Kruger Again

Old Jan 17th 2007, 5:45 am
  #1  
-Raymond
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Default Kruger Again

Hi,

We traveled to SA a few years ago taking some valuable information
from this group with us. It was such a good experience that we choose
to go again this year mainly to concentrate on Kruger and the
surrounding area which we briefly touched last time.

We stayed at a simple lodge just outside the park that was fine, not a
10 star but ok. My question is why is the price of the Private Game
Reserve Lodges so high? Relative to the "normal" lodges around the
park and near the gates, are these other places that good?

Cheers, Ray and thanks for the 2005's advice.
 
Old Jan 17th 2007, 5:24 pm
  #2  
Corn
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Default Re: Kruger Again

> We stayed at a simple lodge just outside the park that was fine, not a
> 10 star but ok. My question is why is the price of the Private Game
> Reserve Lodges so high? Relative to the "normal" lodges around the
> park and near the gates, are these other places that good?
>
> Cheers, Ray and thanks for the 2005's advice.


Lodges in private nature reserves (especially those with the Big-5 and open
link to Kruger) are more expensive then other lodges in places as
Hazyview-Hoedspruit-Phalaborwa. For me this makes sense: with only 8-16
guests maximum hearing lions at night and doing game drives is more exciting
then hearing the traffic or the neighbour's dog bark.

Prices vary from R400 (basic and rustic) to R3000 (5 stars and you will see
the Big-5 in 2 game drives guaranteed). Maybe also because beeing in the
unspoilt nature, with all the animals there becomes a rare thing these days.
And rare things happen to become more and more expensive.

Regards from the bush,

Corné.

www.amukela.com
 
Old Jan 19th 2007, 9:11 pm
  #3  
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Default Re: Kruger Again

In article <[email protected]>, "Corné"
<[email protected]> wrote:

> Prices vary from R400 (basic and rustic) to R3000 (5 stars and you will see
> the Big-5 in 2 game drives guaranteed). Maybe also because beeing in the
> unspoilt nature, with all the animals there becomes a rare thing these days.
> And rare things happen to become more and more expensive.


Also: privately owned is just that: there is no government support like
there is in Kruger proper.

--
-Glennl
The despammed service works OK, but unfortunately
now the spammers grab addresses for use as "from" address too!
e-mail hint: add 1 to quantity after gl to get 4317.
 
Old Jan 20th 2007, 7:20 pm
  #4  
Corn
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Default Re: Kruger Again

<[email protected]> schreef in bericht
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>, "Corné"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Prices vary from R400 (basic and rustic) to R3000 (5 stars and you will
see
> > the Big-5 in 2 game drives guaranteed). Maybe also because beeing in the
> > unspoilt nature, with all the animals there becomes a rare thing these
days.
> > And rare things happen to become more and more expensive.
>
>
> Also: privately owned is just that: there is no government support like
> there is in Kruger proper.
>

Also: because it is privately owned, and as soon as my neighbour hear the
lions at 22:00, we go for a real night drive! And believe me we can manage
our own reserves without government support!

Privately owned means also owning a great investement! Prices have rocketed
since 2002.

Bushregards,

Corné.

www.amukela.com
 
Old Jan 20th 2007, 10:05 pm
  #5  
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Kruger Again

It's expensive for private game reserves to keep the nostalgic myth of
Edenic, pre-human "unspoilt nature" maintained and up to the ever
rising levels of competitive fantasy in the marketplace.

Like sweet confections they're pleasing -- even delightful -- but in
the end, they're artificial and can cause rot. The reality is that
wildlife and people have been inseparable across nearly all of Africa
for thousands of years, and that Kruger and private reserves were
created in the last century in South Africa by kicking local people off
(with token compensation coming only in the last decade or so). Yes,
it's nice to see animals without someone else's car idling beside you,
but recognize that you're paying for fantasy in either case -- just a
bit more for a bit more splendid fantasy in a private reserve.

This, of course, links to a hoary rant about what kicking the local
people off did to their lives and cultures, which I'd be inclined to
ignore in this NG were it not for the smug comment about "owning a
great investment" and the fact that the person who made it may well
benefit from hearing part of the rant in any case. One hidden aspect of
the hollowness of the safari fantasy is that the tourism industry is
99.2% white owned in South Africa, and is the least changed since the
end of apartheid (1994) among the top industrial sectors in the country
in terms of ownership, earnings and governance. How much pride ought
one feel in not needing government support -- what about lodge staff
and their families? People in the nearby town? Are they living happily
without government support? Or are their private safari lodge wages
enough to feed, clothe, and pay the school fees and healthcare for
their dependents? Especially you, Corn� -- you're a Dutchman and less
than 3 years a resident in Africa. The locals here aren't simply a
passive background of movie extras for you to 'give up the good life'
back in Holland and come play out your Hemingway or Robert Redford
fantasies of a life in the African bush that you sell back to Europeans
at a tidy profit. Understand the context of your adopted country and
show a bit of humility, please, for your own good fortune and out of
respect for those who don't share it.

By all means let's assist and encourage people in this NG to come to
Africa and enjoy the wildlife, landscapes, cultures and people. A bit
of fantasy is what a good holiday needs, and there's no harm in that as
long as it's in balance. But don't bring a bunch of uninformed,
self-congratulatory superiority crap into the thread too, without
expecting to get an earful.

Kurt

Corn� wrote:
> <[email protected]> schreef in bericht
> news:[email protected]...
> > In article <[email protected]>, "Corn�"
> > <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > Prices vary from R400 (basic and rustic) to R3000 (5 stars and you will
> see
> > > the Big-5 in 2 game drives guaranteed). Maybe also because beeing in the
> > > unspoilt nature, with all the animals there becomes a rare thing these
> days.
> > > And rare things happen to become more and more expensive.
> >
> >
> > Also: privately owned is just that: there is no government support like
> > there is in Kruger proper.
> >
>
> Also: because it is privately owned, and as soon as my neighbour hear the
> lions at 22:00, we go for a real night drive! And believe me we can manage
> our own reserves without government support!
>
> Privately owned means also owning a great investement! Prices have rocketed
> since 2002.
>
> Bushregards,
>
> Corn�.
>
> www.amukela.com
 
Old Jan 21st 2007, 5:04 am
  #6  
Scott Elliot
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Default Re: Kruger Again

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected] ups.com...
................rant..................... One hidden aspect of
the hollowness of the safari fantasy is that the tourism industry is
99.2% white owned in South Africa, and is the least changed since the
end of apartheid (1994) among the top industrial sectors in the country
in terms of ownership, earnings and governance. ...................more
rant..............................

Kurt,

Since the end of apartied the official goal of South African government has
been that there are no white, black or coloured South Africans, just South
Africans. Are you advocating the return of another form of racism?

Hopefully South Africa can progress toward a society of racial equality
without resorting to the discrimination you appear to be advocating. South
Africa has much more serious and important things to deal with than the
colour of the skin of a few game park owners.

Scott
 
Old Jan 21st 2007, 6:38 am
  #7  
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Default Re: Kruger Again

Scott Elliot wrote:
> <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected] ups.com...
> ................rant..................... One hidden aspect of
> the hollowness of the safari fantasy is that the tourism industry is
> 99.2% white owned in South Africa, and is the least changed since the
> end of apartheid (1994) among the top industrial sectors in the country
> in terms of ownership, earnings and governance. ...................more
> rant..............................
>
> Kurt,
>
> Since the end of apartied the official goal of South African government has
> been that there are no white, black or coloured South Africans, just South
> Africans. Are you advocating the return of another form of racism?
>
> Hopefully South Africa can progress toward a society of racial equality
> without resorting to the discrimination you appear to be advocating. South
> Africa has much more serious and important things to deal with than the
> colour of the skin of a few game park owners.
>
> Scott

Scott -- clearly you don't live in South Africa if you're willing to
post such a naive statement of race, discrimination, transformation and
equality in this country (I leave aside your mis-spelling of apartheid
as further evidence of this fact). "A few game park owners" is a
trivial element of the issue at hand. Having the goal of a raceless
country is very different from the practical policies needed to change
entrenched interests in order to get to that goal. Ends ain't means. I
can recommend you look at http://www.tourismbeecharter.co.za and more
broadly the DTI's national strategy on BBBEE ("South Africa's
Economic Transformation: A Strategy for Broad-Based Black Economic
Empowerment"), a copy of which is at www.thedti.gov.za or
http://bee.sabinet.co.za/charters/bee_strategy_document.pdf. If you
think these issues aren't central to many of South Africa's other
socio-economic and health problems, a quick read of those documents and
websites will clarify the links for you.

Scoff and trivialize it if you like, but for companies that ignore the
carrot now, the stick will come regardless. Being compliant with the
tourism BBBEE scorecard will become a prerequisite for competing in the
SA tourism industry in just a few years. Right now, it is a
differentiator, a benefit to forward-thinking companies who are leaders
in trying to make a difference (similar to Fair Trade in Tourism
designation - www.fairtourismsa.org.za). In time, non-compliant
companies won't be able to compete and will struggle to stay in
business -- not only won't government funded organisations be able to
assist them (e.g., no membership in a local tourism bureau or listings
on national portals are both likely steps to be taken in later stages
of the program), but companies doing business with them will be
penalized as well on their own scorecard compliance, so it's not just a
lack of direct and indirect government support that's at issue but
industry suppliers, service providers, etc. that will create negative
pressure too.

Also, what tourist would want to go to a game reserve that doesn't
support the national consensus on ethical business practice in the
industry? Do you think the NGOs won't create blacklists and put
pressure on the big online travel agencies and portals as well as the
tour operators and travel agents to refuse to do business with
non-compliant companies? What consumer travel lifestyle media will
write glowing reviews and features about non-compliant destinations?
Why would a tourist choose to go on holiday to a place with such
stigma? There are many, many private reserves that will be compliant.
With tourists currently concerned about the ethics of long haul air
travel's negative environmental impact (and actively paying for "carbon
balancing"), one would be naive to think that these central social
issues won't affect the marketplace too.

Kurt
 
Old Jan 21st 2007, 6:42 pm
  #8  
Corn
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Kruger Again

By all means let's assist and encourage people in this NG to come to
Africa and enjoy the wildlife, landscapes, cultures and people.

Hear hear! And a good and not expensive way is to visit Amukela Game Lodge,
owner managed and maximum accommodating 8 guests at once. Authenthic
township visits can be arranged on request. We also visit Thomas' (one of
our staff memebers) house, which he built himself.

After staying in the unspoilt bush (yesterday the Elephants were at my
waterhole) you will understand the Hemingway of Africa!

Bushregards,

Corné.

www.amukela.com
 
Old Jan 21st 2007, 6:47 pm
  #9  
Corn
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Default Re: Kruger Again

"Scott Elliot" <[email protected]> schreef in bericht
news:9XNsh.173359$YV4.104729@edtnps89...
> <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected] ups.com...
> ................rant..................... One hidden aspect of
> the hollowness of the safari fantasy is that the tourism industry is
> 99.2% white owned in South Africa, and is the least changed since the
> end of apartheid (1994) among the top industrial sectors in the country
> in terms of ownership, earnings and governance. ...................more
> rant..............................
>
> Kurt,
>
> Since the end of apartied the official goal of South African government
has
> been that there are no white, black or coloured South Africans, just South
> Africans. Are you advocating the return of another form of racism?
>
> Hopefully South Africa can progress toward a society of racial equality
> without resorting to the discrimination you appear to be advocating.
South
> Africa has much more serious and important things to deal with than the
> colour of the skin of a few game park owners.


I 100% agree. When busy in the process of immigration to SA, the government
official which I dealt with made it clear that SA is waiting for young
entrepeneurs, who are willing to invest large amounts in the tourism
industry.

As for mentioning the color, typical for an American who doesn't look around
in his own country, what happened and still happens.

Colour is no longer an issue anymore in the new South Africa, creating jobs
is however. And since my arrival and after building up from scratch my
lodge, a lot of locals were employed (and still are until now).

What have you done for SA Kurt? Instead of playing Mr. Moral?

Corné.

www.amukela.com
 
Old Jan 21st 2007, 6:50 pm
  #10  
Corn
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Kruger Again

Kurt,

think you are missing the point here...? Look at the original post!

In stead of making everything political, better is that you contribute
something more then big words to this country!!

However... regards from the sunny bush in Africa

Corné.

www.amukela.com
 
Old Jan 21st 2007, 11:10 pm
  #11  
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Kruger Again

Corn� wrote:
> By all means let's assist and encourage people in this NG to come to
> Africa and enjoy the wildlife, landscapes, cultures and people.
>
> Hear hear! And a good and not expensive way is to visit Amukela Game Lodge,
> owner managed and maximum accommodating 8 guests at once. Authenthic
> township visits can be arranged on request. We also visit Thomas' (one of
> our staff memebers) house, which he built himself.
>
> After staying in the unspoilt bush (yesterday the Elephants were at my
> waterhole) you will understand the Hemingway of Africa!
>
> Bushregards,
>
> Corn�.
>
> www.amukela.com

This is exactly the kind of problem faced by the industry in SA: "Come
to our lovely game reserve, where you can visit the waterhole and see
the animals, then visit the township and see the natives."

We've got to do better than this! I don't doubt your intentions,
Corn�, just your means.

Kurt
 
Old Jan 21st 2007, 11:26 pm
  #12  
Guest
 
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Default Re: Kruger Again

Corn� wrote:

> Colour is no longer an issue anymore in the new South Africa

The above statement is pure nonsense, and I defy you to justify it with
a factual argument. If you care to do so, I suggest a new thread.

Kurt
 
Old Jan 21st 2007, 11:48 pm
  #13  
Corn
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Default Re: Kruger Again

<[email protected]> schreef in bericht
news:[email protected] ups.com...
Corné wrote:

> Colour is no longer an issue anymore in the new South Africa

The above statement is pure nonsense, and I defy you to justify it with
a factual argument.

Thabo Mbeki, the ANC, DA, IFP, Desmond Tutu etc. etc. all mention this every
time again on public holidays.

Corné
 
Old Jan 21st 2007, 11:51 pm
  #14  
Corn
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Posts: n/a
Default Re: Kruger Again

This is exactly the kind of problem faced by the industry in SA: "Come
to our lovely game reserve, where you can visit the waterhole and see
the animals, then visit the township and see the natives."

You mention the local people as 'natives'.... not so nice. A lot of people
are interrested in the culture and how local tribes such as the Shangane
live.

What is the problem with that?

Corné.
 
Old Jan 21st 2007, 11:52 pm
  #15  
Corn
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: Kruger Again

Kurt wrote: "and that Kruger and private reserves were
created in the last century in South Africa by kicking local people off"

The above statement is pure nonsense, and I defy you to justify it with
a factual argument. If you care to do so, I suggest a new thread.

Corné.
 

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