Marie Lewis

In article , Mark Hewitt
writes
    >Thats true. I've noticed (from hire companies anyway) it is present in all
    >models of cars in the USA. However it is an expensive extra with UK models.
Nit really: a lot of cars in the UK come with air-conditioning, even
little Kas.
--
Marie Lewis

Not The Karl Orff

In article ,
"John" wrote:

    > How widespread is air conditioning in European countries, both in the work
    > place and people's homes?
    >
    > Is it viewed as a luxury? or a "North American style" oddity, or just
    > another appliance that some people have and some don't.

If a/c is there, it isn;t set to very cool temps as you'd experience in
Asia and to a lesser extent, in N. America

The Reid

Following up to Marie Lewis

    >>Thats true. I've noticed (from hire companies anyway) it is present in all
    >>models of cars in the USA. However it is an expensive extra with UK models.

    > Nit really: a lot of cars in the UK come with air-conditioning, even
    >little Kas.

I think this is something that has changed very recently, 3 or 4 years
ago £1000 option, now often standard except maybe base models.
--
Mike Reid
"Art is the lie that reveals the truth" P.Picasso
Fellwalking, photos, London & the Thames path "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk"
Spain, food and walking "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" (see web for email)

Grey

On Fri, 30 May 2003 11:34:13 +0100, "John" wrote:

    >How widespread is air conditioning in European countries, both in the work
    >place and people's homes?
    >Is it viewed as a luxury? or a "North American style" oddity, or just
    >another appliance that some people have and some don't.

Very little real a/c in Europe; in hotels, even if they have it, it's
only token, enough to bring down temps 2-6 degrees only, usually. But
it's coming to be more widespread.

Donna Evleth

Dans l'article , grey
a écrit :


    > On Fri, 30 May 2003 11:34:13 +0100, "John" wrote:
    >>How widespread is air conditioning in European countries, both in the work
    >>place and people's homes?
    >>Is it viewed as a luxury? or a "North American style" oddity, or just
    >>another appliance that some people have and some don't.
    > Very little real a/c in Europe; in hotels, even if they have it, it's
    > only token, enough to bring down temps 2-6 degrees only, usually. But
    > it's coming to be more widespread.

We live in Paris. We do not have a/c at home. We live in an old building
with thick walls which insulate well, and we have found that an ordinary fan
does just fine on hot days. And in any case, the worst of the hot weather
comes in August, when we are elsewhere on vacation. Really unbearable hot
weather (from our point of view) comes so seldom and for so short a period
that a/c is not really worth the expense to us.

What we have had a problem with is a/c when we go to visit in the US. Last
year we went to Florida in January. The temperature was about 80 degrees,
but the humidity was not what you would usually expect from Florida, quite
low. However, all the public places were air conditioned to temperatures we
found uncomfortable. I would have enjoyed my stone crabs (which are a cold
dish) a lot more if I had not been freezing in the a/c. In our motel, we
always turned the a/c off when we were there, and opened the window. We
would go out for the day, come back, and find the a/c on again, set to
freezing, and the window closed. We would turn it off, open the window, and
wait for the room to warm up sufficiently for us to be comfortable.

I think that our experience both places simply indicates that the a/c
question all depends on what you are used to. Europeans don't like it as
cold as Americans do. It doesn't mean either one is wrong or inferior,
there are just different tastes.

Donna Evleth
    >

Stephen Dailey

In article ,
[email protected] says...
    >
    > "John" wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > How widespread is air conditioning in European countries, both in the work
    > > place and people's homes?
    >
    > In the UK.. can't comment about other countries.
    >
    > It is virtually unheard of here. Some of the larger and more modern offices
    > have it. And in large stores it will often be integrated as part of the
    > environmental systems.
    >
    > In peoples homes.. extremely rare. I don't know of anyone who has it. The
    > concentration is very definitely on heating, rather than cooling, as more
    > times than not - you need to warm the house up, rather than cool it down,
    > such is the climate in the UK. In the Summer, sufficient cooling can usually
    > be achieved by opening the windows.

When I delivered pizza for pocket money during college, I discovered that
people who lived in houses with a/c were good customers: around here, a/c
in a house generally means the inhabitants have more money than common
sense, and those people tend order a lot of pizza and tip well.

When I was in the UK many years ago, on several occasions I overheard
other Americans complaining about the weather, or at least homesick for
truly hot summer weather. It felt just like home to me.

===
Steve
Shoreline, Washington USA
[email protected]
30 May 2003, 1715 PDT

Mxsmanic

Donna Evleth writes:

    > Really unbearable hot weather (from our point of view)
    > comes so seldom and for so short a period
    > that a/c is not really worth the expense to us.

There was plenty of it today, and this is only May.

A/C doesn't cost anything if you don't use it.

    > I think that our experience both places simply
    > indicates that the a/c question all depends on what
    > you are used to. Europeans don't like it as
    > cold as Americans do.

Europeans are still on war rationing, too, so they see A/C is a decadent
luxury, rather than an obvious necessity.


--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.

Go Fig

In article ,
Mxsmanic wrote:

    > Donna Evleth writes:
    >
    > > Really unbearable hot weather (from our point of view)
    > > comes so seldom and for so short a period
    > > that a/c is not really worth the expense to us.
    >
    > There was plenty of it today, and this is only May.
    >
    > A/C doesn't cost anything if you don't use it.

The initial capital investment, especially in older structures is very
high. Cheap window box units (3,500 BTU ) are now like $150 though.

jay
Fri, May 30, 2003
mailto:[email protected]


    >
    > > I think that our experience both places simply
    > > indicates that the a/c question all depends on what
    > > you are used to. Europeans don't like it as
    > > cold as Americans do.
    >
    > Europeans are still on war rationing, too, so they see A/C is a decadent
    > luxury, rather than an obvious necessity.

--

Legend insists that as he finished his abject...
Galileo muttered under his breath: "Nevertheless, it does move."

Wolfgang Schwanke

"John" wrote in
news:[email protected]:

    > How widespread is air conditioning in European countries, both in the
    > work place and people's homes?

In Northern Europe, heating is rather more important than cooling, except
for a short period in mid-summer. So very few homes have air conditions. In
modern office buildings, department stores etc., some kind of large style
building-wide air conditioning which filters, moistens and circulates air
(but not so much cools it) is quite common, for some reason I don't quite
understand. Why not let people open the windows? Oh wait, you can't open
the windows in such buildings ...

In Southern Europe, air conditioning as a welcome form of cooling is very
widespread. E.g. in places such as Athens, practically all homes have a
visible a/c outlet next to the window.

    > Is it viewed as a luxury? or a "North American style" oddity, or just
    > another appliance that some people have and some don't.

Not generally, but the fact that homes in places with a northern climate
have is considered a "North American oddity". What's the point of cooling
in a cool climateß

Regards

--
Gültig für alle Staaten und Westberlin

http://www.wschwanke.de/

Mxsmanic

Wolfgang Schwanke writes:

    > In modern office buildings, department stores etc., some
    > kind of large style building-wide air conditioning which
    > filters, moistens and circulates air (but not so much cools it)
    > is quite common, for some reason I don't quite understand.
    > Why not let people open the windows? Oh wait, you can't open
    > the windows in such buildings ...

FWIW, large buildings must be usually be artificially cooled, even in
very cold climates.

    > What's the point of cooling in a cool climateß

It's not the climate that matters; it's the temperature each day.


--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.

Go Fig

In article ,
Mxsmanic wrote:

    > Wolfgang Schwanke writes:
    >
    > > In modern office buildings, department stores etc., some
    > > kind of large style building-wide air conditioning which
    > > filters, moistens and circulates air (but not so much cools it)
    > > is quite common, for some reason I don't quite understand.
    > > Why not let people open the windows? Oh wait, you can't open
    > > the windows in such buildings ...
    >
    > FWIW, large buildings must be usually be artificially cooled, even in
    > very cold climates.

That is because they take in such a small amount of fresh air, some HVAC
systems use less than 10%. Some say that is why we are seeing the 'sick
building' syndrome. Photocopiers being the principle suspects.

jay
Fri, May 30, 2003
mailto:[email protected]



    >
    > > What's the point of cooling in a cool climateß
    >
    > It's not the climate that matters; it's the temperature each day.

--

Legend insists that as he finished his abject...
Galileo muttered under his breath: "Nevertheless, it does move."

Wolfgang Schwanke

Mxsmanic wrote in
news:[email protected]:

    >> What's the point of cooling in a cool climateß
    >
    > It's not the climate that matters; it's the temperature each day.

Yes and no. When the climate is such that only for a couple of weeks per
year cooling is required, an air conditioning system will be idle most of
the time, and therefore considered an unnecessary luxury by most. You can
use a cheap fan for the days when you need cooling.

Regards

--
Gültig für alle Staaten und Westberlin

http://www.wschwanke.de/

Mxsmanic

Go Fig writes:

    > That is because they take in such a small amount
    > of fresh air, some HVAC systems use less than 10%.

In part, perhaps, but the main reason is just that large buildings
generate a lot of heat and radiate it only very slowly. In mild
climates, large buildings can be kept warm in winter just by installing
adequate insulation.


--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.

Mxsmanic

Wolfgang Schwanke writes:

    > When the climate is such that only for a couple
    > of weeks per year cooling is required, an air
    > conditioning system will be idle most of the time,
    > and therefore considered an unnecessary luxury
    > by most.

Odd that nobody feels this way about heating.

Air conditioning doesn't cost anything when it isn't running.

    > You can use a cheap fan for the days when you need cooling.

Fans provide air movement, not cooling.


--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.

Elaine

"Mxsmanic" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > Odd that nobody feels this way about heating.

In northern Europe (well the UK anyway) heating is a necessity for 6 or 7
months a year, whereas airconditioning might make life a bit more
comfortable for a couple of weeks a year - that's hardly the same thing.

    > Air conditioning doesn't cost anything when it isn't running.

Please tell me where I can get it installed for no cost.

    > Fans provide air movement, not cooling.

Moving air makes you feel cooler, that's why weather forecasts often take
into account the wind chill factor.

Elaine