the royal palace is.
Dam Square and Museumplein are two different places.
> I was looking at
> http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
> as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
> mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
> those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein.
There most definitely is a Dam Square. It's where the royal palace is.
Dam Square and Museumplein are two different places.
Oct 3rd 2004, 9:58 pm
#5
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
On Mon, 4 Oct 2004 09:54:07 +0000 (UTC), Mike O'Sullivan
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Dennis G. Rears wrote:
>> I was looking at
>> http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
>> as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
>> mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
>> those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein.
>There most definitely is a Dam Square. It's where the royal palace is.
>Dam Square and Museumplein are two different places.
Yes but locally it's called "Dam" not "Dam square"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>Dennis G. Rears wrote:
>> I was looking at
>> http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
>> as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
>> mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
>> those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein.
>There most definitely is a Dam Square. It's where the royal palace is.
>Dam Square and Museumplein are two different places.
Yes but locally it's called "Dam" not "Dam square"
Oct 4th 2004, 12:57 am
#6
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
In message <sE88d.42$y%[email protected]>, a.spencer3
<[email protected]> writes
>"Miss L. Toe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> "Dennis G. Rears" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]. ..
>> > I was looking at
>> >
>http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu...otest.ap/index.
>html
>> > as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
>> > mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
>> > those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't
>> English
>> > news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do
>the
>> > same same thing?
>> > It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs
>Wien,
>> > Munich vs Munchen...
>> >
>> Whales vs Cymru ....
>Is 'Cymru' Welsh for 'whales'?
Morfilion
--
Arwel Parry
http://www.cartref.demon.co.uk/
<[email protected]> writes
>"Miss L. Toe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>> "Dennis G. Rears" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]. ..
>> > I was looking at
>> >
>http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu...otest.ap/index.
>html
>> > as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
>> > mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
>> > those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't
>> English
>> > news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do
>the
>> > same same thing?
>> > It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs
>Wien,
>> > Munich vs Munchen...
>> >
>> Whales vs Cymru ....
>Is 'Cymru' Welsh for 'whales'?
Morfilion
--
Arwel Parry
http://www.cartref.demon.co.uk/
Oct 4th 2004, 1:01 am
#7
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
In message <[email protected]>, Dennis G.
Rears <[email protected]> writes
> I was looking at
>http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....protest.ap/in
>dex.html
>as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
>mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
>those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't English
>news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do the
>same same thing?
Of course they do. Most English speakers wouldn't know what sort of
urban feature "Museum Plein" is (though East Anglians might, as they've
got Bank Plain and University Plain in Norwich).
> It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs Wien,
>Munich vs Munchen...
That's because we don't speak Russian or German.
--
Arwel Parry
http://www.cartref.demon.co.uk/
Rears <[email protected]> writes
> I was looking at
>http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....protest.ap/in
>dex.html
>as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
>mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
>those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't English
>news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do the
>same same thing?
Of course they do. Most English speakers wouldn't know what sort of
urban feature "Museum Plein" is (though East Anglians might, as they've
got Bank Plain and University Plain in Norwich).
> It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs Wien,
>Munich vs Munchen...
That's because we don't speak Russian or German.
--
Arwel Parry
http://www.cartref.demon.co.uk/
Oct 4th 2004, 1:05 am
#8
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
"Arwel Parry" <[email protected]> kirjoitti viestissä
news:[email protected]...
> That's because we don't speak Russian or German.
But you do speak Finnish.
news:[email protected]...
> That's because we don't speak Russian or German.
But you do speak Finnish.
Oct 4th 2004, 5:33 am
#9
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
Because in English 'Square' is more understandable than 'Plein'. I
wouldn't have any problem with the unlikely prospect of French TV
talking about 'la place Trafalgar'.
As for the other, it isn't remotely puzzling. Some place names entered
the English language at a time when English-speaking people were more
likely to use them to other English-speakers than in the countries
concerned,and they stuck like it. For the same reason, other
languages' names for cities in other countries are also different from
those of natives, e.g., Moscou/Moskau/Moscova, Londres/Londra/Londen,
Edimbourg/Edimburgo, Venise/Venedig, Naples/Neapel, and so on.
PJW
On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 03:02:15 GMT, "Dennis G. Rears"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> I was looking at
>http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
>as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
>mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
>those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't English
>news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do the
>same same thing?
> It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs Wien,
>Munich vs Munchen...
>dennis
wouldn't have any problem with the unlikely prospect of French TV
talking about 'la place Trafalgar'.
As for the other, it isn't remotely puzzling. Some place names entered
the English language at a time when English-speaking people were more
likely to use them to other English-speakers than in the countries
concerned,and they stuck like it. For the same reason, other
languages' names for cities in other countries are also different from
those of natives, e.g., Moscou/Moskau/Moscova, Londres/Londra/Londen,
Edimbourg/Edimburgo, Venise/Venedig, Naples/Neapel, and so on.
PJW
On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 03:02:15 GMT, "Dennis G. Rears"
<[email protected]> wrote:
> I was looking at
>http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
>as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
>mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
>those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't English
>news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do the
>same same thing?
> It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs Wien,
>Munich vs Munchen...
>dennis
Oct 4th 2004, 9:10 am
#10
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
<[email protected]> schreef in bericht
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 4 Oct 2004 09:54:07 +0000 (UTC), Mike O'Sullivan
> <[email protected]> wrote:
> >Dennis G. Rears wrote:
> >> I was looking at
> >>
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
> >> as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
> >> mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
> >> those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein.
> >
> >There most definitely is a Dam Square. It's where the royal palace is.
> >Dam Square and Museumplein are two different places.
> Yes but locally it's called "Dam" not "Dam square"
Locally it is called "De Dam".
Sjoerd
news:[email protected]...
> On Mon, 4 Oct 2004 09:54:07 +0000 (UTC), Mike O'Sullivan
> <[email protected]> wrote:
> >Dennis G. Rears wrote:
> >> I was looking at
> >>
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
> >> as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
> >> mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
> >> those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein.
> >
> >There most definitely is a Dam Square. It's where the royal palace is.
> >Dam Square and Museumplein are two different places.
> Yes but locally it's called "Dam" not "Dam square"
Locally it is called "De Dam".
Sjoerd
Oct 4th 2004, 9:11 am
#11
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
On Mon, 4 Oct 2004 23:10:00 +0200, "Sjoerd" <[email protected]>
wrote:
><[email protected]> schreef in bericht
>news:[email protected].. .
>> On Mon, 4 Oct 2004 09:54:07 +0000 (UTC), Mike O'Sullivan
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >Dennis G. Rears wrote:
>> >> I was looking at
>> >>
>http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
>> >> as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
>> >> mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
>> >> those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein.
>> >
>> >There most definitely is a Dam Square. It's where the royal palace is.
>> >Dam Square and Museumplein are two different places.
>> Yes but locally it's called "Dam" not "Dam square"
>Locally it is called "De Dam".
Yes :-)
It says Dam on the map.
wrote:
><[email protected]> schreef in bericht
>news:[email protected].. .
>> On Mon, 4 Oct 2004 09:54:07 +0000 (UTC), Mike O'Sullivan
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>> >Dennis G. Rears wrote:
>> >> I was looking at
>> >>
>http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
>> >> as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
>> >> mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
>> >> those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein.
>> >
>> >There most definitely is a Dam Square. It's where the royal palace is.
>> >Dam Square and Museumplein are two different places.
>> Yes but locally it's called "Dam" not "Dam square"
>Locally it is called "De Dam".
Yes :-)
It says Dam on the map.
Oct 5th 2004, 7:10 am
#12
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
Dennis G. Rears wrote:
> "Miss L. Toe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>"Dennis G. Rears" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected] t...
>>> I was looking at
> http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
>
>>>as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
>>>mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
>>>those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't
>>English
>>>news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do
>
> the
>
>>>same same thing?
>>> It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs
>
> Wien,
>
>>>Munich vs Munchen...
>>Whales vs Cymru ....
>
>
> I don't speak Irish/Gaelic/Scottish?...
>
>
I imagine there was a big hint there as to which language it was...
..so you want Foreign places to be called by their local names if you
speak their language otherwise keep it in english ?
"Today's Railways" has an admirable policy of reporting on European
railways using their local names - Firenze, Muenchen, Ireland, London,
Berlin, Paris (does anyone ever translate French names?)...
> "Miss L. Toe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>"Dennis G. Rears" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected] t...
>>> I was looking at
> http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu....ap/index.html
>
>>>as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places they
>>>mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never heard of
>>>those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein. Why can't
>>English
>>>news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages do
>
> the
>
>>>same same thing?
>>> It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs
>
> Wien,
>
>>>Munich vs Munchen...
>>Whales vs Cymru ....
>
>
> I don't speak Irish/Gaelic/Scottish?...
>
>
I imagine there was a big hint there as to which language it was...
..so you want Foreign places to be called by their local names if you
speak their language otherwise keep it in english ?
"Today's Railways" has an admirable policy of reporting on European
railways using their local names - Firenze, Muenchen, Ireland, London,
Berlin, Paris (does anyone ever translate French names?)...
Oct 5th 2004, 8:12 am
#13
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
"Des O'Donoghue" <[email protected]> schreef in bericht
news:[email protected]...
> Paris (does anyone ever translate French names?)...
Sure. We Dutch call Paris Parijs and if I am not mistaken the Italians say
Parigi.
Sjoerd
news:[email protected]...
> Paris (does anyone ever translate French names?)...
Sure. We Dutch call Paris Parijs and if I am not mistaken the Italians say
Parigi.
Sjoerd
Oct 5th 2004, 9:03 am
#14
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
Des O'Donoghue <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:
> Dennis G. Rears wrote:
>
>> "Miss L. Toe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>>>"Dennis G. Rears" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>news:[email protected] et...
>>>> I was looking at
>>
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu...ds.protest.ap/
>> index.html
>>
>>>>as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places
>>>>they mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never
>>>>heard of those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein.
>>>>Why can't
>>>English
>>>>news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages
>>>>do
>>
>> the
>>
>>>>same same thing?
>>>> It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs
>>
>> Wien,
>>
>>>>Munich vs Munchen...
>>>Whales vs Cymru ....
>>
>>
>> I don't speak Irish/Gaelic/Scottish?...
>>
>>
> I imagine there was a big hint there as to which language it was...
>
> ..so you want Foreign places to be called by their local names if you
> speak their language otherwise keep it in english ?
>
> "Today's Railways" has an admirable policy of reporting on European
> railways using their local names - Firenze, Muenchen, Ireland, London,
> Berlin, Paris (does anyone ever translate French names?)...
>
English: Lyons for Lyon and Marseilles for Marseille, Rheims for Reims
news:[email protected]:
> Dennis G. Rears wrote:
>
>> "Miss L. Toe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>>>"Dennis G. Rears" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>news:[email protected] et...
>>>> I was looking at
>>
http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu...ds.protest.ap/
>> index.html
>>
>>>>as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places
>>>>they mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never
>>>>heard of those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein.
>>>>Why can't
>>>English
>>>>news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages
>>>>do
>>
>> the
>>
>>>>same same thing?
>>>> It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs
>>
>> Wien,
>>
>>>>Munich vs Munchen...
>>>Whales vs Cymru ....
>>
>>
>> I don't speak Irish/Gaelic/Scottish?...
>>
>>
> I imagine there was a big hint there as to which language it was...
>
> ..so you want Foreign places to be called by their local names if you
> speak their language otherwise keep it in english ?
>
> "Today's Railways" has an admirable policy of reporting on European
> railways using their local names - Firenze, Muenchen, Ireland, London,
> Berlin, Paris (does anyone ever translate French names?)...
>
English: Lyons for Lyon and Marseilles for Marseille, Rheims for Reims
Oct 5th 2004, 10:03 am
#15
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Amsterdam Protest (slightly OT) Names of places
jcoulter wrote:
> Des O'Donoghue <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>>Dennis G. Rears wrote:
>>>"Miss L. Toe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>>"Dennis G. Rears" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>>news:[email protected]. net...
>>>>> I was looking at
> http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu...ds.protest.ap/
>
>>>index.html
>>>>>as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places
>>>>>they mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never
>>>>>heard of those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein.
>>>>>Why can't
>>>>English
>>>>>news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages
>>>>>do the same same thing?
>>>>> It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs
>>>>>Wien, Munich vs Munchen... Whales vs Cymru ....
>>> I don't speak Irish/Gaelic/Scottish?...
>>I imagine there was a big hint there as to which language it was...
>>..so you want Foreign places to be called by their local names if you
>>speak their language otherwise keep it in english ?
>>"Today's Railways" has an admirable policy of reporting on European
>>railways using their local names - Firenze, Muenchen, Ireland, London,
>>Berlin, Paris (does anyone ever translate French names?)...
> English: Lyons for Lyon and Marseilles for Marseille, Rheims for Reims
I wonder if that dates back to when they owned much of the place?
> Des O'Donoghue <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>>Dennis G. Rears wrote:
>>>"Miss L. Toe" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>news:[email protected]...
>>>>"Dennis G. Rears" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>>news:[email protected]. net...
>>>>> I was looking at
> http://edition.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/eu...ds.protest.ap/
>
>>>index.html
>>>>>as was thinking "Cool" I've been there many times.... The places
>>>>>they mentioned were Museum Square and Dam Square. Huh? I've never
>>>>>heard of those places... Then I realized they meant Museum Plein.
>>>>>Why can't
>>>>English
>>>>>news organizations state the name of the place? Do other languages
>>>>>do the same same thing?
>>>>> It is still puzzling to me that we call Moscow vs Mosva, Vienna vs
>>>>>Wien, Munich vs Munchen... Whales vs Cymru ....
>>> I don't speak Irish/Gaelic/Scottish?...
>>I imagine there was a big hint there as to which language it was...
>>..so you want Foreign places to be called by their local names if you
>>speak their language otherwise keep it in english ?
>>"Today's Railways" has an admirable policy of reporting on European
>>railways using their local names - Firenze, Muenchen, Ireland, London,
>>Berlin, Paris (does anyone ever translate French names?)...
> English: Lyons for Lyon and Marseilles for Marseille, Rheims for Reims
I wonder if that dates back to when they owned much of the place?
